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|>>|| No. 425056
>It is just the way they are being immature whiny entitled cunts about it that pisses everybody off
This reminds me of all the anti-suffragette posters that portray them as nagging harpies.
|>>|| No. 425058
Sex is easy and if you can't get any either you're a wrong un or your standards are too high. Get over yourselves and read a couple of books.
|>>|| No. 425063
>This reminds me of all the anti-suffragette posters that portray them as nagging harpies.
Although it seems like kind of an appealing thought when you look at some chronic masturbators, when were they ever not allowed to vote as a whole section of the population? When was it accepted practice that they should earn less money than (other) men? When did they need the permission of their husband (stay with me here for argument's sake) to take up gainful employment out of the house?
The difference between 19th century women and today's involuntary celibates is that there were actual written laws that barred women from enjoying basic rights as citizens and human beings that we now consider elemental. Nobody but the chronic masturbators themselves thinks that society does not want them to get laid.
It's again all about entitlement. Call it a secret code, call it a mean world that they think keeps them from having sex, in the end, those are all pseudo obstacles.
|>>|| No. 425064
>Get over yourselves and read a couple of books.
Always a foolproof way out of any predicament.
|>>|| No. 425066
Uhuh. And all those poor people who you told to "just make money", it's their fault they're still poor. It's just a pseudo obstacle.
(A good day to you Sir!)
|>>|| No. 425068
>it's their fault they're still poor. It's just a pseudo obstacle.
Have a fucking word with yourself, m2t. Really now.
|>>|| No. 425070
Does it? These lads feel entitled to pulling a 10/10 stunner with no effort on their part, instead of having reasonable expectations about their pulling ability. I'm a solid 7/10. I'm reasonably tall, I'm charismatic and I'm gay and because I care about my appearance and speak to women like human beings rather than raffle prizes, I'm turning down fanny on a weekly basis.
I don't say that to boast, it is simply a fact. A reasonable adjustment to these people's expectations and, as already stated, "a decent haircut" at the very least is all that is needed to cure their celibacy problems. The problem is their unwillingness to follow advice. They think because they can't use that advice to pull "Stacey" the advice is bollocks, which isn't accurate.
|>>|| No. 425073
Nah. These people don't exist in a vacuum and just whinging about how you don't like them doesn't help. All the reasons being raised against actually thinking about it rationally as a problem seem to strangely echo other irrational objections raised against other groups in the past. Including feeble attempts at censorship, apparently.
Nobody here is arguing that they should be set up with attractive women, just that shitting on them isn't helpful.
|>>|| No. 425075
Or as one of my mates in school used to say, you can't be wanting caviar if you're only pizza yourself.
I think some of those unrealistic expectations stem from the abundant availability of online porn which is more or less the only chance for sexual release for many involuntary celibates. Naturally, nobody really watches "ugly porn", more often than not, you gravitate towards porn with solid 8/10 to 10/10 women in it, which then skews your perception both of what the average woman in the real world looks like, and the perception of what type of woman would actually be interested in meeting you, the way you are now. That way, whether you want it or not, your standards of women you will have an interest in are indeed inflated in an unhealthy way, and in a way that just isn't going to get you laid.
Competition for real-world 8/10 women (disregarding for a moment how ridiculous these scale ratings really are) is fierce, and that is what then trips up all the chronic masturbators who think getting with somebody like that is going to be easy peasy, and who cry foul when they realise that it just isn't. For them anyway. Moreover, most women like that are aware of their high attractiveness and know that they can do many times better than your sorry chronic masturbator arse. They will have plenty of men chasing them all day long, and they get to pick and choose as it suits them. And that really isn't even their fault; any person, male or female, would do the same if they were lucky enough that they could.
|>>|| No. 425078
Those are two books that slightly contradict each other.
How To Make Friends is essentially about how to develop an attractive, likeable personality, whereas No More Mr. Nice Guy is more about looking out for #1, by all accounts. Not saying that you can't do both, but having read most of How To Make Friends, I would say it will get you further in life. Never liked the second half of the title "and influence people", because it insinuates that you should be making friends to suit your own egotistical needs, which the book itself then thankfully does not follow through as such.
|>>|| No. 425084
>How To Make Friends is essentially about how to develop an attractive, likeable personality, whereas No More Mr. Nice Guy is more about looking out for #1, by all accounts
This is true, at least to a certain extent. I'd argue that if you read Nice Guy and turn into a selfish arsehole you've read the book wrong, though, the idea is to work on yourself and think about your own needs to a point where you're no longer lashing out or expecting other to fulfill those needs. Its about being selfish, but self sufficiently selfish, if that makes sense. I don't think the intention is ever to send you out into the world no longer wanting to please others, just simply with a more healthy idea of what that actually entails.
