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gary larson predicts wuhan.png
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>> No. 33825 Anonymous
30th May 2021
Sunday 1:47 pm
33825 Coronavirus #4
Thread #2 was over 1,700 posts long; thread #3 (>>27266) is now close to 2,800 replies and no longer loads on my phone at work. Let's have a new, hopefully final thread.

The current situation:
Everything is expected to reopen on the 21st of June 2021.
It might not, because cases are rising from the lesser reopenings and the dreaded Indian variant.
Vaccination is going well in rich countries. UK deaths are ~10/day.
Speculation is starting again that the virus might have escaped from the Wuhan Institute of Virology, because it's such an intriguing coincidence, but reasonable people do not currently believe it was a deliberate Chinese conspiracy.
India is currently the country with the worst COVID-19 horror stories.

Will Dominic Cummings give any more evidence about the ineptitude of government handling, or has he said everything he wanted to say now?
Expand all images.
>> No. 33828 Anonymous
30th May 2021
Sunday 3:24 pm
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>Speculation is starting again that the virus might have escaped from the Wuhan Institute of Virology, because it's such an intriguing coincidence, but reasonable people do not currently believe it was a deliberate Chinese conspiracy.
The weight of the evidence is that it's very unlikely that it came from anywhere else. Given that one of the specific purposes of the institute was to intentionally mutate bat virus coronaviruses into a form that can infect humans to study, and there have been plenty of witness suggesting the lab followed the practice of throwing away used lab equipment without first washing it and locals would regularly search through their bins to collect glass to recycle.

In other coronavirus news, massive protests in Brazil against Bolsanaro or however it's spelt.
>> No. 33829 Anonymous
30th May 2021
Sunday 4:28 pm
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>>33825
I support this idea. Big threads are big.
>> No. 33834 Anonymous
30th May 2021
Sunday 7:51 pm
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>>33825
I suspect that even if Cummings does come back with hard evidence it won't matter much. I know this is what the Tory party wants me to feel, but their policy of stonewalling everything and admitting to nothing does appear very effective and enough of the country have entered a hybrid serf-bourgeoisie mode of thought in which they really think the thin blue line of conservatism, and the World King himself more specifically, is the only thing between them and horde of students and swarthy types forcing the country to join the Euro and eat whatever the lads in the food review thread keep posting. If there is a ministerial casuality it'll probably be Hancock, or maybe Cummings revealing that was the plan all along has scuppered that idea. The Labour Party might do some needling, but they appear to be run by a gender a swapped Nichola Murray and Peter Mandelson, a man so nostalgic for 1997 to 2005 I don't know if he's even been lucid for following sixteen years. Not to mention having hardly made a peep during the more severe stages of the pandemic the party doesn't have a leg to stand on in the eyes of many.

Sorry about the photo, I attached it by mistake and I don't know how to remove it.
>> No. 33836 Anonymous
30th May 2021
Sunday 8:19 pm
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>>33834
If you click on 'choose file' again but click cancel it should get rid of the image selected.
>> No. 33837 Anonymous
30th May 2021
Sunday 8:31 pm
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>>33834
>Sorry about the photo, I attached it by mistake and I don't know how to remove it.

Apologies are too late. Expect to find yourself hanging in a police cell by morning and the videotape of your cell later being found to have accidentally been taped over by the entire series of Boohbah.
>> No. 33838 Anonymous
30th May 2021
Sunday 10:52 pm
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>>33828

>one of the specific purposes of the institute was to intentionally mutate bat virus coronaviruses into a form that can infect humans

It's important to be pedantic enough to note, here, that this doesn't constitute "man made" any more than a golden retriever is man made.

Even if it is a deadly bioweapon, the leak was more likely some prick forgetting to wash their hands than deliberate conspiracy. It's hard to see what China has really acheived if this was some master stroke of villainy on their part.
>> No. 33839 Anonymous
30th May 2021
Sunday 11:20 pm
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>>33838

I think the general scientific consensus is that dogs having sex with dogs isn't man made.
>> No. 33840 Anonymous
30th May 2021
Sunday 11:22 pm
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>>33839

A lot of it is though.
>> No. 33841 Anonymous
31st May 2021
Monday 12:57 am
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>>33839
Lad wtf. What do you think breeding is?
>> No. 33842 Anonymous
31st May 2021
Monday 8:51 am
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>>33839

Different kind of Lab m8
>> No. 33843 Anonymous
31st May 2021
Monday 9:38 am
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>>33838

Saying it escaped from a lab due to carelessness is v. different from saying it's a bioweapon
>> No. 33844 Anonymous
31st May 2021
Monday 9:47 am
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>>33838
Arguing whether a virus produced via gain of function experimentation is man-made or not is the last response I expected, but I guess this is .gs after all.

A virus made this way is the intended result of direct human actions. It is not genetically engineered or manufactured. That's the distinction.

It's worth pointing out too that this type of research has been going on in the west for decades too, but there had been increasing amounts of pushback against it as the huge risks of an accidental release far outweigh the small benefits of doing the research. These Chinese labs were set up directly on the back of American experience and funding.
>> No. 33845 Anonymous
31st May 2021
Monday 4:45 pm
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>>33843
>>33844

I never implied anyone was saying that, you carpet-baggers. I was just making the statement for posterity, since a lot of conspiracy loons will leap directly from one to the other; and they will definitely conflate what amounts to selective breeding for research purposes with outright Umbrella Corp genetic manufacturing.
>> No. 33846 Anonymous
31st May 2021
Monday 6:08 pm
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>>33845
>I never implied anyone was saying that, you carpet-baggers.
Maybe you didn't imply it but you set the rest of us off.
>> No. 33847 Anonymous
31st May 2021
Monday 6:27 pm
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So if China did create a more virulent strain of bat-itis and through their carelessness created a global pandemic, if we have solid evidence of this, how much compo are we owed?
>> No. 33848 Anonymous
31st May 2021
Monday 6:49 pm
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>>33847
China would simply deny it. They're committing genocide at the moment and most countries are happy to accept their denial of this. I'd imagine the world is also too reliant on Chinese investment and manufacturing for there to be any form of real sanctions against them.
>> No. 33849 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 12:14 am
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>>33847

It's about time someone dropped a load of plague fleas on them again.
>> No. 33850 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 12:34 am
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>>33848
>I'd imagine the world is also too reliant on Chinese investment and manufacturing for there to be any form of real sanctions against them.

Probably, but it would be fun if we did an audit on the CCP members overseas assets anyway. Or at least that is until we find out that Xi Jinping owns half of London and is now the real Mr Kipling who can buy for our silence with an exceedingly good bribe.
>> No. 33851 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 1:50 am
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You'd think that now China is a hardworking business corporate environment, at least there would be plenty of opium going spare for the rest of us. But I haven't had even a sniff. This is absolutely scandalous.
>> No. 33852 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 3:24 pm
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The WHO has renamed all the variants with Greek letters, to stop India being offended when people are more afraid of their variant than ours. I think we're now the Alpha variant, and they have the Delta variant. The WHO says these names are easier to say, but also that the official scientific names (so, like, B1.64.3 or whatever) won't be changing, so it really is just to stop people calling them the South African variant and the Brazilian variant and so on, since those are perfectly easy to say already and we didn't need to rename them.

Maybe, just maybe, the WHO have no clue what they're doing?
>> No. 33853 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 3:35 pm
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>>33852
Or maybe they don't want leaders acting like cunts in the way that Seppo with the second-order combover did.
>> No. 33854 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 3:50 pm
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>>33852
Welcome to 2015.

https://www.who.int/news/item/08-05-2015-who-issues-best-practices-for-naming-new-human-infectious-diseases
>> No. 33855 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 3:59 pm
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>>33852
It's a shame they didn't use the NATO phonetic. We could've had a press announcement that Gove is carrying Charlie.

>>33853
Did anyone* really give a fuck about this; we might've had people (mostly continentals) talking about the English variant as a joke but I think we all understood that Indians don't emit covid. I don't think even back in the days of Spanish flu that Spaniards ended up targeted.

*aside from faceless morons on the internet
>> No. 33856 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 4:07 pm
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>>33852

It's sensible advice. It's not just about avoiding hurt feelings, but preventing the illusion that the "Indian variant" or "South African variant" will be contained within those borders. Nepal is also suffering from the "Indian variant", for example, making it an unhelpful misnomer.
>> No. 33857 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 4:09 pm
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>>33855
>talking about the English variant as a joke

Mate, you've seen the pictures of Singaporean, Japanese, and other-non Chinese peoples being beaten for their association with the virus.

The regional specifications do nothing apart from foster blame or negative sentiments towards the connected demographic. There is no advantage. Yeah, we're smart enough to know x, but is the next lad? Why is the location where a virus ended up mutating important information?
>> No. 33858 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 4:21 pm
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>>33856

Also they don't want to stigmatise countries for discovering variants. We don't actually know where these variants came from, we just know where they were first detected.

The UK, India and Brazil have high infection rates, but they also have big biotech industries with plenty of genome sequencing capacity. Countries that don't have that capacity are actively dis-incentivised from building it up by the fact that they'll get blamed for whatever variants they happen to find first.
>> No. 33859 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 4:37 pm
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>>33857
>Mate, you've seen the pictures of Singaporean, Japanese, and other-non Chinese peoples being beaten for their association with the virus.

No, I've heard of specific incidents involving Asian people getting abuse but that's just standard yellow-peril stuff fed by the virus specifically originating in China no matter how you name it. America specifically has a long tension with its Asian community.

The kind of asks you get around policing language are bullshit infantilization designed around the idea that racists won't just be racist and the false premise that we're language zombies.
>> No. 33860 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 4:53 pm
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>>33855
>Did anyone* really give a fuck about this
The East Asians who suffered harassment and violence for vaguely looking like they came from the same part of the world as first discovered the virus certainly gave rather a lot of fucks.
>> No. 33861 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 5:01 pm
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>>33859
>No, I've heard of specific incidents involving Asian people getting abuse but that's just standard yellow-peril stuff fed by the virus specifically originating in China no matter how you name it.
Jolly good, first step is acknowledging your ignorance.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-54048546

>The kind of asks you get around policing language are bullshit infantilization designed around the idea that racists won't just be racist and the false premise that we're language zombies.

