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>> No. 25756 Anonymous
19th September 2022
Monday 4:05 pm
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Just bought a new PC. My last one wasn't good enough to run GTA 4. I've missed the last 14 years of games. Where do I start, lads?

I'm thinking GTA 4 and 5, Far Cry 4, 5 and 6, Crysis 2 and 3, then Homeworld: Deserts of Kharak. Where are we to with Total War?
Expand all images.
>> No. 25757 Anonymous
19th September 2022
Monday 4:39 pm
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>Where do I start, lads?

Get an Epic Games account. They give away two free games per week, many of which are proper AAA titles.


I'd suggest taking a look at Disco Elysium, Elden Ring, Fallout: New Vegas and Subnautica.
>> No. 25758 Anonymous
19th September 2022
Monday 5:33 pm
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Game Pass for PC might be worth a try. Lots of decent stuff on there, and quite a few games come straight to Game Pass day one of their release (mostly Microsoft and their owned studios developed stuff).
>> No. 25759 Anonymous
19th September 2022
Monday 8:19 pm
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Prepare for the realization that you're now an adult too old for computer gaming.
>> No. 25760 Anonymous
20th September 2022
Tuesday 1:43 pm
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I think I'll enjoy looking at some of the pretty renderings.
>> No. 25761 Anonymous
20th September 2022
Tuesday 4:35 pm
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>Where are we to with Total War?

If you like the historical ones, Rome 2 is possibly one of the best value for money games if all time. It had a shaky start and a bad reputation on release but frankly I think it's the best one they've done in the past 10 years or so. Personally though I think the last truly great one was Medieval 2 or possibly Napoleon. Nine of the Shogun ones ever gripped me because I'm not a week and it's so boring fighting basically identical armies.

Saying that, though, the history ones really are the side-games of the series now, and the Star of the show is Warhammer. You can tell they'd really run out of ideas with the historical ones, butjumping to a fantasy setting really worked wonders for the series. If you getW the chance, pick up Total War: Warhammer 1 2 and 3 on sale, so then you can play the Immortal Empires campaign in 3. It is, put simply, the best Total War ever made.

Other games of the last decade that are probably "must plays" are the Souls series, Witcher 3 (I didn't really rate it but everyone seems to love it so ehh), obviously Skyrim and all the mods you can throw at it, the Doom reboots, the Mass Effect trilogy, the X-Coms, the Dragon Ages, the Deus Exes... Okay maybe not all must plays but there have been a lot of good games through the 2010s.
>> No. 25762 Anonymous
20th September 2022
Tuesday 5:02 pm
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I'm thinking these then:

Disco Elysium
Cyberpunk 2077
Red Deads
Assassins Creeds
Fallout: New Vegas
Watchdogs: Legion
GTA 4, 5
Far Cry 4, 5 and 6
Crysis Remastered, 2 and 3
Homeworld: Deserts of Kharak
Total War: Warhammers for the Immortal Empires campaign
Skyrim + mods
Deus Exes
Sea of Thieves

What's with VR goggles? Worth a punt?
>> No. 25763 Anonymous
20th September 2022
Tuesday 6:44 pm
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VR is good if you have the room for it, and a decent GPU. I have a fairly cramped gaming space, and my GPU is the GTX 1060 which is now on the weaker end of gaming GPUs. I had the Oculus Rift S, I could run Half Life Alyx alright, but stuff like Boneworks and The Walking Dead didn't really work so well due to weak PC and/or lack of room. If I'm honest, there aren't a lot of VR games right now that are so good they justify the price of the headsets.
>> No. 25764 Anonymous
20th September 2022
Tuesday 7:34 pm
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>If I'm honest, there aren't a lot of VR games right now that are so good they justify the price of the headsets.
If you're a furry get it for VRChat basically, if you just want to game it's not worth it
>> No. 25766 Anonymous
20th September 2022
Tuesday 10:05 pm
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>What's with VR goggles? Worth a punt?

That depends on how much you like simulation games and/or pornography. A game like Assetto Corsa, Dirt Rally or Microsoft Flight Simulator is a vastly better experience in VR.

