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|>>|| No. 24225
So who's looking to upgrade when the full product is released in the near-future? It looks to me like they've put a lot of work into this one, and most importantly the Start menu makes a welcome return.
I'd like to upgrade, but I'm not sure why it doesn't seem to like my laptop's bluetooth, anyone know how easy is will be to upgrade then roll back to 8.1 if it doesn't work?
|>>|| No. 24226
I will but I'll be waiting until the last minute before the offer runs out - within a year, they're saying, which is plenty of time for most of the inevitable launch bugs to get ironed out.
Apparently there's a rollback option in the developer test, though I wouldn't count on it being in the final. Either way making a backup of your current install of Windows before trying the upgrade is probably a good idea, if you're worried.
|>>|| No. 24227
I won't ever change out of Windows 7 into another proprietary OS. I'll just stick with 7 for my video games and Mint/other distros for everything else.
|>>|| No. 24228
So what do I need to get this icon to appear? Is it only for the 8.1 crowd or will us 7 folk get it at some point?
|>>|| No. 24229
Legitimately licensed users of Windows 7 will be eligible for the upgrade and should get a notification to pre-register. Microsoft are having to stagger the rollout of Windows 10, because it's expected be the single largest data transfer in human history.
|>>|| No. 24230
>Microsoft are having to stagger the rollout of Windows 10, because it's expected be the single largest data transfer in human history.
I think that probably speaks more to the poor construction and bloat of of their product (small and efficient OSs don't sustain all those nice management jobs, I guess) than it does for popular demand for Windows 10.
|>>|| No. 24231
Oh, look, it's this idiot again. You're right, as always. All software is bloated and all developers are lazy shits.
|>>|| No. 24232
Not him but he was blaming management in that case, not devs, you illiterate ponce.
|>>|| No. 24234
Oh look, it's this idiot again, the one who doesn't actually fucking read the posts and just uses any excuse to go off on something nobody fucking implied.
|>>|| No. 24237
Is this going to be available only as an upgrade or will they also be handing out keys?
|>>|| No. 24238
I thought something like Magical Jelly Bean Keyfinder may be able to retrieve a key.
|>>|| No. 24239
I wonder if you get the same upgrade if you have 7 Home Premium right now as opposed to 7 Ultimate.
|>>|| No. 24254
it seems so from the faq:
> Are there any qualification requirements?
> The only requirements are that a) your device is compatible, and b) you’re running genuine Windows 7 Service Pack 1 (SP1) or Windows 8.1 (Update).
> Windows 10 is designed to run on Windows 7 and Windows 8.1 PCs. That means your device is likely compatible and will run Windows 10.*
|>>|| No. 24255
I just read the entire thread to make sure. Nobody has yet mentioned that Microsoft is giving Windows 10 away for free. It says so right there in the FAQ you jut linked.
I've been looking vacantly for a free OS for a while now and thought Linux distributions were the only sensible options. Now it looks as if Windows is the only game in town.
|>>|| No. 24256
It's a free upgrade, not a freebie. If you need a license for a homebuilt computer or something still running XP, you'll have to pay full price - $119 for Home, $199 for Pro. Microsoft will still be charging OEMs for licenses. Several analysts think that Microsoft intend to eventually move to a subscription licensing model, charging a monthly or annual fee for updates.
|>>|| No. 24257
It is a freebie, just not one available to everyone.
Windows XP saw its mainstream support end in April 2009 and its extended support ended in April 2014. The validity of using Windows XP as an example in the way you do expired too.
|>>|| No. 24259
>It is a freebie
A freebie that's only available to people who have a legit license of a recent version of Windows, hence a free upgrade. It won't be free for OEMs, it won't be free for home builders, it won't be free for Mac users wanting to run Windows on Bootcamp or a VM. It's a free upgrade, not a free operating system. It doesn't supplant Linux in any meaningful way.
|>>|| No. 24260
I've been running the technical preview for months. It's 8.1 with a slightly more traditional start menu. Seems stable. It's fine, not a whole lot to get excited about, really.