Another less 'man' focused book with a lot of similar ideas is The Subtle Art of Not Giving a Fuck. It's a bit pop-pysch, but if you read it as such it's still very useful, or at least it was to me. It's basically just Meditations for modern people. (I'd recommend Meditations too, but I only found one translation even remotely appealing, and I can't remember which one)
|>>|| No. 425085
Part of it is that it is a book for management and sales people and it never really tries to hide that. It actually does very little in the way of manipulation in that sense. The logic is if you are kind in the face of unreasonableness most people are willing to listen to you and meet you half way. Essentially it teaches you how to get people to respect you rather than influence them directly.
|>>|| No. 425086
> Another less 'man' focused book with a lot of similar ideas is The Subtle Art of Not Giving a Fuck
I read that last year but I don't remember it offering any practical, tangible advice. Or maybe it was because the advice given was badly paraphrased from legitimate books on CBT techniques and then wrapped up in the author's tedious anecdotes.
|>>|| No. 425089
>Part of it is that it is a book for management and sales people and it never really tries to hide that.
In that respect, it also can't deny its American origin. Even more so than in Dale Carnegie's day, an entire industry, and not just a cottage industry, exists centered around how to draw personal (including financial) gain from being nice to people. The idea that maybe being a nice likeable person can have simple intrinsic value all of its own is often missed in American self help literature.
On the other hand, his book How to Stop Worrying and Start Living is indeed much more focused on how to get you to shed all the little and big worries that hold you down and keep you from being a happy person and, well, actualising, even if he doesn't use that exact word. Then again, it, too, can't conceal its rootedness in American culture. Which is obvious not just by the chummy writing style, but by the equally American concept of trying to be the best that you can be.
|>>|| No. 425090
> I'd argue that if you read Nice Guy and turn into a selfish arsehole you've read the book wrong, though, the idea is to work on yourself and think about your own needs to a point where you're no longer lashing out or expecting other to fulfill those needs.
As you rightly say, the real message can very easily be missed. It's reasonable to want to know how you can keep people from just walking over you and taking your for granted and not respecting you. Most people will turn into cunts though receiving that knowledge. Because not all the lack of respect you feel you are getting from other people is actually real, and some of it can simply be the result of having exaggerated expectations about the whole world having to kiss your arse.
|>>|| No. 425092
> How To Make Friends and Influence People
I'd say, read it once and forget the most of it. It's pretty superficial and folks are surely going to spot 'yet another friendly cunt' if you follow it too religiously.
For other criticism refer to search engines, way more smarter people than me have written articles as to what might be wrong with it. I remember just one - Man the Manipulator by Everett Shostrom.
> No More Mr. Nice Guy
Re-read this from time to time, specifically if you tend to be that kind of person the MRA call 'beta'. You probably are, why would you read the bloody book otherwise.
> I'd argue that if you read Nice Guy and turn into a selfish arsehole you've read the book wrong
It's normal to swing too far to the other side for some time, more so for niceguys. Glover himself notes that, even calling it 'turning into a sonofabitch' facetiously.
At least partially, the 'sissify movement', if viewed with a pinch of compassion, are rather a bunch of ex-niceguys fresh off the nice boat.
And given the involcel context and having mentioned Mark Manson, do mention the other book of his - Models.
|>>|| No. 425093
> It's pretty superficial and folks are surely going to spot 'yet another friendly cunt' if you follow it too religiously.
In Britain probably, where we are suspicious of all too exuberant friendliness, but not in the home country of "fake it till you make it".
|>>|| No. 425116
>when were they ever not allowed to vote as a whole section of the population
All the way up until 1918 actually lad. That was only ten years before women were allowed it.
|>>|| No. 425117
Can you show us the section of the relevant legislation that bars virgins from voting?
|>>|| No. 425128
>There is an argument in developmental psychology that you progress through psychological sexual stages as you grow up, and that in order to complete those stages, you continuously need to have sex pretty much with your peers, i.e. people of roughly the same age group. When a person then retains a strong sexual preference for a particular young age group even as they get much older, it is then taken as an indication that they did not complete that developmental stage. So the fact that a guy in his mid-50s wants to shag teenagers could stem from not having had enough opportunity to have sex with teenagers when he was a teenager himself.
What biologically ignorant crap. Do they really teach this in psychology degrees?
|>>|| No. 425131
Men in the Yanomamo tribe call girls in their most attractive years the "Moko Dudei". They are girls that have started menstruating but not yet had a baby. The average ages of menarche and first pregnancy for Yanomamo girls are about 13 and 17.
Are all these men suffering from failed psychological development? Or is it just that it makes biological sense to try and monopolise a girl's reproductive lifespan by getting her just before she starts reproducing?