Meta Quest has loads of physically active games that really benefit from the lack of cables - it's as much a piece of gym equipment as a gaming platform. There aren't many PC games that take full advantage of roomscale VR yet, I think because PC VR is still a bit cumbersome and niche.
>> No. 25767 Anonymous
21st September 2022
Wednesday 12:27 am
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>What's with VR goggles? Worth a punt?

I've got a Quest 2, the roomscale stuff is amazing if you've got space for it.

The cardio workout games like pistol whip, superhot and beatsaber are great but other than that most of the best titles seem to be the VR ports of older games. Resident evil 4 VR is fucking amazing and I'd definitely recommend re-playing Myst in VR.

At the moment a lot of new games made exclusively for VR aren't that expensive on the quest but a lot of the time you don't actually get much content for your money and they feel more like tech demos.
That's not to say they're bad games but £20 for a 6 hour puzzle game with minimal replayability or a flight sim that's just endless randomly generated permutations of the same ten missions on the same five maps seems like a bit much IMO. I imagine that'll change in the future though as VR gets more affordable (and it's still totally worth it just for resident evil and superhot).
>> No. 25768 Anonymous
21st September 2022
Wednesday 1:03 am
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>I'd definitely recommend re-playing Myst in VR.
OP just spent what was possibly thousands on a new computer and you're telling him to play 1993's most boringest game.
>> No. 25769 Anonymous
21st September 2022
Wednesday 2:27 am
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VR is weird. You aren't watching a thing on a screen, you are in a place, which totally changes what is and isn't a compelling experience. I'm absolutely obsessed with Eleven Table Tennis, because it's just table tennis. All of the cheeky trick shots I learned during my misspent youth just work. I didn't have to learn to play it, because I already know how to play table tennis. It's not really a computer game, it's just a means of having a table tennis table in your living room with an endless queue of skill-matched opponents.

Walkabout Mini Golf would be a ridiculous idea on any other platform. Crazy golf is just too trivial, but it works in VR and it's not really because of the golf. The environments are low-poly, but they're beautifully drawn and incredibly soothing. The crazy golf part is just an excuse to spend half an hour in a really relaxing environment. Your conscious brain knows that it's just a game, but some part of your limbic system feels like you've spent half an hour in a nice place. Sometimes I'll just stop playing and sit down for a bit, have a look at the trees, listen to the birdsong.

I haven't played Myst VR, but I can totally see why it would be a compelling experience - the thing that the developers of Myst were trying to achieve is exactly the forte of VR. They didn't make a particularly good game, but they made some lovely environments.
>> No. 25770 Anonymous
21st September 2022
Wednesday 5:38 pm
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This. The only real way to explain VR to somebody is to put the headset on them.
>> No. 25771 Anonymous
21st September 2022
Wednesday 6:28 pm
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Yep cracking list there, that's plenty to be going on with.
>> No. 25774 Anonymous
22nd September 2022
Thursday 12:53 pm
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I used to work at a venue where we had a room with an HTC Vive set up, people would book slots to have a 10 minute go of ZenBlade or Space Pirate Trainer, fairly impressive stuff. Then I think the venue signed a deal to shill some Adventure Time VR game, which was pretty much a PS2 style platformer, with the only VR element being you controlled the camera by moving your head rather than with a stick. It was massive underwhelming, and while you'd see people finish a game of Space Pirate Trainer with joy and excitement on their face, Adventure Time did not provoke such a positive reaction. That game did not need tacked on VR, it only had it to chase a trend.
>> No. 25779 Anonymous
22nd September 2022
Thursday 4:58 pm
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I've been toying with the idea of getting myself a VR headset as an extravagant Christmas present for the last couple of years, but I always tell myself I'll wait until there's a "next gen" of VR stuff that sorts out the little niggles and quirks. It seems very much like a technology that's promising, but still in the early adopter phase, and I don't like getting burned with that.

But then having said that, I feel as though I've been saying this since about 2016, and the shit simply isn't coming out of early adopter phase. That's just it for VR now. Not quite a pointless fad, but one which certainly doesn't seem to be gaining any traction. Which would be a shame. I hope it doesn't go the way of 3D glasses and surround sound.