One really annoying thing is that when you try to change certain settings from the taskbar in the regular desktop mode it will open up a mostly useless metro "modern app" settings window which doesn't give you much information or many options of value, and some of the options bring up the old desktop control panel, others will just stay the new settings window. It might be a small complaint, but come the fuck on, either make a new OS where everything works intuitively, or just iterate on the old one where nothing's terribly intuitive but I know how to get around it already. This is the worst of both worlds.
|>>|| No. 24261
>The pledge came from Windows engineering chief, Gabriel Aul, in a response to a question posed on Twitter. When asked: "Will you be able to upgrade to the #Win10 RTM version for free with #insiders preview?" Aul simply replied: "Yes." RTM stands for 'Release to Manufacturing', Microsoft's terminology for the completed operating system code that is sent to PC makers for pre-installation on their PCs.
If you really want a free copy, and don't have 7/8 already, toss the Insider beta on as a dual boot now and you'll have it legit come launch.
>It doesn't supplant Linux in any meaningful way.
No, but then it's not like Microsoft give much of a shit about Linux for consumer desktops/laptops. It's OSX and ChromeOS that are the real competition, and both of them are free. If you spend a few minutes with Win10 it becomes blatantly clear why they're so happy to be tossing around free licences for consumers - it's a tightly-integrated trojan horse for their ad-based services like Bing, for the Store, and for tying you in to a Microsoft account (in much the way Google, Apple etc have been doing with their offerings). They'll no doubt try and wring as much as they can out of the business and public sectors (who aren't in a position to argue due to their investment in legacy software) but for home users, their eyeballs and the potential for lock-in to Microsoft services are the real prize.
|>>|| No. 24503
I made the update out of curiosity, and have mixed experiences. A couple of bits didn't 'just work' and I had to manually update the graphics and bluetooth drivers to get those devices working properly. Annoyingly it seems to take longer to boot and wake from sleep than I'm used to, the latter freezes at the lock screen for 10-20 seconds every time.
On the other hand, I definitely prefer the interface to 8, and being able to use multiple virtual desktops is something I've wanted in Windows for a while.
Anyone else made the upgrade recently?
|>>|| No. 24504
Yeah, I made the jump.
Having it manually download drivers, graphics one especially, is a recipe for disaster. I'd advise turning it off. You can do it from Device Manager. I've had issues with GPU drivers bricking my system too many times to trust them.
I like the UI, it's clean. All the moaning about the intrusive ads I seen before it's launch can be completely turned off if you are using Pro, so I think I'm lucky in that respect.
The only thing I've noticed is you can't turn telemetry off. Not even in CMD. That is slightly worrying, when the Win10doom has all been focused on anti-piracy measures the last week and I have, just the one mind you (PowerDVD 14, for Blurays), dodgy software.
|>>|| No. 24505
You kow the reason they are pushing it as "free" (and lets face it, it's not just s free upgrade. if you want it legit free, you can get it) is because it has even more NSA spying gubbins in it. Of course windows already had that shite, but they've upped their game.
Mind you, I bet you fuckwits even use Chrome. A browser that has been shown to turn on your microphone and record you and send it to google without you knowing. http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/jun/23/google-eavesdropping-tool-installed-computers-without-permission
I despair. It seems no one gives a shit about their privacy apart from me. Funny thing is I really don't have anything to hide. It's just the principle of the thing.
|>>|| No. 24506
The reason they're giving it out for free is to get everyone onboard quickly, so they don't have another XP situation of an absurd support tail end, because the idea of software as a service has gained currency etc etc.
Microsoft is a private company seeking to make a profit. They don't make such huge business decisions based around helping the NSA. That's not to say they don't readily comply with such organisations, but have a bit of wit lad.
|>>|| No. 24507
Yes, for many reasons.
Consumers just don't pay for OS upgrades. Microsoft took 15 years to realise that just giving away upgrades for free is actually more profitable than selling them, because of the reduced cost burden of supporting multiple OS versions.
They are deeply worried about their market share, which is being eroded from many sides. Chrome OS has undermined the market for low-end computers and is making huge inroads in education, hence the free Windows OEM licenses for low-cost computers. People are using a much more diverse range of devices, hence Office 365.