What's your argument for using it? Why is it useful information to know where a variant was first documented, as opposed to the specifics of how that variant operates? What possible benefit is there?

If your grasp on language is so tenuous that you would lose all comprehension as a result of refraining from calling something an inflammatory name, then you really have more things to worry about.
>> No. 33862 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 5:49 pm
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>>33861
>What's your argument for using it? Why is it useful information to know where a variant was first documented, as opposed to the specifics of how that variant operates? What possible benefit is there?

What's the argument for not. As I've said, people are going to be racist to Asians no matter what you call it and I can think of no historical precedent from Spanish Flu to assume the name carried a stigma despite being in a supposedly less enlightened age.

You're just struggling to understand this because rewriting language is the most textbook example of a groupthink activity that achieves nothing and avoids the actual issue.
>> No. 33863 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 6:04 pm
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>>33862
Those who were hit by the spanish flu may well have lived in a less enlightened age, but they also lived in an age where you could go your entire life without actually encountering a Spaniard. The convenient point in our history after the Spanish armada, but before globalisation. It does not seem to require too great a leap of logic to think that although altering language is usually pointless busywork that achieves very little, in a modern interconnected society where everyone's spending 16 hours a day online and where people move between countries with trivial ease, the incredibly marginal effect changing language around is multiplied a thousandfold by social media exposure and the proximity of stupid nutters to a diverse selection of potential targets now that they're actually pretty likely indeed to pass a chinaman in the street.
>> No. 33864 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 6:20 pm
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>>33862
>As I've said, people are going to be racist to Asians no matter what you call it
Yes but if you call it something like that then more people are going to be racist to Asians. And they're going to take it further. This is demonstrably true. Something like this obviously isn't going to stop all racists being racist but it encourages them less, which is the point.
>> No. 33865 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 6:24 pm
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>>33862

We had a US president who referred to COVID-19 as "the China virus" and "kung-flu". Words matter, which is why I would be insta-banned for using a variety of words to describe certain ethnic minorities.

This isn't political correctness gone mad, it's a well-reasoned decision by the World Health Organisation that is in accordance with their existing policies on naming infectious diseases. The actual issue is that many countries don't want to test for new variants because they don't want to be blamed for it; changing the naming convention to neutral rather than location-based names is quite obviously a sensible response to this problem.
>> No. 33866 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 6:29 pm
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>>33862

Listen m8 I would very much fight to the death for your right to use the gamer word, I believe freedom of speech is paramount to a free society.

But this is really nothing worth getting up in arms about.
>> No. 33867 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 8:51 pm
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ZERO DEATHS, BITCHES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-57320320

Told you it was just the sniffles.
>> No. 33870 Anonymous
1st June 2021
Tuesday 11:26 pm
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>>33865

>"kung-flu"

Even for a shit pun, that is pretty shit.

>changing the naming convention to neutral rather than location-based names is quite obviously a sensible response to this problem

True, and not least because giving a variant a name of origin can be misleading. What if the variant itself originated in country X, but was only first described in country Y.


Fun fact: The Spanish Flu got its name not because it may have originated in Spain, which it didn't (the most likely origin was a chicken farm in Kansas), but because Spanish newspapers at the time were among the few that weren't censored due to the war, as Spain was a neutral party in WWI. So they reported freely on the effects the pandemic was having on their population, which led people in other countries to believe that it had originated in Spain altogether.
>> No. 33871 Anonymous
2nd June 2021
Wednesday 12:27 am
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>>33863
>they also lived in an age where you could go your entire life without actually encountering a Spaniard

I think you're wrong to assume that the world didn't have globalisation in the early 20th century. For example there's an observation Tommy made in the trenches that many Germans spoke English because many had actually worked in the Britain as shopkeepers along with a fair amount of evidence in literature from the period of upper class travels.

Then there's obviously the US which was still a magnet for immigration during the period and the press being, well, about the same as today but with wider circulation.

>>33864
>if you call it something like that then more people are going to be racist to Asians

Are they really, or is this just an assumption like we're throwing fucking slurs around and making crude drawings. No, I do not hold the bureaucratic mechanisations of an international organisation with a public image problems in high-esteem. We instead seem to be in a moral panic that believes we're having pogroms in Middlesbrough.
>> No. 33872 Anonymous
2nd June 2021
Wednesday 12:41 am
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>>33871

There's a clear correlation between "Chinese virus" and anti-Asian sentiment.

https://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/10.2105/AJPH.2021.306154
>> No. 33875 Anonymous
2nd June 2021
Wednesday 9:52 am
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>>33870
>>"kung-flu"
>Even for a shit pun, that is pretty shit.
I remember I chortled when I first heard it.
>> No. 33876 Anonymous
2nd June 2021
Wednesday 10:00 am
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>>33871
>Are they really, or is this just an assumption like we're throwing fucking slurs around and making crude drawings.

Yes. Turns out feeding anti-x sentiment has an impact on x people.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-48692863

You can bury your head in the sand if you like, and claim that because you can't see a direct link that...whatever, but there's clearly a relationship.

>pogroms in Middlesborough

I know you're joking, but this type of joke makes you seem a bit obtuse. No, it's not pogroms in MIddlesborough, it's people getting beaten up or harassed all over.
>> No. 33877 Anonymous
2nd June 2021
Wednesday 11:08 am
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Cineworld are trying to lure people back into the cinema with private screenings and gaming sessions; from £119 for up to 20 people. I'm tempted to book one to see if my girlfriend fancies a shag in a cinema, bringing back memories from our teenage days.

https://www.cineworld.co.uk/static/en/uk/venue-hire-events/film-screenings
>> No. 33878 Anonymous
2nd June 2021
Wednesday 1:51 pm
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>>33877
At last, Dwarf Fortress the way it was meant to be played. On a big public screening with 20 friends.
>> No. 33879 Anonymous
2nd June 2021
Wednesday 2:06 pm
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>>33878

Nobody who plays Dwarf Fortress has 20 friends.
>> No. 33880 Anonymous
2nd June 2021
Wednesday 2:47 pm
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>>33878
No no, this is for games like Artemis Bridge Simulator.
>> No. 33881 Anonymous
3rd June 2021
Thursday 4:30 pm
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>>33825
The top left window is a cubist Hitler portrait.

You can see the gentlemen's heads are each one lens of Hitler's eyeglass. The nose is present in the crease under the lower chaps left arm, and obviously his tie is a vertical moustache. And then you have that little peek of combover/parting at the top left, where the artist has cleverly disguised the hair as shading.
>> No. 33882 Anonymous
3rd June 2021
Thursday 4:36 pm
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>>33881

Hitler didn't wear glasses.
>> No. 33883 Anonymous
3rd June 2021
Thursday 4:51 pm
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>>33882

He wore readers, but it was a state secret. They were always airbrushed out in official photos, because they implied weakness or some such twaddle.

There's debate over whether he had one ball, but there's good evidence to show that he was wounded in the groin in 1916. Records do not support the idea that the Albert Hall was used to store human tissue; the notion that Klara Pölzl was a dirty bugger is pure conjecture.
>> No. 33884 Anonymous
3rd June 2021
Thursday 5:00 pm
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>>33882
They could conceivably be eyes aside a furrowed brow. Though maybe it's Roosevelt instead.
>> No. 33887 Anonymous
4th June 2021
Friday 2:00 am
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uzgmBorqqNs
>> No. 33888 Anonymous
4th June 2021
Friday 7:27 pm
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>> No. 33889 Anonymous
4th June 2021
Friday 7:29 pm
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>>33888
OK so we can look forward to China releasing their medical records with the part where they caught Covid deleted.
>> No. 33890 Anonymous
4th June 2021
Friday 7:33 pm
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>>33889

Haha. Yes.

Except no, because releasing the records would mean complying with the authority of a foreign government and that would be very very loss of face.
>> No. 33891 Anonymous
6th June 2021
Sunday 2:10 pm
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Getting ready to go to a vaccine walk-in and I get the Dreaded Notification.

Fuck my life.
>> No. 33892 Anonymous
6th June 2021
Sunday 2:22 pm
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>>33891
If it's the 'may have had contact' one then I wouldn't read too much into it. I had one last year and nothing come of it, they don't even give you a follow up text.
>> No. 33893 Anonymous
6th June 2021
Sunday 2:46 pm
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>>33892
It's this one.
>> No. 33894 Anonymous
6th June 2021
Sunday 3:02 pm
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>>33893
Oh fair enough then, RIP.
>> No. 33895 Anonymous
6th June 2021
Sunday 4:19 pm
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>>33891
There's a place near me that has hundreds of signs pointing to it, and a huge banner proclaiming "COVID-19 VACCINATION CENTRE". I went there yesterday, because being vaccinated on a Saturday is obviously the best and the standard methods keep offering me Tuesdays and Wednesdays which are much less convenient, and the bloody place was shut. All these stories of people just rocking up and asking, and when I try it they lock all the doors and hide like I'm a bloody Jehovah's Witness. Twats.
>> No. 33906 Anonymous
7th June 2021
Monday 8:06 pm
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I got my jab in lads!
>> No. 33907 Anonymous
7th June 2021
Monday 8:34 pm
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>>33906
First or second? And did they offer you a Saturday? I've been getting hounded for weeks to go for my second one, but they just wouldn't give me a Saturday whatever I did. Now I have to wake up an hour earlier than usual on Wednesday. And if I get horrible side effects, I'll get them at work instead of at home on a comfy Sunday.
>> No. 33908 Anonymous
7th June 2021
Monday 10:12 pm
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>>33907

First. I was aiming for midweek because I had to go to another city for mine.
>> No. 33933 Anonymous
9th June 2021
Wednesday 12:21 pm
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>>33906
Nice one, did she come?
>> No. 33958 Anonymous
9th June 2021
Wednesday 10:38 pm
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>>33891
You're not alone, looks like I caught the dreaded lurgy for real. PCR test is on the way to confirm, fingers crossed it won't be too bad since I already had my first jab.
>> No. 33959 Anonymous
10th June 2021
Thursday 12:03 am
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>>33958
I've been testing myself every day and it's now 6 days since I was 'exposed', and I'm still feeling fine and negative, so hopefully I'm in the clear.
>> No. 33960 Anonymous
10th June 2021
Thursday 1:58 am
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Don't worry Covid sufferers, soon Grace™ will be paying you a visit.