You watch though. It'll carry on like this for another five years, until I finally cave in and buy an Index, THEN they'll announce a new one that's half the size, weight, and fully wireless.
>> No. 25780 Anonymous
22nd September 2022
Thursday 5:23 pm
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This thread made me curious enough to do a quick google for the most highly recommended VR games; top two results were Alyx and Settlers of Catan. Not a game based on Settlers of Catan, just the VR experience of having the board in front of you and playing on it.
>> No. 25781 Anonymous
22nd September 2022
Thursday 7:25 pm
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>until there's a "next gen" of VR stuff that sorts out the little niggles and quirks.

Quest 2 is a remarkably complete solution if you buy the posh headstrap and you don't have a head like Henning Wehn. It works well as a standalone, it works well as a wireless PCVR headset using Air Link, the tracking is reliable enough that it isn't annoying, the display is sufficiently high-res that you don't notice pixelation or screen-door unless you're really looking for it. It's no Varjo Aero, but it's a third of the price.


VR experiences off the top of my head that are definitely better than Settlers of Catan:

Beat Saber
Resident Evil 4
Thrill of The Fight
Keep Calm and Nobody Explodes
After The Fall
Population: One
Pistol Whip

Even if we're talking about board games, Demeo is definitely better. Tabletop Simulator offers an infinitely extensible board game environment thing.

GreatYazer's map of ELO's Mr Blue Sky is one of the best experiences in gaming, but I can't usefully describe it or illustrate it because it's a purely physical sensation. The best I can do is "it makes your limbs feel all breezy and loose", but that's not particularly helpful.

The catalogue of VR titles is relatively thin and a lot of games do feel like tech demos. Everyone is having to re-invent game development from scratch, which is the biggest problem in VR but also why it's so interesting. VR is definitely not for you if you're looking for traditional 40+ hr AAA titles, but I really like it because it offers completely novel experiences that don't require a huge investment of time.
>> No. 25783 Anonymous
22nd September 2022
Thursday 8:14 pm
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>Quest 2 is a remarkably complete solution

Yeah, it does look good for the price... The Occulus stuff is just totally out of the question for me since the Facebook thing to be honest. I really don't need the Zuck spying on all my weird furry VR sex activities.

Unless there's some way to jailbreak them nowadays?
>> No. 25784 Anonymous
22nd September 2022
Thursday 10:13 pm
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You do need to log in, but you can now use a Meta account that doesn't have to be connected to a Facebook account. I held off upgrading to a Quest 2 for exactly that reason, but I'm reasonably happy with the updated privacy terms.

I'd prefer a properly open device, but that isn't going to happen until the electronics supply chain issues get sorted - nobody wants to launch new products at the moment because nobody can get enough components without an existing supply contract.

>> No. 25785 Anonymous
22nd September 2022
Thursday 10:14 pm
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Seems strange that "discriminating" would be top of someone's spying concerns.
>> No. 25791 Anonymous
26th September 2022
Monday 12:19 am
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Speaking of pointless fads, I've only just got a graphics card capable of this raytracing stuff, and having tested it out in a few games, that's exactly what I'm going to call it.

I mean, it obviously has potential; but the way NVidia are leaning so heavily on it is little more than marketing guff. I'm old enough to remember several similar overhyped gimmicks that remind me strongly of this, and I feel confident it's going to follow the exact same trajectory.

Remember tessellation? Yeah, you probably do now that I've mentioned it, but other than that I bet you had completely forgotten it existed. Cast your mind back, about ten years now, and tessellation was the absolute must have feature. It was the reason to upgrade, it was the future of graphics, it was supposed to utterly change the face of graphics as we know it. There was that demo with the dragon on those floating islands, and we were all amazed, remember? But when was the last time you even heard it mentioned? I'm sure games still use it, but it didn't lead us to the promised land of blowjobs and free doughnuts did it.

Remember PhysX? That was a complete joke. Hairworks? Actually, come to think of it, it's always Nvidia pushing this bullshit too.