After a stagnant decade under the leadership of Steve Ballmer, Microsoft are finally starting to turn things around. They had become complacent in an old business model that was very stable, but didn't drive any growth.
Windows 10 is the centrepiece of a cross-platform strategy that will allow Microsoft to grow in spite of declining PC sales. Microsoft now realise that they must support standard web technologies, that they must engage with software developers and the open source community rather than pushing a monolithic model, that they must transition away from retail-box and OEM sales and towards SaaS.
|>>|| No. 24508
>Funny thing is I really don't have anything to hide.
Sure you don't.
On a more serious note, I agree with you. The systematic erosion of civil liberties I've witnessed in the past 20 years is something that gives me knots in my stomach for what might come next.
|>>|| No. 24511
>Microsoft is a private company seeking to make a profit. They don't make such huge business decisions based around helping the NSA
That depends. If I were a private company and the government asked me very nicely to comply, oh and by the way if I don't they'll fine me a quarter of a million on the first day and double it every day until I do and serve me with a security notice preventing me from telling my shareholders why all this money is disappearing, I might be minded to comply.
|>>|| No. 24516
Do you think it's more likely that Microsoft are responding to market realities and moving towards windows as a service or that they're being blackmailed by the NSA into giving away an operating system for free?
|>>|| No. 24520
No, I think you plucked the bit where compliance ceases to be handing over user data and becomes releasing a free operating system out of your arse.
|>>|| No. 24523
I generally agree, legitimate businesses with long term goals don't often want to actively fuck their customers over.
That's why it's a pretty fucking happy coincidence that the sensible business decision in this case (thanks to the pioneering efforts of competitor companies like Google) happens to align so well with the desire of the government strong-arm policies. Everybody wins. Except the end-user.
|>>|| No. 24525
>I think you plucked the bit where compliance ceases to be handing over user data and becomes releasing a free operating system out of your arse
You say "releasing a free operating system", I say "ensuring their ability to hand over user data".
|>>|| No. 24526
As am I. I've managed to avoid shelling out £80 on a new OS by simply not upgrading. I'm about three weeks into not upgrading and it seems to be just fine so far.
|>>|| No. 24529
... by releasing a free operating system. If you have any evidence to demonstrate that you aren't pulling this out of your arse, now would be the time to show your cards!
Receiving a new and upgraded OS without spending £80, smartarse.
|>>|| No. 24530
If you've ever bought a pre-built personal computer, or a Mac, then yes you have.
It's bundled into the cost of the device.
|>>|| No. 24531
The dreaded Windows tax. Dell sell a limited range of computers with Ubuntu preinstalled, which work out about £40 cheaper than the same model with Windows.
|>>|| No. 24532
In fairness, it'd be pretty dumb to sell them at the same price. If you did, everyone who just wanted Ubuntu could just buy the Windows version and sell the license key.
|>>|| No. 24533
Good job I've never done that either then.
I'm not trying to be a smart-arse, but a free windows OS is a gift horse that very much should be looked in the mouth, considering how ubiquitously easy it already was and always has been to get for free.
Piracy and license breaking means nothing to the sort of people who grew up copying game cassettes on their parent's hi-fi. You only had to know that one lad who worked behind the desk at PC World to come over and install Windows 95 for you. Disc-burning was already a thing by the time Windows 98 came about. Then torrents happened.
I'm surprised it's taken them this long to yield considering they've always known this to be the case, and make their real money from business clients.
|>>|| No. 24535
It's only a free upgrade for a year, so they can encourage the migration of their userbase from Win 7 and 8 versions, because supporting that many operating systems is a drain on resources.
Everyone else has to pay £99. The OS is on sale right now, you can buy it from PC World.
|>>|| No. 24536
The implication being that an OS obtained illegitimately will be compromised, right?
Are you arguing in favour of the apples or the oranges here?
|>>|| No. 24537
A moron who plays PC games, one would assume, since they mostly come out on Windows OS and
they're skintthey don't want to give Microsoft their hard earned giros.