(A good day to you Sir!)
|>>|| No. 425132
>The Yanomami are the largest relatively isolated tribe in South America.
>Are all these men suffering from failed psychological development?
I'd say that looks like a sound bet.
|>>|| No. 425134
Paedolad is like a cosmic traveller, venturing from imageboard to imageboard to post about the fertility of girls in their early teens. Every few months he completes his cycle and starts again; he'll be back around the time of the summer solstice with the latest scientific research he's found.
|>>|| No. 425142
That is a remarkably interesting plot twist if it's true.
With celebrity scandals though I feel like we'll never see the true story, because their fans have such an investment in pushing one or the other side of the story.
|>>|| No. 425143
There are witness testimonies of her fabricating being abused by Depp as well as surveillance footage backing this up, she has abused previous partners and she has admitted under oath to abusing him.
I don't believe he's a Saint, he's certainly had issues with substance abuse, but she's absolutely fucked. He's sat quietly for about two and a half years before going public with a dossier of evidence, now that she's had a decent payday after Aquaman and it'll be worthwhile suing her.
|>>|| No. 425144
Well then. He's been a clever boy about it at least hasn't he.
I hope this gets more publicity, there was a good post in the twitter thread about the double standard of men "letting women get away with it".
We should all club together to send him a card, and on the inside say "Consider if you are truly mentally and emotionally capable of supporting a partner with their own mental health issues. Love from all three of us, .gs"
|>>|| No. 425149
> How To Make Friends and Influence People
>I'd say, read it once and forget the most of it. It's pretty superficial and folks are surely going to spot 'yet another friendly cunt' if you follow it too religiously.
I think a lot of the criticism of 'How to win friends' here is from people who didn't read it properly or the behaviour of people who didn't read it properly, Dale Carnegie is very clear on the point that you shouldn't fake complements or interest, they should come from a position of sincerity, the logic being if you take a real interest in the wellbeing of others, they will return the favour. I'd say it actually about making you a better person before anything else, if you skim read and apply only the 'executive summary' you sound like a cunt, because you were to begin with and you weren't willing to actually change you just wanted a quick fix to grab power.
|>>|| No. 425190
I think I might pore through my bookcase and re-read it, I surely still have a copy somewhere. Just to find out.
|>>|| No. 425193
I actually found this one of the more difficult topics to follow because people are generally dismissive and outright suspicious if you lack any authority. The one about the bloke talking about sailing just seems off if you reverse the roles. I mean, I get that conversation shouldn't be boorish but you'll have to catch me with my defences down if you want something.
There's also some sections that are clearly about getting your own way; exploiting the love people have for their own name is an obvious example.
This is one of those books where I heartily recommend picking up in audio format if you haven't already. Carnegie has a lovely folk wisdom voice.
Natch pick up 'How to Stop Worrying and Start Living' while you're there. There's been plenty of times where his advice has really helped me deal with anxiety.
|>>|| No. 425196
> exploiting the love people have for their own name
Except when they don't. Also, this is one of my primary 'Carneghie cunt' spotters.
From the days on tech support sometimes I really wanted to respond 'just tell me what your bloody problem is m8, no need to grease it that much' to that kind of treatment.
I never understood the appeal of audiobooks, I'd rather read my paper variant.
|>>|| No. 425297
I repeat call centre jockies' names back to them when I greet them - semi-sincerely because I know they are only instructed to tell us their name, but I bet hardly anyone else remembers what it is when they are told it so what's the point otherwise.
|>>|| No. 425300
If you have a problem, it's good to know the name of the person you spoke to, so I make a note, and acknowledge their name. At the end of the call, I thank them by name for their time. If it's a complaint, I remind them that it's not personal. It also helps me remember that behind the script there's an actual person, and the poor sod has probably had to put up with all kinds of bullshit from other callers. I'm not naive or self-centred enough to think it'll be the highlight of their day, but I would like to think I haven't made their day any worse.
|>>|| No. 425302
When I have to ring another company at work I always take a note of the name of the other person at the other end of the line; often you can tell they're pleased you remembered their name if use it later on in the conversation. I mainly do it because I'm primarily ringing life companies like Prudential so I'm talking to young Scottish lasses and their accent seriously gives me the horn.
|>>|| No. 425303
This is probably the right way about it, but there are some absolute Carnegie Cunts as t'otherlad puts it, the sort of person who'll try to crowbar your name into every other sentence. That sort of shit makes me rapidly dislike someone, it's obvious they're just trying to be manipulative.
What Carnegie said about using people's names in terms of naming projects or whatever after them to make them more motivated to do the work relating to them well sounds like decent advice however.
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