Raytracing will do the same thing I reckon. It won't be the be all end all, we won't have this revolution where it's raytraced everything all the time and we laugh at how primitive things were before it. It'll just become another pretty mundane part of the feature set developers can use. And the reason I say that is because it only looks good about as often as it looks like shit, frankly, and that's in the cases you can even see a difference at all. It does some things well, like reflections, but honestly I think the more conventional lighting in most games looks better (I would imagine because it requires more direct, deliberate artistic input from a developer.) Raytracing will stick around, sure, but it will end up as just another menu toggle that makes a barely perceptible difference to quality, for a modest frame rate cost.

I'm sure some of you are just nodding and going "yeah, duh" but they really have been pushing it to the point I was expecting a lot more out of it. Not that I'm disappointed, it's just rare that even my natural level of skepticism is exceeded.
>> No. 25792 Anonymous
26th September 2022
Monday 1:37 pm
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>Everyone is having to re-invent game development from scratch, which is the biggest problem in VR but also why it's so interesting.

Crowbcat's Kinect video has the developor of Ryse: Son of Rome saying that they dropped Kinect support because "you reach a point where you're teaching people how to swing a sword and not play a game, you know what I mean, and at the end of the day we had to make the decision is this the game we want to make?"

I wonder if there is a similar deterrent effect in VR development?
>> No. 25793 Anonymous
26th September 2022
Monday 4:36 pm
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>I wonder if there is a similar deterrent effect in VR development?

The problems are very different. Motion tracking in VR has to be absolutely rock solid, otherwise you get horrendous motion sickness. Motion control on things like Kinect or Wii was a barely-adequate bodge, but on VR it's pretty much totally sorted. From a user's perspective the interactions are totally natural and from a developer's perspective it's very easy to implement. If you give a VR player a sword or a bow and arrow or a golf club, they instantly know what to do with it as long as you've got the physics right.

The big difficulties with VR development are that so many things that we take for granted on flat screens just don't work. Game developers are habituated to doing things that don't actually make sense in the real world, but are convenient tropes for making things work in games. It's a design language that gamers take for granted. In VR, things that don't make sense in the real world tend to make you feel sick, because they create conflicts with the sense of immersion in a real space.

A straightforward example is the HUD. We take it for granted that in games, you can have information overlaid on the screen at all times. In VR, that's disorienting and makes your eyes go funny, because your visual system is trying to place those floating numbers and icons into a real space. If something exists in a VR game, it has to exist as a tangible object in the game world. If you want something to be constantly in the eyeline of the player, you need to project it onto the visor of a helmet or put a screen on the back of their gun or something.

Focus and vergence-accommodation conflict are significant problems with the current generation of hardware, but will be fixed within a few years. Essentially, current-generation VR headsets have a fixed focus which is set somewhere in the middle distance. This is good enough that anything from about a metre away to infinity looks sharp enough, but anything really close to your face will be out of focus and make you go slightly cross-eyed. We know how to build VR headsets with more complex optics that better match your visual system, but it isn't quite ready for mass-market hardware. It's something that has to be worked around for the minute, because any game that requires lots of close-up objects with fine detail will be uncomfortable on a fixed-focus headset.

Interaction expectations make development of realistic environments more difficult. Gamers are used to the idea that games are full of stuff that's just set dressing, but in VR we have the instinctive sense that everything should be grabbable. If there's a bottle on the table, people will want to pick it up and they'll feel disappointed if they can't. If a player sees a ladder, they'll expect to be able to climb it by grabbing the rungs with their hands; if they climb a ladder, they'll expect to be able to climb anything that they can grab.

Locomotion is a harder problem. VR gives a sufficiently convincing sense of being in a physical space that any camera movement that isn't controlled by head movement will start to induce motion sickness in most players. That isn't insurmountable, but it has to be accounted for. Normal thumb stick motion that you'd use on any console game is a complete no-go; VR developers are still experimenting with a variety of movement schemes with varying risks of motion sickness.

We're figuring this stuff out and developing new design conventions, but that journey just involves massive amounts of hard work. It's a bit like being back in the 90s, when people were still having to develop their own game engines and work things out on the fly. People are putting in that effort because there's something like 10 million Quest headsets in use, but the learning curve is going to remain pretty steep for the next few years.

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