Although, with this free upgrade thing, if you are a filthy pirate, you can get in on the ground floor with your very own legit copy of Win 10 (first time for everything, right?) by exploiting volume licensing.
|>>|| No. 24538
One who knows the whole "rooted OS" thing is an urban legend, presumably.
|>>|| No. 24541
OK lads, let's say there is someone still running XP until he has the money to build a new gaming PC. What OS should this completely hypothetical person install? 7? 8.1? 10?
|>>|| No. 24543
Yes. Even copies that fail the genuine Windows check still get the security fixes.
|>>|| No. 24544
10. It's better for gaming and soon a lot of PC games will use DX12, which only Windows 10 supports afaik.
I noticed massive increases in game performance when I upgraded to 10 fwiw.
|>>|| No. 24546
Anecdotes about performance aside, this is bloody unlikely. DX11 isn't even mandatory in most games and it's 2015. DX12 wont be a regular occurrence for at least another 3 years and even then It's not going to be mandatory unless it is a Microsoft game and it's been specifically built using DX12.
I'd recommend upgrading, because it's a good OS. Waiting, if you have privacy concerns to see how it plays out. For gaming, 7/8.1 will be more than fine for the foreseeable future. You have a year to decide whether you want Win 10, you might as well wait it out.
If you're on XP and you don't want to pay £80 or whatever it cost for a Win 7 OEM(I'm sure you can get them cheaper than this now), I would tentatively suggest downloading a Win 7 Pro ISO, skipping all the activation gubbins, and popping in a memory stick with your Ethernet driver and a (not riddled with AIDs) copy of KMSPico. Upgrading from Win 7 Pro to Win 10 gives you Win 10 Pro which has far more customisation with regards to your privacy. I was able to turn every bit of intrusive bollocks off, apart from telemetry which I was only allowed to change to basic.
Once it is activated, download all the updates. If the Win 10 reservation box doesn't appear there after an hour from the last restart after upgrading, then follow the guides available online to make it appear in legit copies of windows, which yours now is. You might have to delete your update folder and download the appropriate updates manually, as well as having to change some settings in Windows Update in the services menu. It's easy
Or, buy a Win 7 OEM you filthy pirate. Now you have a copy of legit Win 10 to upgrade to at your leisure.
|>>|| No. 24549
The kind that knows how to pirate Windows properly.
Why not go for the Enterprise version, if you're sort of pirating it anyway?
EP offers even more customisation (and, allegedly, ability to turn Telemetry off).
|>>|| No. 24569
A quick poke around eBay shows you can now get a useable Windows 7 COA (with dead computer attached) for £15-20.
|>>|| No. 24604
Just downgraded to 8.1. I really liked some of the features of Win 10 - in particular the virtual desktops and Win+Tab application overview thing (basically the things Unity has done for ages). However the performance was noticeably slower on a lot of basic things like web browsing and booting/waking from sleep (gaming performance seemed broadly similar though).
I might go back when Microsoft has updated it more and/or better drivers get released for my laptop (the 'get windows 10' thing hasn't disappeared), but for now 8.1 is a far more complete product to me.
|>>|| No. 24605
Lads, what the fuck is this all about? Noticed it on both my laptop and main PC
|>>|| No. 24607
Seems like a memory leak to me. I've seen rants about this here and there. People attribute it to faulty drivers or such.
Not a slightest idea how to fix it lad. Sorry.
|>>|| No. 24608
Sometimes system will peg my CPU at 50% after waking from sleep. Restarting normally fixes that.
|>>|| No. 24610
Decided to try it for a few days on my laptop, didn't particularly like it, so last night I rolled it back to Windows 7. And now my trackpad won't work, and neither will the USB mouse, so I can't log in to 7. I'm guessing it's a driver issue that will be fixed as soon as it's logged in and can download the ones it lost, but I have no way of doing that now - anyone know how to log into an account on a Windows 7 machine without using the mouse?
|>>|| No. 24612
As daft as it sounds, does hitting enter not do it? Or at least take you to the password box? It's been a while since I've used Windows 7.
