Sorry if this is a bit of a facile topic, but I'm wondering what people's thoughts are on stimulants and 'nootropics'.
There's a plethora of legal ways ways to slow myself down with depressants, alcohol being the most prevalent, but very few ways to meaningfully speed myself up. Caffeine never had much of an effect on me, other than to speed up my heartrate.
I'm not asking for a hook-up or for people to incriminate themselves, but I want a sincere talk about the advantages and disadvantages to using these drugs, especially as they pertain to your productivity, happiness, and side effects.
Depends what you want out of them. I don't know much about the whole "nootropics" thing, but let's say a good friend told me his experiences with the main illicit stimulants:
Cocaine is very good for social situations, essentially it will just give you that feeling of a good night out where you are having a laugh and chatting happily with your mates, but more. Really this is the worst thing about it- It does make you feel very good. It's not helpful if you need to focus on something, you'll be very scatter brained, and it's nearly pointless to take it outside of a social context, but within that context there's nothing better.
The issue with cocaine is that the addiction is both powerful, and insidious. It will creep up on you. If you're not careful you'll start to associate the good times social feeling with the drug, and from there it's hard to separate the two. My advice would be that it's best to stay away entirely, but if you must, make a hard and fast rule that it's only going to be once a month or something, and stick to it no matter what.
Speed doesn't give you nearly the same sort of mood lift, but it is much easier to manage in terms of compulsion, not to mention much cheaper, and it will actually increase your focus/productivity a good degree as long as you actually have something in mind to do. You will be able to lock into that thing single mindedly, and do it without distraction; the caveat is that that applies just as much to writing or cleaning as it does to wanking or shitposting on the internet. So it's very important you do actually have something planned. If you are prone to rumination, or there's something on your mind, you can very well end up with the hyperfocus locked on to that and it'll be quite unpleasant.
What they both have in common is that there is always a debt to be repaid. Your mood will typically be very low the day after, and that's part of what can drive you to keep on taking more, which is a nasty trap to fall into. There's also the effect on your routine to consider, it's not wise to have long binges because there's a good chance you will neglect to eat or carry out basic self care. Obviously, with habitual use, that issue compounds, and that's how a junkie's lifestyle spirals out of control.
These drugs are to be treated with respect, and as long as you are aware of that, I think it is possible to use them relatively harmlessly in the appropriate situations. But you do have to take it very seriously, don't be cavalier about it.
I wouldn't recommend hard drugs like cocaine or speed, obviously. They'll get you a temporary high, and for a time they will do so everytime you take them and maybe even increase your energy and productivity, but in the long run, the effects on your health and on your capacity to function as an adult will be vastly pernicious.
Some people with lethargic depression have good success with things like Ritalin, it could both get you out of your lethargy and make you more productive, but the people that I've met who were on it kind of seemed odd the more time I spent talking to them. Something about them was always just kind of "off".
Unless you're so lethargic in your daily life that that itself keeps you from functioning, I'd say just live with it. Accept it. I know in our times where self optimisation is becoming a religion, everybody is absorbing the message that they always need to give 110 percent at everything they do. But people innately have different energy levels, and your happiness doesn't always increase by trying to be a Type A person when you're really meant to be a Type B person.
I did a month of Elvanse (some sort of amphetamine) due to ADHD. Been off it a week now due to misunderstandings, but am getting some more this week. It really helps a lot. My mind is clearer, I have more drive and motivation, my anxiety goes down because I don't have 100 threads of nonsense running through my head. Just 10 threads or so of thoughts I have more control over. It's not a big instant huge change - I watched the ritalin episode of The Simpsons earlier and it's not like that - but it is, for the month I was on, life changing.
Side effects I sweat a lot, though that could be the heat of the summer. Sometimes my focus is too powerful and I neglect eating and self care to give my all to whatever it is I'm focused on. A little bit slower to react to verbal stuff because I'm not used to not instantly responding with whatever my brain has skipped to at that moment in time.
ADHD diagnosis is a hassle, and I don't know other pathways to get it. But it's good.
Ritalin, adderall, et al are all near enough literally speed. Just "medical grade" you could say. I know you probably know that but I think it often needs to be pointed out and kept in mind when discussing it. There's no distinction between "hard drugs" and "medicine" with that one.
I think a lot of people who end up taking this sort of stuff "recreationally" are already the sort of people who would end up getting something similar thrown at them by the state sanctioned drug dealers doctors anyway. But that's a whole different topic. Obviously you are completely right, it's best not to use any of these drugs if you can avoid it, it's best not to take any drugs if you can avoid it. But if somebody is going to, I think we should be frank about them.
It's basically the same stuff, but there's a huge difference in dose. A typical ADHD patient will take a daily stimulant dose equivalent to about 15mg of amphetamine sulphate. For a recreational user, that's a tiny speck of drug that you could lose at the bottom of a baggie.
Most ADHD patients are taking some kind of modified release formula, so the drug will be very slowly absorbed over the course of the day, rather than in a matter of seconds via their nasal membranes. The difference in peak blood concentration between someone taking ADHD meds and someone having a small bump of speed might be 100x.
As someone without ADHD, speed is great for motivation and frankly I find it too exhausting to use habitually. It does make it harder to think clearly; it isn't a nootropic, if you take it you'll just be stupid faster. A very small dose - so little you're barely aware of its physical effects, balanced out with nootropics that aid memory (and thought in general, so bacopa monnieri, whatever racetam/choline mix works for you, maybe lion's mane and so on) works wonders.
I bloody love modafinil and any of the other -afinils, but they're damn near impossible to get here anymore. I had my best days on them, it cleared the mindfog and I could actually focus. Fucking sucks knowing there's stuff out there that would absolutely benefit me, like shrooms too, but I have to pay out the arse for it and risk prison just to have better function.
Tell me about modafinil. What's it do? I've heard of it before and it's often talked about like some miracle drug but I always have my doubts about anything like that.
When you say "hard to get" do you mean through legal means, ie they make the prescription process awkward as fuck, or is it scarce on the black market too? Generally, there's usually a good reason if a prescribed drug is hard to get, although I certainly don't know what the craic is with this stuff.
>>33281 It basically just increases alertness/wakefulness, as >>33280 alluded to it is mainly prescribed for narcolepsy in this country but every so often you can get it if you do night shift work, though I couldn't get it prescribed even when doing that as it seems to be very heavily restricted though I'm not sure why, in other countries it's over the counter. It's been hard to get reliably online too due to the governments crack down on "smart drugs", but it still exists in a grey area where purchasing it for yourself isn't actually against the law unless you're ordering obscene amounts, but it seems to be down to the discretion of whoever finds the package so it's a bit of a gamble.
I've encountered the same thing with melatonin here, something I got prescribed once over a decade ago, but recently got told point blank by a doctor that it won't be prescribed unless I'm over 60 and having issues sleeping because "the studies aren't clear". Yet melatonin is available over the counter in a lot of western countries too.
Anyway I got the bare minimum of side effects from modafinil, a slight headache every so often that went away with a dose of paracetemol, and I went to loo a little more often but my body seemed to adjust to it fairly quickly. It was well worth being able to actually think without the mindfog, and to be able to focus on tasks and get things done. Maybe I have ADHD but who knows, I'll probably never get tested because I was told the wait list was at least 2 years.
>>33283 I'm not sure about black and white, but it's illegal to supply without a prescription, which puts the onus on the suppliers which I assume is why they get shut down so frequently. The law here says it's not illegal to buy but I've heard of people running into legal issues or just getting it confiscated if they have a large amount, but that seems to be the vague area where it's entirely down to the law enforcements discretion. I've had a look recently and there seem to be two shops that have popped up in the UK that people are saying are reliable, but your order's probably going to be around £100 minimum and if it gets caught then that's money down the drain.
It varies around Europe too, depending on whether or not they have it listed as a controlled substance. Some do, some don't.
>>33284 Not cheap, not from your mate (likely), but you can get it easy online. Is it good for you? Nah. Is it fun? No. Does it get you through the day? Yes, it does. Not heck yeah, not fuck yeah, just "Yes." It's the very definition of "will make do", if that's what you need... we are united in finding a pharmacy that can supply it.
>>33285 I used it once as a student, to stay up all night and get an essay done from scratch in 12 hours. It was very effective, not fun or exciting. I didn't get enjoyment from it, but I did get 87% on the essay I shat out so I can vouch for Modafinil's study drug reputation. Got it off my druggie housemate, he had loads but this was in 2014 so maybe getting hold of it has changed in the last decade.
>>33269 Are there any drugs that would turn a person that would turn a somewhat neurotic, very avoidant and incredibly socially awkward person into someone that is into an extrovert who is happy to talk to people? Someone in my family half-jokingly suggested shrooms but I'd rather not have any trips or anything like that. I just want to take a pill and be able to go to social events without looking like a twat.
Seriously though, have you tried an SSRI like escitalopram? They won't instantly turn you into the life and soul of the party, but they're fairly effective in treating social anxiety. Anecdotally, I'd describe SSRIs as like a volume control for your emotions - it's not that your feelings instantly change for the better, it's just that everything is a bit muted and a lot more manageable. You find yourself feeling relatively calm and unbothered in situations where you'd normally be overwhelmed. Of course that isn't a universally good thing, but it can give you a bit of room to think more clearly and push yourself to try new things.
If the physical symptoms of anxiety are a problem for you - feeling shaky, sweaty palms, dry mouth, racing heart etc - then you could try a beta blocker like propranolol. Beta blockers are massively popular with professional musicians, because they damp down all of those symptoms of stage fright.
If either sounds like it might be worth a try, ask your GP.
Phenibut. It's an incredible empathogen however it's extremely moreish (if you're not careful you'll redose until you run out, any more than three days use in a row and you're in real trouble) and the comedown is the weirdest fucking hangover I've ever felt. But for one-off events you can buy in (grey market) a single dose then go with that.
I find /emo/ is a bit better at sincere conversations about psychological stuff so I thought I might get more honest replies. Also, filthy foreigners are barred from /A/.
