No. 13598Anonymous 18th November 2020 Wednesday 12:55 pm13598Just got 5 people sacked at work (1/3 of the firm). Feels a bit weird.
Hi gents,
Just woke up to a message from a colleague that he'd been suspended with pay, along with 4 other people including me, from our accountancy firm. He's fairly certain we're on the fast track to the sack. Excuse me if I ramble slightly.
We have a slack chat (yes, this is predictable) that I set up a few years ago, and that we got complacent about using in work outside of Microsoft Teams to coordinate, and sometimes vent about our boss. Over the years we became less careful and more vitriolic, and finally I was furloughed on a weekend and didn't go back into the office due to pandemic, leaving my work computer locked and logged on with a slack window open somewhere. Dum dum duhhhm. Everyone on it gets a call from HR warning of suspension, apart from the newest guy who gets terminated.
So, 2 of them are elated. They described it as being in a toxic relationship and suddenly having it ended for you. The 3rd guy was on the ropes with his relationship with our boss, who wasn't happy with his output and has been looking at sacking for a while, while the fourth guy is newly joined, basically trusted that he was being let into something secure, and I now feel very bad about him. We have contacts, we can provide references, so he's going to be able to get something else. Since he was so new he's been terminated for 'rude messages' apparently, officially 'misconduct'. Personally I was already looking for jobs because I've just hit my 2 year and that was my limit.
I'm about to go for a joint and buy a beer and sit watching Star Trek while it all seeps in. I've changed the password and deleted the workspace so nothing more can be collected, if anything was. I hope to god the boss has got some screenshots otherwise I might be tempted to ask for proof and be a dick about it. Anyway, he probably has so he can pass them on to HR. How does one prepare for a meeting where you know that someone you have absolutely no respect for is going to try and make you feel bad for mocking them? Also, if I'm on furlough and the HR lady is calling me on whatsapp, am I under any obligation to answer?
He's literally got 1/3 of his staff on line for the sack. He heard a few weeks ago of a woman who had £250,000 worth of client turnover and was doing the whole thing herself on Xero, so now he thinks "I have a million quid turnover, surely I can do this with 4 people", forgetting that she has dictated the client relationships and records processes from the start, whereas half our clients are builders or mechanics whose idea of good recordkeeping is to make sure that only half the crumpled receipt is covered in splotches. It's all going to end in flames for him, the remaining seniors are leaving as soon as their 2 years are up. Everyone who's been suspended is prodding at the idea of whistleblowing (our boss engages in dodgy practices) now that we have nothing to lose. Also leaving glassdoor reviews.
Anyway, I digress. I've got some jobs to look at now! Feel free to call me a twat for not practising good opsec.
>>13643 On the upside, when the question comes up at interview "why did you leave your last job?" you can answer "my boss was a sex pest and he fired me for helping his victims speak up".
>>13644 Yeah, had a false start then figured I'd benefit from just taking Christmas off to convalesce. Starting to apply again but I'm just bricking it about the questions - I just had a voicemail from a recruitment agent saying he had work in cloud based integration, and then "How are things going at [company]?".
I want to say that I had an unaddressed HR complaint that contributed to a toxic working environment and a falling out with my boss. Does that smell bad? Should I add that I can provide more details if necessary?
Is there an equivalent of 'no comment' that's not immensely suspicious? 3 of the most senior staff at the firm will give me a reference provided the boss doesn't find out, and a dozen or so former clients would be happy to confirm my experience, so I'm feeling fairly confident in that area.
>On the upside, when the question comes up at interview "why did you leave your last job?" you can answer "my boss was a sex pest and he fired me for helping his victims speak up".
Is there a synergistic, blue skies euphemism for that? "He's a friend of Jimmy Saville?"
Personally I'd just say I left because I wasn't being challenged in my work or whatever wishy washy interview answer you'd normally give. If your referees know not to mention you were fired, they never need to find out.
>>13679 Presumably the 'gross misconduct' doesn't need to come up then.
>>13680 This one worries me, when furlough is being handed out so freely, is it plausible that I chose to quit instead of just take the money and look for other jobs?
I've had to get a job after gross misconduct once before, when I was sacked from Crowne Plaza for making myself a sandwich in the staff canteen after work.
"Now this is very important, did you make the sandwich *before* your shift ended, or *afterwards*?"
>>13682 You had problems at another workplace too? Jesus, lad. You sound like a bad egg.
Usually, it is better to not mention why you were sacked, etc. If you have senior people who will give you good references, it is probably best to say you were made redundant. If you are middle management or lower, nobody will be looking deeper into it.
>Usually, it is better to not mention why you were sacked, etc. If you have senior people who will give you good references, it is probably best to say you were made redundant.
Thanks mate, I appreciate the reassurance.
My eggability is debatable...I almost burned down/flooded the same bar in a 3 month period, they seemed okay with it. Then I go to a corporate bar and make myself a sandwich in the staff canteen after my shift and bam, gross misconduct. They fired the supervisor who informed on me for using the reception phone to order his taxi a couple of months and 100% non mgmt staff turnover within 6 months.
I'll take my share of the blame, especially for the fire and flood and the chat server, but for the sandwich? That's simply a difference of opinion that didn't go my way.
>Try to keep the next job you get, mate.
Cheers, I just need to pick the right one. I'm not a great lad but I'm not a proper cunt, I've worked with some amazing managers, but they're never the ones in charge :/
>>13684 'After my shift finished' was the wrong answer. Thing is I got on with people there, it was just a surprisingly tight ship and if I had any enemies I didn't know it. Supervisor thought I'd just get a light bollocking. Ah well, bigger and better.
I'm very confused, why was making yourself a sandwich in the staff canteen an act worthy of 'gross misconduct'? Why did they object to this practice? Were they completely clear from the outset that sandwich-making was frowned upon round these parts?
>>13686 Crowne Plaza are owned by IHG and therefore seem to have quite a strict code of conduct. It was classified as 'theft', can't say fairer than that.
>>13689 It's the lifeblood of the industry to be honest. Surprised I never tried it on shift. I once did a pill at Bestival and it took me 15 minutes to make 5 mixed doubles. Only the senior staff were allowed to take the last hour of their shift off having dropped acid. Festival bartending is an interesting one.
Now I've got a phone call at 1330, references are mostly in pocket, I just need to not be a twat.
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No. 13725Anonymous 18th February 2021 Thursday 5:58 pm13725sackedlad - do HR ever second guess references?
I've been offered an unfairly good job 'subject to satisfactory references'. I've sent them the contact details of a senior employee at my sacked role who likes me, and those of the guy I've been working with since.
Will an established company second guess me, or will they just contact the references provided? The firm I left is really small, 15 staff and 2 partners. Is there a chance that they'd phone into reception or contact a partner on linkedin?
I just can't relax. Elated when I was told I was going to be given a contract, but spent all today shitting it that they might not contact my provided references. Should I be worried about that?
They're just going to contact the references you gave them. It'd be thoroughly weird to go out of their way to talk to a different person. If they did that for you they'd presumably do it for everyone, and what an absolute fuck on that would be.
>>13728 Always polite to tell referees you've used their names. Or even, you know, ask first.
If it's a timing thing, that's what 'references available on request' is for, to avoid telling the people you're working for that you're currently banging out CVs left, right & centre.
>>13729 Haha, I've certainly confirmed that these people are happy to give me a reference. Did you think I hadn't even asked?
>If it's a timing thing, that's what 'references available on request'
That's what I put things out with. I had references sorted but didn't want to get anyone in hot water if my CV got back to my old job. The ones I've got are happy for me to use their work email addresses, will just say "He didn't have my permission" if an email turns up in their inbox asking about me. The old boss has monitored emails before, so it's a fair concern but yeah, should be fine.
>>13727 I've been told that even when you've been shit at your job employers tend not to give negative references because you have the right to see what they wrote and if you fail to land a job because of something they put that was inaccurate you can sue the pants off them. Is that right?
>>13733 although a lot of places apparently say nothing positive or negative and merely confirm dates and position. I don't think you can read much into that.
I'm involved in hiring at the moment and it's horrible. Trying to get someone to prove technical competence, to see if they've done the things they talk about, or just seen them done and interview well. If it was my company, I'd hire them for a short fixed contract, but it's not. 4 hour interview on Monday. Fucking great. I'm sure the candidate isn't much keener than I am.
>>13731 Only...4 of them? That's about 30%, could be worse. Fortunately despite being a general retard, in small bursts I'm smart and confident, so interview fairly well.
>>13733 I was wondering about emailing them from a puppet address and saying "This chap is applying for a job, what's the skinny" and seeing what they said, hopefully giving me grounds to sue them or something. Probably wont, the world isn't a soap.
>>13734 What industry necessitates such a long interview process?
>>13734 I don't think I took 4 hours total in process with the company I'm about to join, between all the calls with the recruiter, the panel interview and the technical exercise.
Like you, I don't think I've ever spent more than four our five hours total on the entire recruitment process, and not to blow my own knob but I've had some fairly serious/important roles.
Security vetting is another fucking story, but I don't count that, as it comes after the job offer.
Yeah, it's unusual. He's got to work with three small, highly technical but very broad remit teams spread across 7 time zones, and we all have to approve him (after a previous hire interviewed well but turned out to be a gimp. )
Hiring me took much less time, but my godlike skills are clear to all. Unfortunately, my skills don't include divining truth at interview. Not that I interviewed the gimp, he predated me.
I'm spending the weekend trying to come up with a couple of technical teasers for a gifted generalist.
Ah, fuck, other people have it worse. I just don't like the process of hiring people.
>Unfortunately, my skills don't include divining truth at interview.
I have this skill. I can tell a wrong'un before he's even sat down. People think I'm being unreasonable when I make these judgements, but they always end up admitting I was right. The only issue with my skill is that it's definitely illegal to use.
>>13739 Unfortunately our sales manager really doesn't. He has the gift of the gab but I reckon he just ends up picking people he enjoys talking at rather than people who show any competence.
When the CEO gets involved with interviews though, he basically just stares people down and asks a few blunt questions that get right to the point of whether they have the smarts for the job.
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No. 13742Anonymous 28th February 2021 Sunday 9:27 pm13742How do I verify the number of sick days I've had?
Hopefully final question from this. I sent them two references, one from sacking job and one from my current role. The mate I've been working with for the past 3 months got his reference request email pretty prompt, and responded back. However my reference from the sacking job, John, didn't receive anything, and when I contacted the new job to ask if they sent my manager there anything, they responded saying "John? Sorry I'm not sure who you're talking about. Anyway, I'm just finalising your staff portal account now, you'll receive an invitation soon". This was quite confusing, since his name was the first out of the two. Maybe they just asked the guy from my current role?
I got the email back later that afternoon, with the invitation etc. So I think I'm basically in. I've been asked 'How many sick days have you had in x years'. How do they verify this? How do I? I know I've had some, but fuck knows how many. Had insomnia a couple of years back and I know I had a few days then, and again when I broke my hand, and I got sick notes both times, but I also took a few 'normal' sick days off, and again some half days and short shifts.
They've asked for my GP details, so presumably they'll be contacting them to verify official sick days, but I've got no idea how many I've had. I don't want to lie but I also don't know what level of scrutiny will be applied. Also I absolutely will want to lie if it's more than 10 because that seems a bit dodgy.
Even if it did, they still shouldn't need medical details, at least not for anything I've ever seen. If they need to verify you're fit to work it should be through a third party medical exam, rather then your entire history.
>>13747 UKSV can request medical history if you have any background of mental illness, addiction or something else that could make you 'vulnerable'. I've not heard of an actual company doing it as well but I suppose it could happen, if say HR/security need to know to keep an eye on you in case you seem depressed. All round it's a very odd request though, I would certainly think twice about this place unless they have a good reason for it.
Interesting. I didn't actually know that, though to be fair I have only ever dealt with clearances up to CTC level and even then it's done through our governing body so it's probably even more opaque than when you do it directly.
I've checked the wording and it says "We will not contact your doctor without your prior written consent" just underneath the box asking for GP office address, so that seems above board.
>Sharing your medical data without your explicit consent is very illegal.
Reassuring. Apparently I have no faith in our privacy.
>Does this job require a security clearance?
It's just a small accounting firm.
>I would certainly think twice about this place unless they have a good reason for it.
I've checked the wording as above, so does that make it seem any better?
>>13750 >I've checked the wording as above, so does that make it seem any better?
Not really. Why would a small accounting firm need this information, and what level of clearance are they doing?
>>13750 To be honest and again, it's highly irregular. Unless you've got something else lined up though I'd probably reluctantly give them the details - they can't actually contact your GP without your consent and it's not a good time to be out of work.
Given your shit luck and personal life though I might recommend given the civil service a few applications while you wait for this all to process. Shit pay but they treat you right.
I work in an environment that requires security vetting, has a relatively high risk of injury and the possibility of sudden accidents, required a medical exam to check I was even fit to work, and yet my employer still did not ask for my GP's details.