I'm unsure on talk therapy feature.
>> No. 33961 Anonymous
10th June 2021
Thursday 8:03 am
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>>33958

Fortunately those things are about as accurate as sticking your finger in the air, so you've got a good chance it's a false positive.
>> No. 33962 Anonymous
10th June 2021
Thursday 8:46 am
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>>33960
Hmm, starting to slowly clamber out of uncanny valley, aren't we?
Shame about the whirring noise and the tics, but the skin is on another level from five years ago. Give it another decade or two.
When I'm old(er) and demented, I can see myself rambling away to this thing's successor, telling stories of cuntoffs I have seen, the likes of which you just don't get any more, kids of today all polite and shit.
>> No. 33963 Anonymous
10th June 2021
Thursday 10:40 am
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>>33961

I'm sure at least some of you lads will already know this, but first-line tests value sensitivity over specificity by design (meaning they'll give a greater number of false positives). The results of those possible positives are then narrowed down in the more (usually more expensive or labour intensive) specific tests like PCR, culture, or what have you.

It's massively more efficient to catch all possible positives with a highly sensitive test and then hone in on them. Likewise, a first-line test that gave a load of false negatives would be useless and let more infected people wander around than is necessary.
>> No. 33964 Anonymous
10th June 2021
Thursday 10:41 am
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>>33960

Would.
>> No. 33965 Anonymous
10th June 2021
Thursday 11:27 am
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>>33964
Bear in mind she's only pink from the neck up. That thermal camera is attached to what looks like a steel chassis using M6 bolts. There's car batteries and hoverboard wheels at the bottom.
Enjoy your meat grinder.
>> No. 33966 Anonymous
10th June 2021
Thursday 11:37 am
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>>33963

That's great, but they give a shitload of false negatives too. We were given a load of lateral flow kit (care of Hancock's mates I'm sure) early on in the pandemic, but they failed pretty much every aspect of our internal QC audits.

They're better than nothing, and they have probably improved over the last year, but just worth bearing in mind. If I was at all concerned I'd go get myself a proper PCR test.

t. lablad
>> No. 33967 Anonymous
10th June 2021
Thursday 11:37 am
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>>33965

If a man can shag a postbox, he can shag a pile of scaffolding with a rubber face.

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/man-sex-with-postbox-wigan-8459224
>> No. 33968 Anonymous
10th June 2021
Thursday 12:12 pm
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I have not had covid, not had the vaccine, not had any covid test, not had any symptoms, not had any notifications on that cursed app.

It may as well have all been made up.
>> No. 33969 Anonymous
10th June 2021
Thursday 12:22 pm
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>>33968
How do you know you haven't had Covid?
>> No. 33970 Anonymous
10th June 2021
Thursday 1:47 pm
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>>33965
Got a mouth though. I bet those eggheads in Hong Kong have thought about it.

>>33968
Don't worry, soon you'll feel the economic damage and yearn for the halcyon days of Cameron's austerity.
>> No. 33971 Anonymous
10th June 2021
Thursday 6:40 pm
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>>33963
From what I've been reading on most news sites and government releases I was under the impression that the lateral flow tests being used in the UK were specifically chosen to have a very low false positive rate at the expense of a high false negative rate, with the sole aim of catching people with high viral loads rather than trying to catch as many cases as possible whilst upsetting and confusing people who get false negatives.
>> No. 33973 Anonymous
10th June 2021
Thursday 6:55 pm
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>>33971

That sounds retarded enough to be true yeah.

I don't work for the WHO or anything but I can't really see why such a strategy would be anything but unhelpful. Any ideas?
>> No. 33974 Anonymous
10th June 2021
Thursday 7:58 pm
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>>33973

If you're doing large-scale testing of people who probably don't have COVID, false positives can be a much bigger problem than false negatives.

At the moment, less than 0.1% of the population are estimated to have an active COVID-19 infection. A hypothetical false positive rate of 1% might seem perfectly acceptable, but right now that would mean that 90% of positive test results were false positives.

We use highly sensitive PCR tests (high false positive, low false negative) for people with symptoms and highly specific lateral flow tests (low false positive, high false negative) for people without symptoms. That's not totally daft, it's certainly the most sensible way of augmenting our PCR testing capacity with lateral flow, it doesn't undermine trust by asking loads of COVID-negative people to self-isolate, but it's not clear if the lateral flow tests are actually doing anything useful.
>> No. 33976 Anonymous
10th June 2021
Thursday 10:04 pm
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>>33971
>whilst upsetting and confusing people who get false negatives.
I meant false positives.
>> No. 33978 Anonymous
11th June 2021
Friday 7:55 am
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>>33974

A false negative is an undetected COVID case whichever way you look at it. A high false positive rate on lateral flows which are then confirmed by highly accurate and specific PCR is the only sensible approach, and I suspect anything else is just retroactive justification for the fact the kits are shite.

Even positive PCRs are sent away to The Big Lab (PHE) for typing. The only way this conceivably helps is in keeping the lab testing infrastructure from being overwhelmed; but the lab testing infrastructure exists for a much higher workload than it is currently handling, because we built it that way during the peak.

Doing it according to whether people have symptoms or not seems completely arbitrary given that we know asymptomatic carriers are just as capable of spreading.
>> No. 33979 Anonymous
11th June 2021
Friday 9:00 am
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>>33978

>Doing it according to whether people have symptoms or not seems completely arbitrary given that we know asymptomatic carriers are just as capable of spreading.

Asymptomatic people are much less likely to have COVID, so the acceptable false positive rate is correspondingly lower. I'm not a massive fan of lateral flow, I think Hancock was mainly keen on them to push the testing numbers higher, but they can definitely do some good if used sensibly.

https://www.statnews.com/2020/08/20/even-imperfect-covid-19-tests-can-help-control-the-pandemic/
>> No. 34000 Anonymous
11th June 2021
Friday 9:33 pm
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Had my second jab of Biontech today.

My arm is starting to hurt a bit, just like last time. They told me that because I had symptoms after the first shot, they are going to be even worse after the second one.

But oh well, I'll just spend the weekend in bed. Small price to pay.
>> No. 34001 Anonymous
11th June 2021
Friday 10:18 pm
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>>34000

Have some Chicken Soup, Lucozade, and the latest edition of 2000AD. Will have you right as rain lad.
>> No. 34002 Anonymous
11th June 2021
Friday 10:29 pm
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>>34000

I was expecting a bad reaction to my second one, but I felt fucking fantastic instead.
>> No. 34003 Anonymous
11th June 2021
Friday 10:38 pm
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I'm a bit worried, over 30 and recently got the text. If I'm not intending on going back to the office and am happy wearing a mask, is there any point putting off the vaccine until I have to take it?
>> No. 34005 Anonymous
11th June 2021
Friday 11:00 pm
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>>34003
Just fucking get the jab.
>> No. 34007 Anonymous
11th June 2021
Friday 11:37 pm
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>>34003
Given the choice between catching a bad flu now or at some unspecified future time, I choose delay.
>> No. 34008 Anonymous
11th June 2021
Friday 11:40 pm
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>>34007

How the fuck are people like you still calling it a "bad flu"
>> No. 34013 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 12:51 am
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>>34008
It's asymptomatic in significant amount of people. Bad flu doesn't really do it justice, it's more like nothing.

But of course I'm just saying that. It could just flat kill you, it's a bad idea to risk contracting it, but arguments like >>34005 just don't quite have the necessary weight behind them. Why shouldn't I wait an extra day?
>> No. 34014 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 1:20 am
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>>34013

>Why shouldn't I wait an extra day?

Nobody asked that.
>> No. 34015 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 1:36 am
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>>34013

>Why shouldn't I wait an extra day?

Because the Delta variant is running rampant and we're headed for another full lockdown. The infectivity of Delta seems to match the anticipated worst case scenario. We're not sure about how those cases will translate into hospitalisations and deaths, but the reasonable range is between "hospitals suspending routine treatment again" and "people dying in hospital car parks". The easing of lockdown and the rollout of the vaccine has given people the impression that the pandemic is all over bar the shouting, but this is the most dangerous point we've been at since last March.

The faster we vaccinate everyone, the better chance we have of being out of the next lockdown by Christmas. I wish that was scaremongering, but the data has taken a sudden and severe turn for the worse over the past few weeks and the medium-term situation is looking grim.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/986709/S1237_SPI-M-O_Consensus_Statement.pdf
>> No. 34016 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 2:16 am
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>>34015
Does this mean we're not properly going back into the office anytime soon?

I'm still regretting spending all this time in London when I could've been renting somewhere with a much lower cost of living.
>> No. 34017 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 3:09 am
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>>34013
Not taking the jab is being a selfish cunt to all others in your family and community. Go ahead and keep reading whatever fucking bullshit you're reading on antivax, but people like you are literally the problem now.
>> No. 34018 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 3:55 am
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>>34017
As far as I'm concerned, if people don't want to take the Oxford or Pfizer vaccine, they should be forcibly given the Mozabique vaccine instead.
>> No. 34022 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 8:19 am
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>>34017
I'm sure you've convinced him now.
>> No. 34023 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 9:22 am
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>>34013
It's a shame the virus doesn't discriminate by severity of being a selfish cunt because you'd definitely be dying a horrible death.
>> No. 34025 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 9:42 am
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>>34022

Bullying and aggressively shaming people into agreeing with you is a fine tactic, works every time.
>> No. 34026 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 9:47 am
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>>34017

I think people have forgotten what it means to make a personal sacrifice for a common good.