|>>|| No. 24613
Balls. Neither Tab nor Enter do anything - there are two accounts, which may be the problem, or the upgrade-downgrade process may have buggered the keyboard as well as the mouse, it seems. Any other suggestions from anyone? I'm reluctant to dig out the install disc and try repairing it from there as it's a multi-boot machine, and when I stuck the disc in last night it seemed to want to do a fresh install rather than detecting and offering to fix what's already there, though it was late and my brain was fuzzy so I may not have been paying enough attention.
|>>|| No. 24615
At this point he could have tested every key on his board many times over.
|>>|| No. 24616
You're right, I have tried this, and it looks like it's back to the install disc and the possibility of having to start all over again with the partition, and possibly the whole laptop. Balls, and thank god I backed everything up. Cheers for the suggestions anyway though gents.
|>>|| No. 24617
I think you probably knew this was coming, but have you tried turning it off and on again? In particular, try hitting the BIOS to make sure it knows the keyboard is actually there. It's very, very rare, even on a laptop, for Windows to not cotton on to the presence of a keyboard. FWIW, on my desktop at work, the Tab button gets me to my picture, Space or Return gets me to the password prompt, and Enter accepts the password.
|>>|| No. 24618
If I wanted to test Windows 10 out in a virtual machine, from a Windows host, how does this affect my existing Windows license?
|>>|| No. 24620
I have, and although it certainly recognises the keyboard in BIOS, GRUB, and even in Windows Error Recovery when it asks if I want to boot into Safe Mode, no combination of the keys you mentioned (or indeed any others) seems to work. Caps lock doesn't even trigger the warning light. It's bloody odd, frankly - like you, I've never seen Windows refuse to acknowledge a laptop keyboard this way, and I wonder what in the rollback process caused this fuck up.
|>>|| No. 24699
If you think hard drive space or internet usage is something to huff and puff over in 2015, you don't deserve desktop computing. If you think this is a matter of principle where you ought to have freedom over your own device, you're a moron. Most users don't understand Windows Update and their convenience outweighs your silly and contradictory ideals where you cherish an illusory sense control.
|>>|| No. 24700
Jesus Christ ladm8, who put sand in your vagina? Have a nice cup of tea and chill the fuck out.
Once you've had a cup of tea, would you care to explain why we shouldn't have freedom over the devices we own?
|>>|| No. 24701
You own two items, one is a license, one is a physical item that enables you to use that license. The terms of purchase are not the same.
|>>|| No. 24703
He's pointing out that it's not a case of "should" when it's a practical impossibility. Have you heard of Edward Snowden?
|>>|| No. 24704
I'm pretty sure that wasn't the point he was making, and if it was he's as dense as you.
(A good day to you Sir!)
|>>|| No. 24707
That's a valid point. I just find it slightly cuntish that when I bought my laptop with Windows 8 pre-installed I had no idea how fucking sneaky they'd be trying to get me to upgrade to windows 10 - an operating system that seems designed to pilfer my user data for the benifit of MS and its preferred partners.
|>>|| No. 24708
It's not very nice but frankly you agreed to it when you bought the machine with that OS as part of the bundle. MS get away with what they can but the onus is on the consumer to not just blindly take whatever their favourite technology company releases next. I'm not meaning to insult, it's not like I didn't do the same, it's just complacency on the consumer's part. Apple could release a phone tomorrow that explicitly said to its users what it was doing and a myriad more, say, inbuilt DNA sampler directly uploaded to the police and Apple's own profiling database, but people would buy it in their millions because nobody cares.
|>>|| No. 24711
>Any sage advice for someone not wanting to be tracked and monitored on a PC?
Not from me, I actually know bugger all about computers and tracking. Just a tad about commercial operations.
|>>|| No. 24714
Or you could donate money to your local church and hope god will safeguard your privacy.
|>>|| No. 24715
>It's not very nice but frankly you agreed to it when you bought the machine with that OS as part of the bundle.
I beg your pardon?
|>>|| No. 24716
Debian works well if your not scared of Linux. The only subversive tracking there is what you install yourself (popularity contest, tracking package installation being about as close as it gets to monitoring — but if course its opt-in).
|>>|| No. 24717
Debian popcon is pretty honest about what's collected. You are usually prompted to install it during a new installation but it is an active choice rather than sneaking in through the back door, and if you do install it opting out is as simple as removing the package.
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