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|>>|| No. 29828
It was both a happening and a nothingburger, as the kids call it, at the same time. A woman was tragically shot, but all the did was sniff some seats and then leave.
I get that's a big deal and the word coup isn't hyperbole here, Trump incited this mob and might very well get 25th amendment'd as a result, but I just can't bring myself to care beyond watching them collapse under the weight of their own hubris with a morbid fascination.
Pandora's box has been opened; you can't just put "Well, actually, no. You cheated!" back in the box. This will happen every 4 years now and the GoP's legislative mandate is completely fucked for at least a decade. We might very well see Biden push through gun control in the wake of a turbulent inauguration or invoke the sedition act to jail Trump and his children, supported by the majority of Republicans, in an attempt to put this fire out because he will not shut the fuck up after Jan 20th.
He'll keep holding rallies.
|>>|| No. 29829
The irony of the Trump government being responsible for gun control legislation, even indirectly, is kind of amusing.
|>>|| No. 29831
About 43 seconds in you see her trying to climb through into the corridor before getting blasted.
|>>|| No. 29832
Trump is never going to admit he lost. His speech at the rioters was not one of you are wrong. It was 'wait for the right moment' until they make a fool of him at trial and sentence him to death there is going to be a looming threat he is going to decide 'now is the time to take our country back'
|>>|| No. 29833
Trump was noticeably not mentioned in the decision not to bring in the national guard.
|>>|| No. 29835
The video you linked is down but I've seen it posted elsewhere. I found it to be extremely harrowing. The vibes of the whole thing were very similar to LARPers.
In this video a sobbing woman is upset that she was maced whilst 'storming the capital' as part of 'the revolution'
Trump's last Tweet before he was banned was immediately deleted and said "Remember this day forever".
The insurrection(?) started an hour after Trump Tweeted an attack at Mike Pence for not supporting his bogus claims.
George Monbiot's recent article in the Guardian bears re-reading
>It might seem strange to note that the US was lucky to get Trump, but it was, in this respect: while he is power-mad and entirely lacking in conscience and empathy, he is also impetuous and incompetent, and failed to follow a clear programme. In other words, he was a hopeless wannabe dictator. He was also unfortunate: were it not for the pandemic, he might have won again. But he has blazed a trail for someone more effective: someone with Trump’s absence of moral constraint, but with a determined programme and a cold, strategic mind. If Biden fails to break the political consensus, in 2024 he could open the door to a competent autocrat.
|>>|| No. 29836
I'm just glad that America has the Pandemic under control and it's not like Hospitals are turning away heart attack patients in LA or anything, so they will be well able to manage what is almost certainly a superspreader event.
|>>|| No. 29837
You've got to be a special kind of stupid to try and break into a corridor with this waiting for you at the other end. They genuinely seem to have the mentality that the police wouldn't resist them because the police should only target other people. The LARPing during protesting of people screaming things like "MEDIC!" really is something else.
|>>|| No. 29839
This was his last throw.
People are apparently resigning in droves and he's locked himself in the Oval office.
|>>|| No. 29840
These people are on some bicmaeral mind shit, I'm telling you. Look me in the eye and tell me they're capable on self-reflection or questioning, indeed any kind of rationality at all. One could draw parallels between these actions and the summer's BLM protests, but the fundemental difference is that there was a basis in reality for what occured then, whereas this is all make believe. There was no ballot dumping or fake votes delivered by Ferrari fronted convoy, no threat of imminent Muslamo-Communist takeover, just the election of a fairly bland old man with nary a radical bone in his body.
|>>|| No. 29842
Fresh off the boat
Wet behind the ears
When he's first banned
There'll be floods of tears
|>>|| No. 29843
Was hooked on a multifeed of people streaming from inside the riots last night, it was absolutely bizarre and just fucking hilarious, I guarantee there's going to be comedic gold coming from the footage for weeks to come. Also can you really call it storming? It was more like they fatly waddling into the capitol, the police even let them in then treated them with kid gloves the entire time. If this had been BLM there'd be bodies littering the steps.
|>>|| No. 29844
Matt Christman of Chapotraphouse is saying they let them do this because the mob is throwing a tantrum about a celebrity they like, whereas the BLM movement was looking for a fundamental structural change to the status quo [maybe].