Just look at WWII, when our entire economy and public life switched into collective wartime mode in order to end the war. Food was rationed, consumer goods were almost unavailable, and millions of men in their prime gave their lives on the Western front to defeat Hitler. And nobody ever really complained.

And now you're telling me that you can't be arsed to fucking have a vaccine jab because you're worried it could put you in bed for a couple of days? The sacrifice you're making is infinitely smaller than the above, and you could be protecting your own health and that of countless others around you by getting the vaccine.

That said, I am really feeling yesterday's second jab. They weren't lying when they said that I had to expect a more severe reaction if the first shot already gave me symptoms.
>> No. 34027 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 9:51 am
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>>34026
>Just look at WWII, when our entire economy and public life switched into collective wartime mode in order to end the war. Food was rationed, consumer goods were almost unavailable, and millions of men in their prime gave their lives on the Western front to defeat Hitler. And nobody ever really complained.

Isn't this and the whole Blitz spirit thing a myth? Crime was rife during the war.
>> No. 34028 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 10:00 am
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>>34027

>Crime was rife during the war.

As is scepticism about the vaccine nowadays. But I think by and large, public opinion was about as united behind the war effort as it is now in the fight against covid.
>> No. 34029 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 10:35 am
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>>34026
Wikipedia gives an upper estimate of 350,000 Allied soldiers killed on the Western Front.

Does this not prove your tendency to exaggerate how deadly things are?
>> No. 34030 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 10:39 am
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>>34026

That was an actual war. We were still homogeneous with a sense of collective unity then. This is the fucking flu. Grow up.
>> No. 34031 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 10:42 am
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Happy Pride! But please stop talking about WW2 none of you silly bastards know a howizter from an Operation Husky.
>> No. 34032 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 10:44 am
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Anyone who makes an argument that revolves around how things were better in the good old days is an idiot.

>>34030

No we weren't, what an ostentatiously stupid thing to say.
>> No. 34033 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 10:45 am
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>>34030

Yeah, the shotgun cartridge in the gut compared to the gunshot in a kneecap version of the Flu. Fuck off Lawrence, maybe you can get a slot on Infowars for your next gig.
>> No. 34035 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 10:51 am
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>>34029

>Does this not prove your tendency to exaggerate how deadly things are?

That doesn't meaningfully detract from my argument though.


>>34032

>Anyone who makes an argument that revolves around how things were better in the good old days is an idiot.

Some things were indeed though. Just look at job security or the welfare state. Or the environment.
>> No. 34036 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 10:53 am
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>>34035

Yeah and children respected their elders. The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers. It's just not like how it was.
>> No. 34039 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 11:23 am
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>>34035
>the welfare state
Wasn't this an Attlee thing, in other words, post-Blitz? I understand this question has the potential to devolve into a fact-free bad-faith shitstorm, but it can't be any worse than the shite currently being flung here.
>> No. 34040 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 11:37 am
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>>34039

>in other words, post-Blitz?

It was meant more as a general retort to the "good old days" argument by >>34032 lad, not specifically in relation to WWII.

The Attlee government founded the NHS in 1946, that much is true. Attlee was also instrumental in creating the post-war consensus. Which then pretty much directly led to the malaise years of 1970s Britain. Although it's unfair to paint the 1970s as just a British problem, as they were shit in many Western countries. Which was owed to things like a downturn in long-term economic cycles and the inability of left-wing Big Governments to offset the effects.
>> No. 34041 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 1:07 pm
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You lot didn't used to be this easily riled, I should leave room for bad faith more often. All I said is that I want to put it off, maybe an extra day, maybe an extra few, but I intend on taking a vaccine.

I only leave the house once a week (though that will increase once I'm vaccinated), I live alone. Do you mongoloids understand my lack of urgency between this week and next week now? Or did none of you make unnecessary extra trips to the market or take extra walks, or see an extra person, or leave less than 2m gap in the queue?

The absolute blindness of some of you, marvellous.

>>34017
I'm not reading any anti-vax stuff, I'm just saying why shouldn't I wait an extra few days if I've decided I'm going to take it anyway?

>>34026
I suppose people just have different ideas about the common good. I imagine some anti-vaxxers volunteer their time and contribute to charity. They're still making personal sacrifice for the common good, just not the one you want them to, or that you value more. I'm not an anti vaxxer, I just figure that every day that goes past is another day I can feel more comfortable with taking it. And since I only leave the house once a week, I highly doubt a delay of one or two weeks is going to result in any sort of tragedy at all.

>And nobody ever really complained.
Pull the other one.

>>34025
I think it's the rudgwicksteamshow.co.uklad influence, the insults aren't even imaginative.

>>34023
I think I'd pass away rather peacefully, content in the knowledge that I'd pissed you off.
>> No. 34042 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 1:29 pm
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>>34041
> I'm not reading any anti-vax stuff, I'm just saying why shouldn't I wait an extra few days if I've decided I'm going to take it anyway?
How many extra grannies will you kill in those extra few days!
>> No. 34043 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 1:31 pm
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>>34042
I will not stop until my bloodlust is sated.

For what it's worth, >>34015 had the best response, thanks mate. I'm still interested in more information but that was appreciated.
>> No. 34044 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 1:37 pm
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>>34040
>Which then pretty much directly led to the malaise years of 1970s Britain.
Although you're better than most for conceding that everyone had a bad 1970s, this isn't particularly true. The reason Britain had a particularly bad 1970s was almost entirely down to a mixture of Heath government policies and typically British bad luck. In short succession, the government slashed controls on bank lending (leading to a credit boom) and hiked spending/cut taxes (in the hopes of expanding the economy prior to entry to the EEC), neither of which were strictly necessary in the framework of the postwar consensus. By themselves both of these actions would be inflationary, but because this is Britain they both had to land right in the prelude to the 1973 oil crisis, which killed any hopes of growth while sending inflation sky high.
Labour's strategy to deal with all of this gets a bad reputation in Britain (just ask the unions to be responsible in their wage claims in exchange for better public services? ha ha ha), but the exact same strategy was used by Australian Labor with great success in the 1980s, since they actually kept up their end of the deal.

(Lest anyone think I'm a Labour partisan for putting the blame at Heath's door: If you take my view, Callaghan's the one who actually killed the postwar consensus. He just gets off with it because he's a more sympathetic oh-dear-i've-broken-it sort of character than Thatcher, who actually wanted to kill it.)
>> No. 34046 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 1:37 pm
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>>34041

> And since I only leave the house once a week, I highly doubt a delay of one or two weeks is going to result in any sort of tragedy at all.

Yes, but it's still a good idea to get the vaccine as early as possible, because who knows, you might pass something on to somebody without knowing it, which you wouldn't have if you'd gone two weeks earler. And that person might then become seriously ill.

What I have kind of grown to despise though is the certain kind of smugcuntery that some people now have about having had the jabs. It's probably the same kind of people who will rub it in any chance they get that they are doing this, that, and the other to save the environment, and who look down on you for not being the same kind of zealot.
>> No. 34047 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 1:39 pm
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>>34031
We can't stop talking about The War now. Not when we're in the middle of Operation Market Garden: A Lifted-Restriction Too Far.

>>34032
Britain was united behind a collective project, I don't know how you can not see that. The blitz spirit was not an uncommon reaction to attack by outsiders in uniting those under attack - although I suppose it's only natural that shysters in our culture would attack it.

>Look at Mosley!

The BUF was finished after the Knight of the Long Knives and he was imprisoned in 1940. What a stupid image to post.

>>34039
The welfare state extends way before Atlee or even the war but events during 40s had the obvious cause in accelerating it. The Beveridge Report in particular was 1942 but you can see a timeline stretching back to at least the Liberals at the turn of the last century and arguably we would've seen a quasi-NHS emerge in the 1920s had Labour not displaced them.
>> No. 34048 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 1:45 pm
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>>34047
>The BUF was finished after the Knight of the Long Knives and he was imprisoned in 1940

So what? You think the rest of his supporters just vanished along with their sentiments?
Anyway here are nearly half a dozen websites explaining at length that you're wrong.
https://www.historic-uk.com/HistoryUK/HistoryofBritain/Blitz-Spirit/
https://www.bbc.co.uk/history/british/britain_wwtwo/blitz_01.shtml
https://www.socialistparty.org.uk/articles/30535/01-04-2020/all-in-this-together-the-blitz-spirit-myth
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-11213968

>it's only natural that shysters in our culture would attack it
Piss off with this ridiculous faux-patriotic rhetoric. "Anyone who isn't with us is a coward!" You sound like a politician.
>> No. 34049 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 1:45 pm
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>nearly have a dozen
Sorry, got distracted in the middle of copy-pasting. Anyway there are plenty more, I only opened a few.
>> No. 34050 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 1:55 pm
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All I'll say is the lad complaining we aren't "homogeneous" enough and calling people "shysters" is definitely a racist.
>> No. 34051 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 2:08 pm
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>>34047

>The welfare state extends way before Atlee or even the war

Quite. If you go back even further, you could say that it has its roots in the worker's rights movement of the 19th century. It's easy to forget that for much of the early Industrial Age, most common labourers simply couldn't afford a doctor's visit. Most factories employed medical staff of some description, but their aim was to keep a factory floor worker capable of doing their job. You were expected to function, but if you wanted to live well, that was your own problem during your sparse time off the job.

The great peculiarity of the Attlee government and the postwar Consensus was that while the West tried to distance itself increasingly from communist Eastern Europe and its political system on a geopolitical level, Britain's system of big government, union pandering and nationalisation almost made us a socialist country in its own right.

I've always hated Thatcher milk snatcher, and continue to do so with passion, but it's worth remembering that Britain had hit a wall when she came to power, and the only way out was denationalisation and liberalisation. It's ironic that Blair then later took the concept and ran with it and pushed back the welfare state beyond anything Thatcher had done, but that was New Labour for you. Much in the same way that only Nixon could have gone to China, only a Labour government could dissolve the welfare state the way Blair did.
>> No. 34052 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 2:13 pm
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>>34036

As someone still on the right side of young, most of my elders seem to be cunts and therefore very difficult to respect.

I've been reading a lot of people's responses to the delay of "Freedom Day", and it's funny how all the old cunts who've had their jabs are the ones most critical of more restrictions. Young people have given up more than a year of their life and their freedom, often being the most at risk key workers, in order to protect the elderly and vulnerable. But now the shoe is on the other foot our older generation doesn't want to return the favour.

I mean you'd never have seen that coming would you.
>> No. 34053 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 2:22 pm
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>>34051

I've been wondering if the current government's break from austerity will shift the window back and (if Labour or whoever get their act together) enable a return to a more social-democratic kind of era.

The post-war consensus was named as such for a reason, because broadly all the parties shared the same view and largely supported the existence of the welfare state right up until the Thatcher years. One can hope we are currently living through a social shift which sees neoliberalism fall out of fashion in a similar way.

What's clear is that the left right divide in politics has ceased to meaningfully matter, and it's been that way for quite some time.
>> No. 34055 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 2:42 pm
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>>34053

>What's clear is that the left right divide in politics has ceased to meaningfully matter, and it's been that way for quite some time.

True; mainly because voters often just aren't as loyal to their respective party as they used to be, no political party at Westminster nowadays can afford to be fully entrenched in distinct traditional left- or right wing platforms. At least Labour and the Conservatives are now far more centrist than they have ever been. Still each with their own bent and tonality on things in order not to alienate their more traditional voters, but the overlap is pretty significant.
>> No. 34056 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 2:51 pm
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>>34051
>and the only way out was denationalisation and liberalisation.
This seems like post purchase rationalisation. If you look to New Zealand (always a good idea, they speak English and more people should know how a pandemic response is supposed to go) they've hardly suffered a bit for Labour spending the 2000s renationalising the things it sold off in the 1980s, increasing trade union rights, etc. Both major parties wound up largely disavowing their role in the economic reforms of the 1980s-90s because of the massive social harm they caused, with the finance ministers responsible winding up in a new party entirely. Only in Britain do we persist with the idea that it was all deeply necessary and very successful, rather than being 13 or so years of economic masochism which happened to include one or two passable ideas like a free floating exchange rate. (introduced at the worst possible time, naturally.)
Perhaps because Thatcher was more politically astute than the kiwis: They sold nationalised industries to foreign companies to get the best price, she sold to the UK public to buy the Conservatives a new class of voters... Politicians have never been good at economics, but election results, they understand those.
>> No. 34057 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 2:56 pm
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>>34048
>So what?

The organisation become irrelevant. This wasn't a division in mainstream society, it's a bogeyman.

>Anyway here are nearly half a dozen websites explaining at length that you're wrong.

Try forming an argument. It's not hard.
>> No. 34060 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 3:43 pm
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>>34056

Either way, 1970s Britain was deeply dysfunctional, there were strikes everywhere, nobody really got any work done, people were laid off, inflation was rampant, and the rubbish was piling up in the streets.

I did say that I hate Thatcher as a person and a politician, and I do, but there simply was no way you could've carried the 1970s way of doing things into the 80s.

Britain saw an increase in prosperity for the average middle-class person that had been unheard of for decades on the back of Thatcher privatisation. It all then crumbled around the time of the 1987 stock market crash and thereafter, but a five- or six-year boom cycle since the beginning of Tory rule was not a bad track record.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PyeWRd7ZEBs

(hats off to the Pet Shop Boys for delivering by far the wittiest satirisation of that era)
>> No. 34061 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 4:01 pm
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>>34057

"It's a bogeyman" he says while claiming something to exist despite being given multiple credible sources that say otherwise.
>> No. 34063 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 4:14 pm
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>>34050

I am. What's your point?

(A good day to you Sir!)
>> No. 34064 Anonymous
12th June 2021
Saturday 4:51 pm
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>>34060
The problem with this sort of analysis is that it misunderstands what "The 1970s way of doing things" was and why it wasn't working. It's like imagining that the reason Churchill was turfed out and the pre-postwar-consensus ended was because there were bombs falling everywhere and half of the men in the country were off shooting Germans.
It's not like everyone just decided to have a bunch of strikes for a laugh one day because they realised they could be workshy, people went on strike to preserve their pay and conditions because they were being eroded by inflation. The inflation wasn't the unpredictable result of the inefficiencies of nationalisation or the inflationary pressures of giving people £10 at Christmas time, it was the result of an energy crisis, international instabilities, policy miscalculations, and some incredibly bad monetary policy. Those aren't mandated internal components of a coherent way of doing things, they're external shocks and system-neutral errors.
Of course we couldn't have carried on like that - not because it would've ended in tears, but because it was physically impossible. You could no more preserve the social conditions of the 1970s into the 1980s than you could preserve the social conditions of Roman Britain into the present day. North Sea oil was about to come online, global inflation rates were tracking downwards, markets were stabilising, old MPs were dying and new ones being elected, and so on and so on. If you define the 1970s way of doing things as the postwar consensus, it didn't even last until the late 1970s: It died in 1976 when Callaghan went out and told Labour conference that Keynesianism had never worked. By the time of the winter of discontent and the binmen's strike the country already had a chancellor who was ignoring mass unemployment while being praised by Milton Friedman for bringing in monetarism. It was all over. The only thing that survived the 1970s is the gross incompetence that defined British economic policymaking. (Well, it got a bit better after Black Wednesday.)

Which I suppose is what my point is: Bringing the postwar consensus back would be difficult if not impossible, so I'm not making the case for that. But I really do wish we'd learn from our mistakes and our successes separately instead of embracing our failures and confabulating our successes into them.
As for the chart: I couldn't find a way to work in the fact that unemployment under Thatcher and Major was never lower than it had been under Callaghan without looking like a pedant, but considering the state of the economy under Callaghan and his utter inaction on unemployment, that's a remarkable achievement in bungled if not outright malicious policymaking.
>> No. 34085 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 7:11 am
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>I’M A Celebrity queen Giovanna Fletcher claimed thousands of pounds from the furlough scheme weeks after her TV win. The mum of three and her pop star husband Tom, worth an estimated £8million, have received up to £30,000 of government cash.

>An HMRC register of claims shows the pair received support shortly after Giovanna triumphed on the jungle series in December. Files released by HMRC last week listed more than 600,000 companies and individuals who received taxpayers’ support between January and March this year.

>It was not clear if Giovanna or Tom were claiming the money for themselves or for an employee. Companies House records state Giovanna Fletcher Ltd in 2019 had one employee and £300,000-plus in the bank. A spokeswoman for Giovanna has declined to comment.

https://www. Please ban me/tvandshowbiz/15254557/giovanna-fletcher-claimed-thousands-furlough-scheme/

Hang on, lads. There's a public register somewhere where you can see who's claiming furlough?
>> No. 34086 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 9:54 am
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>>34063
I'm never wrong. If it weren't for my deeply unstable mental state and barely concealed lust for power I'd have have made moderator years ago.
>> No. 34087 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 10:28 am
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>>34085

Probably someone had to put in an FoI request for it.

Shouldn't be surprising at all that people who are already more than comfortable financially will have been abusing it though.
>> No. 34088 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 10:30 am
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>>34085

>There's a public register somewhere where you can see who's claiming furlough?

Yes, although you can ask HMRC not to publish your details if you have a good reason.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/employers-who-have-claimed-through-the-coronavirus-job-retention-scheme
>> No. 34091 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 1:26 pm
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>>34088

>Yes, although you can ask HMRC not to publish your details if you have a good reason.

I cant think of one good reason for this information not to be published, I can think of a few bad ones though
>> No. 34092 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 2:04 pm
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I'm really feeling my second Biontech jab today. I would say the symptoms aren't dramatically worse than after the first one, but I do feel pretty lethargic, and I've got a headache and some muscle pain. Very similar to a common cold, without the runny nose. And I've got just under 37.5 degrees body temperature, if my £5 digital thermometer from Boots can be trusted.

Still worth it. I'm glad I can put the whole thing behind me now. I was a little worried that something would somehow keep me from getting the second dose, from a sudden catastrophic vaccine shortage to me just forgetting my appointment.

I've now started looking at offers for holidays around the Med. I've got everything from Corfu to Sardinia and Tenerife on my shortlist. Can't bring myself to consider Majorca. I have bad memories of a lads holiday there with two hours of sleep a night and being off my tits all day long in the blazing sun.
>> No. 34093 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 2:40 pm
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>>34092
It is great that you're fully vaccinated but unfortunately all this isn't over just yet and I certainly wouldn't be travelling abroad any time this year. Keep wearing a mask and distancing at least, so far a handful of people who have had both doses of vaccine have still ended up in hospital with the delta variant that's spreading.
>> No. 34094 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 2:48 pm
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>>34093

I've read that the Biontech vaccine isn't as effective against the Delta variant as some others, but I think it's really just statistical margins. With both jabs, your likelihood of getting sick from the delta variant is still tolerably low.
>> No. 34095 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 3:04 pm
34095 spacer
I know someone fully double vaccinated with the Pfizer one and still managed to catch it. It almost completely crushes your chances of getting seriously ill, but doesn't completely stop you catching it.
>> No. 34096 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 3:09 pm
34096 spacer
When is this going to die out like in 1918? Do we have to reach a point where the whole world is vaccinated, so the virus mutates into a less deadly seasonal flu, and then we just tolerate it?
>> No. 34097 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 3:11 pm
34097 spacer
>>34095

It's a game of probabilities, in the end. With two doses of any of the government-approved covid-19 vaccines, your chances of becoming seriously ill are drastically reduced.

There are stories of people who have recovered from an actual infection and who got it again, so there's always that possibility that you'll just have some incredibly bad luck. It doesn't detract from the fact that getting vaccinated is for all intents and purposes an all-around good idea.
>> No. 34098 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 3:36 pm
34098 spacer
This is some fucking bullshit. Everyone else is already getting their second jabs and I've even been told there's now long queues because of the under-30s getting their first. As for me, I'm only getting my first next week and the second is in bloody September. Which I have to travel half-way across London for as there was nothing else left.

Sure I could perhaps try turning up and going "whoops, I thought it was September" but I'm not one to jump to a queue, I won't do it. Broken Britain if you ask me.
>> No. 34099 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 4:20 pm
34099 spacer
>>34098

The Dark Web has you covered.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/may/16/fake-covid-vaccine-and-test-certificate-market-is-growing-researchers-say
>> No. 34100 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 6:48 pm
34100 spacer
>>34099
That's all well and good if I wanted to go to France but I want to escape up north on the train without the risk of my Covid mashing my testicles up.
>> No. 34101 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 7:29 pm
34101 spacer
>>34096

If we'd let it run rampant in the first place it probably would have by now. The catch is that would have come with a much higher death toll.

We have asked lives, but in fighting the virus we have exerted selective pressure that has allowed the rise of more infective variants. We're in it for the long game now like it or not.
>> No. 34102 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 8:11 pm
34102 spacer
I've completely checked out of everything in the past few months and I no longer have any real idea of what I'm not allowed to do. Not least because it seems like we can do anything, but with a mask on or at least near enough to be quickly put on.
>> No. 34103 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 8:21 pm
34103 spacer
>>34102

Pretty much the only thing that's still not allowed is nightclubs and gigs. Everything else is allowed to happen just fine with the pretend counter-measures we're using like fucking 14th century plague doctors stuffing their masks with incense.

It's all a bit bollocks. Most people have been acting as though it's over for at least the last couple of months. I feel like a bit of a mug for being one of the people still playing ball. I suspect my so-called mates have used the opportunity to just quietly drop me from the group and this is it for me, now.

I just want to go for a fucking pint with someone other than my fucking missus, it can't be that much to ask can it, surely. I am tired.
>> No. 34104 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 9:27 pm
34104 spacer
Delta strain looks like it's vaccine resistant.
>> No. 34105 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 9:39 pm
34105 spacer
>>34101

It'll probably always be there in some form or another. The really interesting question is going to be how long immunity lasts. There isn't sufficient data yet, science's best guess at the moment is that you're probably protected after a vaccination or after you've had the virus for anything between five months and a year.

It could be that we'll all need yearly top ups. Or it could be that once you've had it as a child, you'll be immunised for life, like some other diseases.

The lesson humankind should probably learn is that you really shouldn't eat bats.
>> No. 34106 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 9:53 pm
34106 spacer
>>34104
>Delta strain looks like it's vaccine resistant.
*to some extent more resistant to vaccines than the other variants.

Vaccines aren't an all-or-nothing thing. Even with newer variants the immune system has a head start, meaning the infection will be far less severe.
>> No. 34107 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 11:38 pm
34107 spacer
>>34105

>The lesson humankind should probably learn is that you really shouldn't eat bats.

Is this a new word filter for 'do gain of function research'?
>> No. 34108 Anonymous
13th June 2021
Sunday 11:40 pm
34108 spacer
>>34107
It is now.
>> No. 34109 Anonymous
14th June 2021
Monday 10:10 am
34109 spacer
>>34107

Indeed, it'd be a good idea to do gain of function research to help us understand the virus better.

That, and banning the eating of wildlife that could carry pathogens like the coronavirus. That's where it started, even if the tinfoil hat crowd still claim that it escaped from a lab.
>> No. 34110 Anonymous
14th June 2021
Monday 10:17 am
34110 spacer
>>34109

Now now lad, it's not crazy conspiracy talk any more. That was only when prototype Nexus 7 Hitler droid Donald Trump was saying it. Saint Biden said it might be China now, so it must have been China, the commie bastards.
>> No. 34111 Anonymous
14th June 2021
Monday 10:48 am
34111 spacer
>>34110

I just wonder how people can seriously maintain the idea. Look around you. Evolution is perfectly capable of creating astonishing life forms on its own that leave even the most seasoned biologists dumbfounded. Even if there is debate whether a virus actually constitutes a life form, the argument is the same. Nature has shown in abundance what it can do, and that it doesn't need some scheming scientists in a commie lab to bring about a pathogen that's capable of disrupting human life on the entire planet.

As attractive and intellectually stimulating as many conspiracy theories often are, it doesn't change the fact that the majority of them are verifiably false.

That a Murrikin President decided to make conspiracy theories a vital part of his presidential platform is a whole different story, and in his case, it was really about even further dumbing down the dumb vote.
>> No. 34112 Anonymous
14th June 2021
Monday 11:02 am
34112 spacer
>>34111
> it doesn't change the fact that the majority of them are verifiably false.
That's not a refutation of this particular one though is it.
>> No. 34113 Anonymous
14th June 2021
Monday 11:26 am
34113 spacer
I don't see how it matters either way. Zoonotic viruses happen and so do lab leaks. The next major pandemic won't be a re-run of this one, just as this one isn't a re-run of the 1918 flu pandemic. If the Wuhan Institute of Virology were negligent, then the Yanks are complicit in that negligence because they were partly funding their work.

If this virus was of zoonotic origin, we should still be reviewing biosecurity measures in research labs; if it was a lab leak, we should still be working to reduce opportunities for human-to-animal viral transmission. Maybe people will feel better if they have someone to blame, but the exact origin of this pandemic won't be relevant to the next pandemic.
>> No. 34114 Anonymous
14th June 2021
Monday 11:26 am
34114 spacer
>>34112

No, it doesn't. And I was arguing mainly from the view point of probability/plausibility. It's not entirely impossible that this virus was bioengineered in a lab in China. I assume the technology exists. If we can pretty much print mRNA as we please, which is also the basis of all the mRNA covid-19 vaccines now, then it could be that somebody crafted a cronavirus with certain desired properties and released it into the environment.

In that sense, a coronavirus conspiracy theory is more difficult to refute and falsify than things like the Moon Hoax, where a mountain of irrefutable solid evidence exists that people did go to the Moon.

But the question is still how likely it is that somebody did create SARS-CoV-2 in a lab. Given all the above arguments for nature being quite capable of creating it on its own. And even if China actually set out to cause global turmoil and disruption on the back of a bioengineered virus, we've seen that China itself experienced very drastic effects on public life and its economy, even if they were only temporary. Once you release a pathogen or even a toxin into the environment, it's very difficult to predict and control the dynamics that will ensue.
>> No. 34115 Anonymous
14th June 2021
Monday 12:50 pm
34115 spacer
>A headache, sore throat and runny nose are now the most commonly reported symptoms linked to Covid infection in the UK, researchers say. Prof Tim Spector, who runs the Zoe Covid Symptom study, says catching the Delta variant can feel "more like a bad cold" for younger people.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-57467051

Just in time for hay fever season.

>>34113
>>34114
Go to bed, Xi.
>> No. 34116 Anonymous
14th June 2021
Monday 3:18 pm
34116 spacer
If I wanted to build the world's foremost research facility into bat coronaviruses, it's not beyond the realms of possibility that I would choose to build it in a place where people eat bats, to make the research easier. That's more or less the only way I'd be able to accept the incredible coincidences that seem to have happened up to this point.
>> No. 34117 Anonymous
14th June 2021
Monday 4:40 pm
34117 spacer
Finally escaped isolation, and got me a Puh Fizzer. I can feel the 5G coarsing through my veins.
>> No. 34118 Anonymous
14th June 2021
Monday 5:29 pm
34118 spacer
>>34117
You can't feel the 5G. It'll be the nanobots that you can feel, probably as they are becoming activated by the 5G.
>> No. 34119 Anonymous
14th June 2021
Monday 6:28 pm
34119 spacer
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/jun/09/washington-state-joints-for-jabs-boost-vaccination-rates

>To boost vaccination rates, Washington state is offering free marijuana joints to any adults that receive a Covid-19 vaccine.

>On Monday, the Washington state liquor and cannabis board announced the promotion, aptly called “Joints for Jabs”, that will run until 12 July. During the initiative’s run, state-licensed dispensaries can give age-appropriate customers, 21 and older, a pre-rolled joint when they receive their first or second dose.


That seems only reasonable.
>> No. 34120 Anonymous
14th June 2021
Monday 8:05 pm
34120 spacer
>>34119
We really missed a trick by freely getting the jab didn't we. It was a moment where we realistically could've demanded anything we want and the powerful would have to agree to it.
>> No. 34121 Anonymous
14th June 2021
Monday 8:38 pm
34121 spacer
>>34119

>That seems only reasonable.

Depends on who's licking all those rizlas, I suppose.
>> No. 34125 Anonymous
14th June 2021
Monday 9:26 pm
34125 spacer
>>34114

The lab leak hypothesis is not that the lab was 'bioengineering' the virus, but that it was simply trying to mutate it to understand how viruses would evolve to affect humans. Nature can do this on its own, you're right. However, we can game the system. It's easy for us to create the conditions where this is highly more likely.

Generally it seems like the lab was mutating the virus backed by global money and negligence is what got the virus out by mistake. That is a risk of gain of function research. I don't understand why you leapt into conspiracy territory, but you should try to fight a strong opponent.
>> No. 34126 Anonymous
14th June 2021
Monday 10:02 pm
34126 spacer
>>34120

It's not the best idea to get high right after your jab. I really felt the effects of the first and second dose, and am still feeling a bit shit from Friday's second injection. Taking drugs really has been the last thing on my mind.


>>34125

I still don't think it's likely that it came from a lab. Normally, viruses don't just get out by mistake. There'd have to be a pretty serious breach of safety protocols for a test tube or petri dish full of a pathogen to get out into the environment.

See also:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biosafety_level

It still doesn't mean the lab hypothesis can be falsified. That is true. But not every hypothesis is correct just because you can't disprove it.
>> No. 34127 Anonymous
14th June 2021
Monday 10:13 pm
34127 spacer
>>34126
>There'd have to be a pretty serious breach of safety protocols for a test tube or petri dish full of a pathogen to get out into the environment.

Well the Wuhan lab workers are on film getting bitten and splattered with blood without protection. Although we're not going to know until end of July at the earliest and China has plenty to cover up even if it was natural.
>> No. 34130 Anonymous
14th June 2021
Monday 11:41 pm
34130 spacer
>>34127

>Although we're not going to know until end of July at the earliest and China has plenty to cover up even if it was natural.

I don't know, still has a big ring of Trumpist retaliationism to me. Somebody has to be responsible, and that somebody has to be brought to justice, just like tham turrists what done 9/11.

Nobody blamed the U.S. or asked compensation of them when a Kansas chicken farmer's son became patient zero of the Spanish Flu and brought the virus with him to Europe in WWI. If you know what I mean.
>> No. 34132 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 2:02 am
34132 spacer
>>34130

>Nobody blamed the U.S. or asked compensation of them when a Kansas chicken farmer's son became patient zero of the Spanish Flu and brought the virus with him to Europe in WWI. If you know what I mean.

Maybe if that Kansas chicken farm was also a poorly run virology lab they would have.
>> No. 34133 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 2:59 am
34133 spacer
>>34132
A poorly run virology lab by any other name would still unfairly malign the nation of Spain.
>> No. 34135 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 9:36 am
34135 spacer
>>34127

Please bear in mind we live in an era where entire war scenes are staged for the purpose of propaganda and influencing global politics.

This is a really strong claim, not just that the lab was so unsafe, but that China (and also who in China, what authority?) covered things up.
>> No. 34136 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 10:24 am
34136 spacer
I bet you all think British labs are a much higher standard. On paper sure, but in reality? We Brits are renowned for our capability to half arse things.

It always comes down to people, and there's always some cunt who's having a bad day, woke up late that morning, can't be arsed, etc. That's all it takes. A system can be as robust as you like, the regulations can be as stringent as you want. It always comes down to people, and people are unreliable.
>> No. 34137 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 10:49 am
34137 spacer
>>34136

Not in BSL-4 labs mate, there is no fucking about with those. If your having a shit day, you can stay home.

Anyway:
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/14/world/asia/china-covid-wuhan-lab-leak.html

>Some scientists say Dr. Shi conducted risky experiments with bat coronaviruses in labs that were not safe enough. Others want clarity on reports, citing American intelligence, suggesting that there were early infections of Covid-19 among several employees of the Wuhan Institute of Virology.

>Dr. Shi has denied these accusations, and now finds herself defending the reputation of her lab and, by extension, that of her country. Reached on her cellphone two weeks ago, Dr. Shi said at first that she preferred not to speak directly with reporters, citing her institute’s policies. Yet she could barely contain her frustration.

>“How on earth can I offer up evidence for something where there is no evidence?” she said, her voice rising in anger during the brief, unscheduled conversation. “I don’t know how the world has come to this, constantly pouring filth on an innocent scientist,” she wrote in a text message.

>In a rare interview over email, she denounced the suspicions as baseless, including the allegations that several of her colleagues may have been ill before the outbreak emerged.

There you go, settled. Nothing to see here.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z95PiVUIRzw
>> No. 34138 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 10:50 am
34138 spacer
>>34137

you're*
please don't ban me
>> No. 34139 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 11:02 am
34139 spacer
>>34136
Being a half drunk moron who used to work in a virology lab, they lock you in. You're not allowed to leave for your entire shift, you take lunch in a separate room, and you're not the one responsible for your own decontamination protocol between rooms and upon leaving.

They get audited by both the FDA and the EMA 4 times a year and everything is recorded and monitored. It's almost impossible for a well run lab to breach protocol due to the actions of even 2 or 3 people in the chain having a bad day.

When accidents happen, the entire lab shuts down to deal with it. So, much like the silent majority of biology STEM professionals who believe the pandemic was Wuhan's fault due to them failing inspections and getting roasted over protocol by the FDA in the past, but wont speak about it publicly for fear of being fired, I'm also pretty certain it was their fault.

Never mind the fact that we still don't have a lineage or origin species for the strain to confirm a wild event, meaning it almost certainly came from a lab anyway. DNA doesn't lie and it's telling us that it's recombinant. We should listen and stop hand wringing about if China might not like us or not.
>> No. 34140 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 11:37 am
34140 spacer
>>34137
>>34139

Sure, but they always said the same thing about those deep sea oil rig diving bell things, until one day someone fucked up and several people had their intestines sucked out their arseholes by explosive decompression.

There's always failure points. I'm not defending Chinese labs or anything, they probably could have done with better protocol, but accidents happen and that's a fact of life. That's why we stopped fucking around with smallpox entirely, it was deemed not to be worth the risk.
>> No. 34141 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 12:37 pm
34141 spacer
>>34136

I can't speak for the biotech industry, but China have no great difficulty in running semiconductor cleanrooms. The sensitive parts of a high-end semiconductor cleanroom are 3-4 orders of magnitude cleaner than a GMP A cleanroom, although obviously that doesn't directly translate to BSL standards.
>> No. 34143 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 12:53 pm
34143 spacer
>>34141
There's a lab in Beijing from which SARS escaped four separate times.
>> No. 34144 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 12:53 pm
34144 spacer
>>34140
This, fuck-ups still happen and Dangerous pathogens do occasionally escape from secure labs despite safety precautions. This article has a good summary of some of the more serious incidents:

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2021-05-27/covid-19-and-lab-leak-history-smallpox-h1n1-sars

IIRC one of the foot & mouth outbreaks in the 2000s was also caused by a leak from a BSL4 facility.
>> No. 34145 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 12:59 pm
34145 spacer
Fuck lads, if it turns out it really did escape from a lab, all the experts telling us it's highly unlikely for it to have done so are really going to do wonders for the conspiracy theorist anti-democracy alt-right nutter movement.
>> No. 34146 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 1:00 pm
34146 spacer
>>34143

I'm not saying that the Chinese are infallible, but they're at least as competent as us. It's worth bearing in mind that China is absolutely fucking massive, so it's statistically inevitable that weird things will happen on a regular basis. If you're truly one-in-a-million, then there are 1400 of you in China.
>> No. 34147 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 1:29 pm
34147 spacer
>>34145
Money talks, but people also get afraid of putting their head above the parapet if they think they'll be shouted down for it. Just like Rotherham.
>> No. 34148 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 2:56 pm
34148 spacer
Am I too cynical for wondering if it really matters whether the virus came from a Chinese lab or not?
If you're a yank playing geostrategic games, it's convenient to say it did even if it didn't. If you're Chinese playing geostrategic games, it's convenient to say it didn't even though it did. If you're a conspiracy nutter then obviously the Americans got the Chinese to leak it because Agenda 21 was behind schedule. But nowhere in all of this is "what really happened" all that important. What difference does it make to me whether 2020 was ruined by accident or by the random fluctuations of biology?
I'm not being an idiot here, obviously if there was a lab leak then you've got to tighten up the lab and all that, but you'd think they'd do that even if the virus didn't come from there just because the scale of the damage from an error has now been made very clear indeed. But that's an internal matter for virus researchers and the Chinese government, a relatively small number of people - what's the difference to us in the general population?

More to the point: Unless China itself comes out and says "Actually we fucked up" or America comes out and says "Actually you didn't fuck up" it's hard to imagine there ever really being a definitive conclusion. One or both of them will just keep sniping at one another until it fades away because people born during the pandemic are now at the age where they're learning to self-drive their hovercars.
>> No. 34149 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 3:21 pm
34149 spacer
>>34148

>Am I too cynical for wondering if it really matters whether the virus came from a Chinese lab or not?

I don't see how that's cynical, it's just rational if you ask me. The thing isn't even over and we're worrying about the blame game? I think it just says a lot about people's priorities, but it shouldn't be surprising. It's just a large scale manifestation of what you see all the time on a lower level.

How many times have we all had to roll our eyes and bite our tongue when watching an incompetent manager find someone to bollock, instead of taking action to solve the problem? I have always imagined that to be a pretty relatable experience.
>> No. 34150 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 3:29 pm
34150 spacer
>>34135
>Please bear in mind we live in an era where entire war scenes are staged for the purpose of propaganda and influencing global politics.

We also live in a world where governments, especially authoritarian regimes, regularly fuck-up and try to hide the evidence no matter it's impact on the situation and history. Remember last year when there was a frantic search to work out where COVID-19 came from as that would directly assist the development of vaccines.

I get that you don't think crippling the international communities ability to fight pandemics (as Taiwan already understood from the lesson of SARS) isn't important because someone might not order a Chinese one night but come the fuck on. Was Chernobyl also unimportant?

>>34145
I mean the US government has performed experiments on its own population including deliberately infecting people with syphilis. It's not like conspiracy theorists have nothing to go on or that we probably won't find out in 20 years time that MI5 have been doing something outlandish like sneaking into our homes to replace our clothes with copies that are slightly tighter on the stomach.
>> No. 34151 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 3:59 pm
34151 spacer
>>34150

>I mean the US government has performed experiments on its own population including deliberately infecting people with syphilis

They've done a whole bunch of unethical experiments.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unethical_human_experimentation_in_the_United_States

They never quite went as far as the Nazis with their human experiments, but they still did some pretty depraved shit. Like administering radiactive isotopes to pregnant women and then studying the aborted fetuses to learn about the effects of radiation on unborn babies.
>> No. 34152 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 4:07 pm
34152 spacer
>>34151
When are we going to accept that we can prevent an unquantifiable amount of human suffering by throwing ethics out of the window for a few years?
>> No. 34153 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 4:11 pm
34153 spacer
>>34150
>We also live in a world where governments, especially authoritarian regimes, regularly fuck-up and try to hide the evidence no matter it's impact on the situation and history.

I agree, both things are true. In that case, then, what do you think we should rely on in order to determine the truth of the situation? I would still stand by evidence, preferably verified by a politically independent body (or as independent as any can be). I would want to see the video you're talking about, and if it does have any basis, for it to be investigated. Beyond that I'd be extremely skeptical.

>I get that you don't think crippling the international communities ability to fight pandemics (as Taiwan already understood from the lesson of SARS) isn't important because someone might not order a Chinese one night but come the fuck on.

This is a total non-sequitor. Requesting evidence for a strong claim does not mean I don't care.
>> No. 34154 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 4:21 pm
34154 spacer
>>34152

Some of the most unethical studies produced little to no medical benefit. One of the most famous examples from that list, the Tuskegee syphilis trials, were just depriving people of effective treatment in order to observe the natural course of the disease with minimally effective treatments. Unsurprisingly, subjects got sick and died.

You're also assuming that those who would throw out ethics would be doing so in order to improve medical care. It seems very likely that this approach would lead to greatly increased research into biological weapons.

A final trite-but-true counterpoint to what you're saying would be: if you truly believe this, why not give your live body to medical science? Or do you only want ethics thrown out the window when it comes to experimentation on other people?
>> No. 34155 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 4:30 pm
34155 spacer
>>34152

Covid-19 vaccine research did bend the previously accepted standards of ethics, because normally it takes years from your first ground-level research to clinical trial studies and then finally the approval of a governing body before a vaccine or a drug becomes more or less widely available.

Although there is no reason to believe that the covid vaccines that are in existence now will cause long-term harm to a significant number of people, there was no time to make any kind of adequate long-term assessment about them, beyond the few months of the duration of the clinical trials. It was just assumed that the urgency of the global situation outweighed all other considerations like that.

That's about as far as we should ever push ethics. We've seen so far that the vast majority of patients have no serious adverse reaction to the vaccines, but it might be that we were just lucky. At least in theory, disasters like the Thalidomide scandal could happen again anytime if we don't thoroughly test drugs.
>> No. 34156 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 4:43 pm
34156 spacer
>>34152
I think Fallout style shelters would be pretty interesting, and some of the more notable ones almost actually resemble compelling experiments.

Obviously testing 'everything' on a bevvy of clones would surely produce some interesting results. Could find a few more natural remedies maybe, that kind of thing. Test all the distillates of all the flora etc.

What kind of direction would you take?

>>34154
Why are you trying to 'win' rather than entertain the topic?

>Some of the most unethical studies produced little to no medical benefit.
Yeah, but that's not integral to it. You obviously have a higher/broader ceiling for what can be discerned if the range of experiments is wider.

>You're also assuming that those who would throw out ethics would be doing so in order to improve medical care.
I don't think he is, I think that's integral to their premise of what they said, otherwise this would have been the obvious answer and it wouldn't be interesting to talk about.

>A final trite-but-true
It's not true though, is it. It's all trite.

>Or do you only want ethics thrown out the window when it comes to experimentation on other people?
Speaking for myself, yes. That's why this would be unethical. Keep up. To be slightly more serious, I'm assuming these tests would be done on people who were born specifically for this purpose, and who wouldn't have any knowledge of what they were missing out on. They'd just exist simply to suffer, and by doing so ease the suffering of others.

Your pedantry would be interesting if you applied it better.
>> No. 34157 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 4:45 pm
34157 spacer
>>34150

>Remember last year when there was a frantic search to work out where COVID-19 came from as that would directly assist the development of vaccines.

I don't actually remember that. The SARS-CoV-2 genome was published by China on the 11th of January and four candidate vaccines had entered human trials before the end of March.

The CCP doesn't believe in a right to free speech and exercises substantial control over the dissemination of information, but I have seen no credible evidence that they hid anything of real substance.

The argument that a Chinese cover-up hindered the ability of other countries to respond effectively to the pandemic is starkly contradicted by just how slowly many governments (including our own) responded to information that was fully in the public domain. China was publicly saying "we have identified a novel coronavirus, it is highly dangerous and it is spreading from human to human" and started a WHO working group in the second week of January, but we didn't even start ordering PPE until mid-March.

Maybe the Chinese knew more than they were letting on in late November or early December of 2019, but I don't see how that would have in any way affected our response. We were complacent, we were arrogant and we find it convenient to blame someone else.
>> No. 34158 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 5:05 pm
34158 spacer
>>34151

The US never went as far as the Nazis, they were pretty fucking keen to get their hands on the information from concentration camp experiments and things like the Japanese Unit 731 atrocities. Foreign war crimes have proven very valuable to American science over the years.
>> No. 34159 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 5:17 pm
34159 spacer

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvDQft9enw4
>> No. 34160 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 5:22 pm
34160 spacer
>>34159

Police just standing watching?
>> No. 34161 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 5:33 pm
34161 spacer
>>34160
Better than that. Saw it happening, shook their heads and went "nope" before turning around to pretend it wasn't happening.
>> No. 34162 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 5:35 pm
34162 spacer
>>34161

He must have said something unflattering about Patel.
>> No. 34163 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 6:01 pm
34163 spacer
>>34159
Can we make being an anti-vax/anti-lockdown/contrarian cunt a capital crime already?
>> No. 34164 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 6:07 pm
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>>34163

The anti-lockdown people are generally supportive of the Tories. There's the same septic conspiracy mindedness of a corrupt left-wing deep state forcing their hand as other than that, Johnson's shit obviously doesn't stink.
>> No. 34165 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 6:22 pm
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>>34158

>The US never went as far as the Nazis, they were pretty fucking keen to get their hands on the information from concentration camp experiments

The human experiment data from Nazi concentration camps is still seen as a noteworthy body of work. While racist, cruel, and unethical beyond words, they did quite remarkable research on many things. Although it's impossible to consider it an achievement of science, because they really cared squat if a test subject died from hypothermia or suffocated during high-altitude experiments. In terms of regard for human life, their subjects were little more than crash test dummies to Nazi doctors.

There was substantial debate after the war if Nazi findings should be permitted to enter medicine as a whole, but it was felt that in all the horror, this was a way of honouring the victims who died or suffered lifelong effects from these experiments.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_human_experimentation
>> No. 34166 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 7:02 pm
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>>34156
>Why are you trying to 'win' rather than entertain the topic?

Disagreement doesn't mean I'm trying to "win", it just means I disagree. Lifting all ethical boundaries off medical research would have real world consequences, and as far as I know we have no evidence that it would improve medical care in any way. In fact, we have more historical evidence that being lax with medical ethics leads to the opposite; not just a lack of concern for human life to begin with, but also generally ineffective studies. I mentioned Tuskegee for a reason.

If you're going to make the argument for something that is certainly going to harm human life in the present for some tradeoff in the future, you should really make a decent case that "unquantifiable human suffering" would be prevented. The poster didn't do that, and neither did you.

>It's not true though, is it. It's all trite.

What's not true about what I said? If all medical ethics were hypothetically erased tomorrow, what's to prevent you or anyone you care about from becoming a test subject? Breeding people especially for the purpose is something you just pulled out of thin air, so it's not something I could have mentioned in the original post.

It's a really silly throwaway post that I've clearly treated too seriously. Still, pointing out the flaws in a half-baked idea in three or four sentences isn't pedantry unless you have an extremely short attention span. I'm just applying a bit of reasoning.

If you really want me to play devil's advocate to try and at least make this an interesting question, in an environment with absolutely no ethical boundaries, you could potentially do some invasive anatomical experiments for areas of the body we still lack knowledge about. Our understanding of neuroscience would stand to jump forward this way, but there's no way of knowing whether such knowledge would translate to the development of, say, effective therapies for neurological conditions -- that's a related but distinct area of research. You could also draw some tenuous parallels to stem cell research or the lifting of religious taboos on studying corpses in the Renaissance, but clusters of cells and cadavers are quite different from living human beings.
>> No. 34167 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 7:45 pm
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I got my first jab today and, being a wacky comedian with a penchant for tomfoolery, I made a silly little joke about installing 5G. I don't think I've ever seen someone groan quite like that before as he revealed he's heard it almost every 15 minutes for weeks on end.

Don't do it, lads. It's not just the shame of it but the fact that I'm liable to remember this for the rest of my life.

Also you can't just turn up anymore, they were checking and asking people without an appointment to piss off.
>> No. 34168 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 7:59 pm
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>>34157
Nope. If you'd even spent 5 minutes on google you would know that China fucked up and its neighbours suffered the effects of covid in reverse proportion to the time they stop listening to China's bullshit.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-52573137

>The argument that a Chinese cover-up hindered the ability of other countries to respond effectively to the pandemic is starkly contradicted by just how slowly many governments (including our own) responded to information that was fully in the public domain.

Whataboutism.
>> No. 34169 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 8:08 pm
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I didn't get given a sticker with my jab.
Who do I complain to?
>> No. 34170 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 8:44 pm
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>>34169
Complain to me. They offered me a sticker when I went for my second one, and I refused quite aggressively. I have personal reasons for not liking the stickers they give out. Then I thought, "Maybe she's just trying to be nice", and I asked to look at the sticker I had refused. It was one of the evil stickers that spreads ignorance and laziness and panders to the imbeciles of society, ruining my own quality of life by proxy, as I had expected, so I recoiled once again and left. I can only assume my revulsion was so visible that they threw all the remaining stickers away.

You must meet all sorts of people being a vaccination volunteer. I bet they'll have some stories once everyone has been vaccinated.
>> No. 34171 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 8:47 pm
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>>34169

1st or 2nd jab? If it was your 2nd, then you should write a strongly-worded email to the Smuggery Ombudsman.

(I slapped my sticker in the big space on my Care Identity Service Smartcard, before anyone accuses me of anything incorrect)
>> No. 34172 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 8:48 pm
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>>34168

>you would know that China fucked up

This is pretty much the gist of everything you read on any respectable news site.

China's government is like a big black box. