The madness of this story keeps me up at night. 20mph in Wales. It might make sense in a dense urban area like central London but it's bloody Wales, by definition it's not going to have loads of people in the road and everyone needs to travel further. Even Cardiff is pushing it and that place is wrong.

>>4767
I see they've even repeated the bullshit "braking distances" from the Highway Code which have used the same nonsense formula for about a century.

>Speed limits in built-up areas will be reduced from 30mph to 20mph in Wales on Sunday - a UK first that has caused controversy with some drivers.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-66774379

>>4799

The truth is that cars have become far safer in recent years than they were when those speed limits of 30 mph were imposed a very long time ago. Pedestrian deaths and injuries from car collisions in 30 mph zones are also a fraction of what they were in the 1950s and 60s. So there's no reason from that perspective to change it to 20 mph.

You could make the argument that you use less fuel or energy at 20 mph, but as long as most road cars still have combustion engines, the truth is that you actually tend to get better fuel economy at 30 mph than 20 mph, because of gear ratios in lower gears that are mainly designed to bring a car up to speed from standstill, and not to save fuel. Driving at a relatively constant 30 mph in third gear at something like 2500 rpm will almost invariably use less fuel than second gear at 20 mph and 3500 rpm. And third gear at 20 mph tends to get even worse economy because it'll be below your car's optimal rev range.

EVs have almost linear power output and no transmission, so you could say that 20 mph with an EV does save energy compared to 30 mph. But as electricity will become increasingly carbon neutral in the future and power grids will be beefed up to handle increased EV charging load, who cares.

I like how every headline is lying about this. Not a massive lie, but the implication that every road in Wales will be a 20 mph zone to get people going "what the heck!?" at the very idea. I'm always skeptical of claims of "clickbait" because it's often just a headline doing what it's meant to, but this actually feels like it.

Anyway, I don't care. Too many motorists turn into little children with bad attitudes once they get behind the wheel. And it's not like they've got anywhere to be, take it easy.

I >>4801 just saw how old this thread is so I accept it's not universal fibbing.

>Rishi Sunak is expected to block councils from introducing new 20mph zones as part of a “plan for motorists”.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2023/09/28/rishi-sunak-to-block-new-20mph-zones/

>Scrapping the Manchester leg of HS2 will free up cash to fix potholes, Rishi Sunak says

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/politics/24182911/scrapping-hs2-will-free-up-cash-pm-says/

ON THE SIDE OF MOTORISTS.

>>4769

Yeah, this really needs to be updated to consider increased speeds and reaction times from cocaine abuse.

>>4803

"Motorists" is the worst demographic anyone can ever roll out. Fucking hate it. Nobhead.

The only real distinction is people that drive who aren't pissy dickheads and people who drive that get in a frothing rage because a cyclist is inconveniencing them slightly.

>>4805
Yesterday, they tried to do a go-slow along the M4, driving at 20mph to show people what it feels like, even though the limit on the motorway is not going to change to 20mph (which it couldn't even if anyone wanted it to). Gwent Police, being very serious about speed on the motorway, were having none of it, insisting that the convoy would have to make good at least 40mph, and if anyone was flagging the rear escort would make sure they knew.

>>4806
It's the slippery slope. Remember when the plastic bag charge was only 5p when it was introduced in 2015? These days you can be lucky to see change from 50p at some shops.

>>4807
I certainly remember the money was meant to go to green charities. I don't think it does now.

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/if-you-think-20mph-hard-27795671

>''If you think 20mph is hard we ain't seen nothing yet." That was the message from Wales' deputy climate change minister, Lee Waters, as he prepared to face a no-confidence debate in the Senedd after more than 430,000 people signed a petition calling for the default 20mph speed limit law to be rescinded.

That is not an insignificant number in a country of just over 3 million.

>>4809
Yeah, but how many of them are actually in Wales and not just irate Mailheads getting upset at memes on "Facey"?

>>4807

The statutory minimum charge is ten pence, but that only applies to single-use carrier bags. Reusable bags of more than 70 microns thickness are exempt from the charge. Any proceeds from the sale of single-use carrier bags must be donated to charity.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/carrier-bag-charges-retailers-responsibilities

Supermarkets have basically worked out that carrier bag prices are now a tax on the disorganised. The kind of people who forget to bring their bags for life are not the same sort of people who write angry letters to the local press or switch supermarkets out of spite.

>>4810

https://petitions.senedd.wales/petitions/245548/signatures/new

It looks like the petition actually allows you to sign if you're not in Wales. In fact, you can sign it from anywhere in the world, going by the "Location" drop-down menu.


Worth noting that an opposing petition has only reached about 4,600 signatures.

https://petitions.senedd.wales/petitions/245612

>We want the Welsh Government to keep the excellent 20mph law

Mirth.

>>4812
Make that 4,601. Actually as I type this it's 4,615, but one is me and that's the most important signature.

>>4813

People like you are the reason why life isn't fun anymore.

>>4812
You can select locations outside of Wales so they can easily discount your signature.

It's the same reason there are options in certain computer games to report people for behaviour that isn't actually against the rules.

>>4814
Yeah, how dare he sign up to petitions for things that make it easier and safer to walk or cycle around town.

>>4816
If that's the only priority why not put car owners in prison?

STOP THE TOXIC AIR LIE!

>>4818
I can't wait to be retired and have so much time ony my hands.

>>4816

My argument stands.

>>4818
classic cars20 years MOT????
what's the end of that? Is he in favour of classics getting an easy ride or against? I mean, they're nice and polluting, and some are nice to look at and drive, but I'm not sure they're the solution to London's transport issues. If he's against, then fuck him, obviously.

>>4817
We don't have enough room for them.

>>4821

I don't think 20 years is a good cutoff for a car to be a classic. There are still loads of them on the road, and many wouldn't even be perceived by many people as being old cars.

>>4823
I wouldn't consider my parent's old 51 plate Ford Focus as a classic.

>>4824

I don't think a Ford Focus will ever be a classic. They're just too ordinary.

>>4823
This is one opposition to 20 I can get on board with.

>>4826

30 years is probably where it gets interesting. That includes the early Golf MkIII and the E36 BMW 3-series and the A80 Toyota Supra or the W124 Mercedes E-class.

Not that many of them left in good condition.

>>4827
maybe that sign on his trailer says 30? I dunno, I just guessed at 20.
Any idea what he's so pissed about (other than ULEZ)?

>>4825
Mk1 and MKII Escorts were likewise ordinary Fords. Give it time.
That said, I'd struggle to be impressed by an old focus, patina or no.

>>4829

To me, Ford has always been too unremarkable to be a classic. They're everyday lower middle class cars that aren't meant to last more than about ten years.

Fine, the Mustang or the Thunderbird are different. Especially the older ones of them are bona fide classics. But Ford's compact or subcompact offerings for the UK or European market have always been a bit too humdrum. Even the rally versions.

>>4827
>Not that many of them left in good condition.

This should really be the criteria if you ask me. Worst case scenario is that we end up with loads of unusual cars to looks at and then we organise a tournament to find out who is the wackiest racer.

>>4830

Mk1/Mk2 Escorts are bona fide classics. They're so popular in rallying that MST make brand new ones.

https://mst-cars.com/

>>4832

So which is the one I remember fondly from the 90s, a Mk3? They definitely weren't as boxy as that one. Or was it the Escort? I always get the Sierra and Escort mixed up.

My dad worked for Ford once and he said they were bastards so we never had one, and he would never let me get one when I was picking my first car. But I never realised the Mk1 was that sexy.

I bet those are entirely unaffordable to someone like me, right?

>>4833

If you're thinking of new cars around that time, it'd be a Mk 5 or Mk 6. The Mk 3 and Mk 4 had quite an angular 80s look to them.

>I bet those are entirely unaffordable to someone like me, right?

Base model 1100 Mk 1s are quite common and can be found for as little as £5,000, but at that price you'd be looking at a full restoration job. At the other end of the spectrum, a really good RS or Twin Cam would go for anywhere from £50k to £70k.

The MST Escorts are built-to-order so they're all priced uniquely, but to give you an idea, the bare body shell alone costs £22k.

>>4833
Ford Orion?

>>4834
>>4835

Yeah it was a Mk 5 I'm thinking of by the looks. Although it's understandable how I was getting the Sierra and Escort mixed up, what exactly was even the difference? I'm looking at them side by side and it's hard to tell.

>>4836

The Sierra and Escort are fairly distinctive, with the Sierra being a significantly larger "luxury" car. The Orion is basically identical to the Escort, but with a boot instead of a hatchback.

>HS2 to Manchester shelved, ITV News understands

https://www.itv.com/news/2023-10-02/hs2-to-manchester-shelved-itv-news-understands

Motorists win again, good old Rish.

>Free drink refills could be banned in Wales

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c51ye8e5dr0o

It sounds like Wales is a utilitarian hellhole.

>>4845
Well this can do one. It's one of the few remaining joys of the Ikea restaurant not ravaged by shrinkflation.

UK’s 20mph speed limits ‘are cutting car insurance costs

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2025/jan/18/uk-20mph-speed-limits-car-insurance-costs-premiums

>>4866
Why not cut the speed limit to 10mph and save even more on insurance?

>>4867
The same reason I've given up on expecting drivers to remember how their indicators work: too ambitious.

>>4867

If we ban driving entirely it'll be free. Starmer and Whatsername want ideas to jump start growth, don't they.