I'm getting insta posts from American friends and apparently the Q folks have already integrated this into their narrative. The protestors were antifa hired by Soros. The people who died are crisis actors. This was all orchestrated by the Deep State to give them carte blanche to do Totalitarianism.
It is weirdly ironic that this political movement is so weird and incongruous that when the kind of people who create this sort of spectacle watch it on the news and are like 'no way that's real' and so double down on the magical thinking.
|>>|| No. 29846
I want to find this funny in how she just identified and implicated herself in sedition or whatever it is as though nothing will come of it but she's right, she won't be punished for that.
|>>|| No. 29847
And just think, it's only January. Shame I can no longer find the one of the protestor smoking a big fat biff on some congressman's desk.
|>>|| No. 29848
I read somewhere that you can tell whether they were Antifa or genuine patriots by whether they turned their MAGA caps back to front.
|>>|| No. 29849
>in 2024 he could open the door to a competent autocrat
That may be, but on the other hand, Hitler, for one, was not a competent autocrat as such, even though he oversaw the most pernicious autocracy in modern history. He had been a failure at virtually everything he attempted as a career in his adult life, and at one time lived literally on a few quid a week that he was making from selling hand painted tourist postcards.
What he did have was the gift of the gab and a talent to win over people with a preexisting grudge at public speaking events. And he came in at a time when the German people were still reeling from the disgrace of a lost world war, and had a lack of emotional investment in the first-ever democracy on German soil that they felt was forced on them in an act of victor's justice. Voting for the Nazi party was a form of protest to many, it was their chance to stick it to the newly emerged, unloved political system.
In America, on the other hand, I believe there are still well enough people who, even if they are Republican supporters, will not stand for this, who deeply believe in American democracy, and they will realise that things have gone too far now. Add to that more than half of voters who very convincingly gave Biden a majority, and there is much hope that even a wannabe autocrat cut from the same cloth as Trump but decidedly more cunning will have a hard time taking over. The checks and balances and the safeguards in the American government system against an autocratic revolution are much greater than they were during the Weimar Republic.
|>>|| No. 29851
It's important to have signals like that so you can tell apart the people who are all behaving in exactly the same manner.
|>>|| No. 29852
Trump's a madman, along with the most fanatical of his supporters, but I can't help but wonder what the media reaction would have been if the BLM lot had pulled a similar stunt. CNN and The Guardian would most likely be cumming in their pants with glee at "a fierce display of defiance from oppressed people of colour against our systemically racist government", images of activists doing Black Power salutes in the Senate chambers would get billions of views on Instagram and the protagonists would be propelled to MLK/Rosa Parks levels of fame and become instant icons, Biden would commend the protests and DAs would decline to press charges "in the interests of justice". A lot of the faux-outrage from the Yank left, who now seem to care about law and order all of a sudden after months of gleefully cheering on riots and similar attacks against Federal buildings, seems to be rooted in their disgust that their opponents are finally using their own tactics against them. "Political violence is only bad when their lot do it, when we do it it's righteous anger!" might as well be their mantra.
|>>|| No. 29854
>"Political violence is only bad when their lot do it, when we do it it's righteous anger!" might as well be their mantra.
You know, there is a BLM mantra that has emerged from this. I think it's "You're a both-sidesing tosspot" or something like that.
|>>|| No. 29855
Entitled (in some cases armed) conspiracy theorists trying to do insurrection at the state capital because they object to the outcome of an election isn't exactly the same as people doing civil disobedience to protest civil rights issues born of slavery though is it lad?
I don't recall seeing Grauniad articles frothing about how good CHAZ was, but maybe I'm mistaken.
Stop doing culture war. You are ruining everything.
|>>|| No. 29856
Well, no, you clearly don't read CNN or The Guardian because that's not the tone of a single line of their news reporting ever, Biden largely ignored the summer's protests and as I stated in an earlier post ITT what BLM were protesting was real, the grievences of the pro-Trump people are all imaginary. Beyond glass being broken it's not really the same thing at all.
|>>|| No. 29857
Ah yes, today I learned "civil disobedience" means 6 months of rioting, looting, burning, destroying businesses, dragging people out of cars and beating them and trying to burn down court houses, all because a career criminal methhead OD'd while getting arrested. You woke types can't stop playing the victim even when the entire global media is sucking you off relentlessly, it's a joke.
|>>|| No. 29858
Ah yes, typical ad hominem attack from an irate wokeist, why don't you go and take a knee for your Saint Georgie Gud Boi who Dindu Nuffin and cry about how oppressed you are while the entire global media sucks you off.
(A good day to you Sir!)
|>>|| No. 29862
> the grievences of the pro-Trump people are all imaginary
No, they aren't really. At least not universally. A lot of people who voted for Trump were part of the disenfranchised rural white male working class who had seen their jobs and their social status dwindle away in recent years. They were one of the blind spots of Obama's presidency, where the proclaimed focus in domestic policy was more on diversity and gender equality.
It's easy to say it's all Trump's fault for inciting them. And much of it is, without a doubt. But you have to ask where some of those people were coming from four years ago, and a lot of them actually were able to get back into work during the Trump boom years, so what do you think who the average flag waving, white trash, white male redneck is going to thank for that.
|>>|| No. 29863
Oh stop it. These are the people who Obama wanted to provide better quality of life for who were too stupid, gullible, arrogant and vain to vote in their own self-interest because they think they are pending millionares.
|>>|| No. 29864
So it begins.
Why do we never get any of the exciting stuff over here? Americans have all the fun.
|>>|| No. 29865
Hey so here's a thing, weird shibboleth insults you picked up from whatever insular 4chan-esque community you got them from tend to fall a bit flat when you try to insult people who don't know or care what you're trying to say.
|>>|| No. 29866
>That may be, but on the other hand, Hitler, for one, was not a competent autocrat as such, even though he oversaw the most pernicious autocracy in modern history. He had been a failure at virtually everything he attempted as a career in his adult life, and at one time lived literally on a few quid a week that he was making from selling hand painted tourist postcards.
It's odd to find myself defending Hitler but I don't see how that's unusual. You could do worse than spending your 20s being a drifter trying to break into art while recklessly spending all your money at the opera. If anything that's what you're supposed to be doing.
This criticism always reads like the typical finger-wagging from squares that tells you a lot more about how they've wasted their own life.
|>>|| No. 29868
Mate, the people who can afford to fuck off to Washington DC for a few days, dress up like Andy the Army Man and buy every Trump nick-nack they can find aren't the "disenfranchised rural white male working class" (which isn't really how class works, but alright), these are a bunch of weekend warriors hopped up on conspiracies about Satanic carpet-bagger cults and election rigging. I'm not saying there aren't deep seated economic issues in American society that enabled Trump's victory, but these people are the American dream come true, they've got everything they want.
|>>|| No. 29869
It's worth a go if you can stomach the outrageous ticket prices these days. Give an accessible production like H.M.S. Pinafore a go.
But it's more about that you do what you want to do.
|>>|| No. 29870
I think there's a few reasons:-
- We're too polite to people's faces. You won't see British people doing something brash and in your face like covering your car in bumper stickers saying things like "Tories are scum" or a t-shirt emblazoned with "A vote for Labour is a vote for hepatitis" in huge letters. We'd rather just tut.
- People are just wearily resigned to things gradually getting worse over time. Nobody wants to make a scene by protesting and if they have to take a few days off unpaid for it then they're worried they might not be able to cover the mortgage. Protesting in this country kind of died with the invasion of Iraq.
- Nobody can agree on what they'd want as an alternative. Jeremy pissing Corbyn could have used the momentum he'd build up to launch a massive drive to encourage people to unionise and organise for better working conditions, but he was too focused on empty gestures rather than action that could have actually made a difference.
|>>|| No. 29871
Hitler was only going to the Opera because BTS didn't exist yet.
|>>|| No. 29872
My actual point was that autocrats are rarely career politicians who have worked their way up all their lives through the ranks before they suddenly usurped power, either through a coup or a democratic election. I'm not sure how you are going to define "competence" in this respect, but it doesn't normally have to mean actual political competence.
You can be a quite incompetent autocrat if you make up for your lack of true leadership with ruthlessness and a talent to influence people in all the wrong ways.
What became Trump's downfall was that in a certain way, the stars had aligned against him. In a country like the U.S., you can't just quell BLM protests by sending in a few National Guard units. And in a global pandemic that leaves hundreds of thousands of your countrymen dead, you can't pretend it's just a flu and willfully ignore all that's going on.
All that doesn't mean that Trump doesn't have the chops for a true autocrat. The time just wasn't right for him to really come into his own.
|>>|| No. 29874
Also, calling Hitler a "drifter" trying to break into art kind of unjustly puts him in the same category as some Millennial who spends his days editing his youtube videos in an artisan coffee shop using their free wi fi.
That image would only be true if that youtubing, wi fi mooching Millennial was also a glowing nationalist with a psychotic hatred against Jews.
|>>|| No. 29877
Ah yes, "reapers", the immortal race of sentient starships allegedly waiting in darkspace. We have dismissed this claim.
|>>|| No. 29880
I took a lass to see 'The Magic Flute' Opera once and didn't know how racist it was beforehand, the girl was asian and I sat in horror as I read the subtitles they projected so you could understand what the characters were saying. I apologised afterwards, but it quickly became apparent that she wasn't reading the subtitles and missed all the racism.
|>>|| No. 29883
Yeah I realised after I posted that this was a sanitized version of it. This character is a villain called Monostatos, and most of his villainy seems to stem from the fact that he is black and likes to sleep with white women. The production I saw didn't change the songs or the dialogue from the original.
Incidentally, the production I saw was put on by
Kosky's Komische Oper Berlin and it was very cool.
|>>|| No. 29885
Now we're getting into it aren't we.
"But it was different when we did it!" isn't the point. As far as the establishment cares, you're a troublemaker just the same. Stop buying into the culture war narrative- You are not on the opposite side to these people, they are disenfranchised members of the proletariat just the same as the people rioting for BLM were. You have simply been misled in a polarised direction, because that's exactly what the people in charge actually want, and look how well it's working.
Take the blinkers off and look how well it's working. Twitter and the like is flooding with outrage that only four people were killed during this incident as if that means the police weren't hard enough, same people who have been yelling about abolishing the police all summer long.
Just ask yourself. Who do you think benefits from all this? The average American knows something is deeply wrong with their country, but there are two giant cultural honeypots waiting to safely capture their anger and frustration and direct it in an entirely harmless direction. For one side it's at the abstract, intangible concept of white supremacy, and for the other it's some ever changing tinfoil hat paranoia. Both sides think the other is entirely responsible for their grievances and neither will ever acheive any meaningful impact or change.
This is all very frustrating. People really do treat politics like supporting a sports team, and completely flip their attitudes to something they would be condemning when their side does it. Things are only going to get worse in this country the more time we spend gazing longingly across the pond and importing their fucking mentally stunted political discourse.
|>>|| No. 29887
>In this video a sobbing woman is upset that she was maced whilst 'storming the capital' as part of 'the revolution'
She was actually walking around with an onion in a towel and rubbing that in her eyes to give off the impression of being maced.
|>>|| No. 29890
Also, who wears a keyboard scarf?
Clearly a Deep State Operative.
Maybe it's an emotional support onion bigot
|>>|| No. 29891
This is also a good trick if you ever need to cry on demand in social situations, like to gain sympathy.
|>>|| No. 29892
>Take the blinkers off and look how well it's working. Twitter and the like is flooding with outrage that only four people were killed during this incident as if that means the police weren't hard enough, same people who have been yelling about abolishing the police all summer long.
That's not really what's been happening - see >>29854 for reference.
|>>|| No. 29896
Oh, sorry, your obnoxious ellipses changed my mind. You're right, twitter is full of people who wanted more people to die, rather than questioning why so fewer did than in similar events where the people were different colours.
|>>|| No. 29897
You're still not listening. Four people were killed. The underlying assumption of "you don't shoot them" is demonstrably false. They do shoot them.
People are lapping up the culture war where it's two sides of the people versus each other, when it's only ever been the establishment against the people.
|>>|| No. 29899
Much as I am shocked at the events just like anybody, CNN right now is being the usual liberal soap box where they aren't so much reporting the actual news as they are icessantly blabbering into their own echo chamber, using news soundbites solely to corroborate their points wherever it suits them.
If I was a dyed in the wool Republican supporter, this would only make me hate Liberals more. This is not how you make people at that end of the spectrum realise how fucked in the head they are for worshipping Trump the way they do.
|>>|| No. 29900
>The underlying assumption of "you don't shoot them" is demonstrably false
That might be because that's only the underlying assumption if you take it out of context. It says "you don't shoot them like you shoot us". In the same manner, in the same number, for the same reasons. Like. "You don't make love to me like you used to" does not mean "You don't make love to me", despite you misreading that into it.
|>>|| No. 29902
So in other words, they're outraged that only four people were killed, which is exactly what I said.
I never suggested they want more people killed, because I know that isn't what they want. But they are still spinning it to suit their narrative, in the same way that you're reading that inference into my argument when it isn't there.
Do you have figures to hand of how many people were killed in the black lives matter protests? Let's compare apples to apples if we really want to put it to bed. Those went on all summer so I'd imagine it's many more than four, but even then this line of reasoning reads like "as long as you only kill four people per protest we're even." If four people were killed in a single afternoon here, how many would have died in a sustained movement?
|>>|| No. 29903
>So in other words, they're outraged that only four people were killed, which is exactly what I said.
I suspect you may be retarded.
|>>|| No. 29904
>Four people were killed.
One was killed, three keeled over of their own accord.
Normally in these situations you'd say "imagine if it was the other way around", but we don't have to imagine. When BLM arrived in DC, they were met by police in full riot gear and the National Guard. When a heavily armed mob of Trump supporters turned up, the police were taking selfies with them. However you slice it, the disparity in policing speaks for itself.
|>>|| No. 29905
Yes, but if you look at what lots of BLM are saying on twitter and pretend it means the opposite, then both sides.
|>>|| No. 29906
I wonder if it would have been a different matter were Biden already sitting comfortably in the White House, rather than it being the final days of Trump's administration?
|>>|| No. 29907
You can snark about both sides all you want, but >>29885 is absolutely right. The culture war acheives nothing and never will.
|>>|| No. 29908
>When a heavily armed mob of Trump supporters turned up, the police were taking selfies with them.
They also literally stepped aside to let them in.
What if the state appears to be warring against a specific culture?
|>>|| No. 29909
Then that might be a different matter, except it isn't. The state is pulling the strings to pit two sides of the populace against one another while the billionaires kick back and laugh at everyone.
|>>|| No. 29910
Maybe, but he's on some completely batshit mental gymnastics to get there.
|>>|| No. 29911
>Twitter and the like is flooding with outrage
Piss off you daft cunt, do not spill actual human shit on the floor and call it a citation. If you want to talk about Twitter fuck off onto Twitter.
As I've stated three times now, the BLM protests were about a real issue with visible consquences. These Trumpoids are protesting against Satanists in government and imaginary election rigging, this is not Les Miserables, we are not witnessing the cry of a forgotten underclass nor are they griping about a lack of COVID relief or arguing for any kind of shake up to who is served best by the American economic system. This is not the other side of the coin we are looking at, it is a derranged and irrational ideology with few ideas based in reality outside of worshipping Trump. Ideas like the "Great Replacement" and Barrack Obama being a secret Islamist are commonplace, this is not the natural counter position to a $15 minimum wage and having to wear a mask during a pandemic.
|>>|| No. 29912
That hasn't really been the case in America. Ever. The state has always been at war with African Americans, with the support of "poor" white people.
|>>|| No. 29916
Not a single person in this thread has given credence to their claims and you're predictably missing the point. You're exactly the kind of person >>29885 was talking about and he's right.
|>>|| No. 29917
No lad, no it hasn't.
The American state had complete and utter dominion over black people for the longest time. It wasn't a war because there was no enemy. Furthermore, the emancipation of black people, when it finally happened, was not a struggle hard fought and won by humanitarian progressives, it was a cynical and calculated move by capital. Poor white people (I'm not sure why you felt the need for quotation marks) have always been kept in their place by the fear that they could end up like the black people.
You need to learn some history and stop being such a bloody limp liberal bellend. It has only ever been class war. It will only ever be class war. Class really is what it all comes down to, every time.
|>>|| No. 29918
>the BLM protests were about a real issue with visible consquences
The BLM protests were a distraction. Police brutality in America is now seen as a "black issue" rather than an issue affecting everyone. Sage because we discussed this enough in other threads.
|>>|| No. 29920
Yes, I'm pretty sure the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was signed into law with no protests or bloodshed. It was all them capitalists that done it. There is no class in the US. Just a bunch of tribes.
|>>|| No. 29922
The scariest thing to me is that there are people completely indoctrinated by this weird fucking cult, and whilst sure they may not be a majority there are tens if not hundreds of thousands of them. I'm really struggling to put into words what's so insidious about it, but it's the constant thing of despite their being 500+ 'days of reckoning' promised by 'Q' these people are undeterred, if not strengthened by that.
It's not entirely different to religious doomsday cults but they don't tend to have the implicit support of the US president and police force. It seems that the truly insane have also latched onto it - it makes sense as Q swallows up other conspiracies and brings them into the fold. Take the comments on this video, for example:
It's fucking terrifying that people are so dangerously wrong and nobody is stopping them.
|>>|| No. 29924
>There is no class in the US. Just a bunch of tribes.
Almost- There is no perception of class in the US, because it's all this nonsense. This tribalism is exactly what the establishment wants.
If the American people actually understood their social hierarchy, there would be a very real and dangerous possibility of them standing up in solidarity with one another, white man alongside black, and enacting meaningful material change.
|>>|| No. 29925
>It's fucking terrifying that people are so dangerously wrong and nobody is stopping them.
As you've said, it's more an amalgamation of different conspiracy groups and there's little consistent platform other than there's a bunch of pedos in government. Tinfoil with friends. In a way I think it's the level of disproportionate attention they've gotten which has led to a self-fulfilling prophesy and it's sustainability because it would easily implode under normal circumstances.
Fuck 'anybody stopping them' though, that sounds far more dangerous than a bunch of people with mental issues storming a government building so they can stand around confused and go home. The US has yet to reach the point of division and conflict it saw in the 1970s and I doubt it will.
|>>|| No. 29927
I'd add to your point that the Civil Rights Act also raised the rights of women - a feature either added precisely to defeat the bill by relying on sexism or one that attacked union the voting bases from political rivals.
|>>|| No. 29929
It's funny because nobody was really arguing "culture war" stuff in the thread until the both side guy came in hallucinating about it.
|>>|| No. 29930
The fact they had bombs and equipment for trying up hostages seems to be getting overlooked for "they wore goofy outfits and posed for selfies while dicking around."
|>>|| No. 29931
>Also can you really call it storming? It was more like they fatly waddling into the capitol, the police even let them in
I wish people would stop saying this superficial bollocks for a zingy hot take. Watch this from about 20:40 to 21:10 for the scale of what the police were actually up against.
|>>|| No. 29932
>I wish people would stop saying this superficial bollocks for a zingy hot take.
They're not, they're referring to this.
I don't think the fault lies with the officers on the gate though, between the three of them they didn't have much choice. The rioters were absolutely "let in" in the sense that the police knew this was coming and someone on the chain of command stopped them from preparing effectively.
|>>|| No. 29933
Well, sorry to spoil your circlejerk lad. Were you getting close?
I do have a bit of a denial fetish though so nah not actually sorry.
|>>|| No. 29935
There was a gate just around the corner on the steps from there which had already been breached so they didn't have a choice. However, that doesn't suit the narrative.
|>>|| No. 29936
>However, that doesn't suit the narrative.
Now you're being dishonest, implying that there was a large police presence that was overwhelmed. The DC Police Chief has admitted there weren't enough police there, due to there being no intelligence to suggest this would happen. Despite all the evidence saying it would happen. That's his excuse, anyway.
|>>|| No. 29937
DC authorities knew it was coming, so put in a request to mobilise the National Guard. Unlike the states, they can't just make it happen, it has to go through the federal government. The request was denied. In the end, the governors of Virginia and Maryland put their state police and NG on standby, but weren't able to actually deploy until it became an imminent danger (again, they'd have needed permission from the federal government to do so otherwise).
Trump hung them out to dry. DCNG were eventually deployed on orders from Pence and the Secretary of Defense, who presumably saw the writing on the wall, but gave the cover story of "POTUS was unreachable".
|>>|| No. 29938
Then why did the DC Police Chief go on record afterwards saying they had no intelligence suggesting this would happen? That seems to contradict your version of events.
|>>|| No. 29940
Absolutely, so why is he lying about the reason for the police not being appropriately prepared?
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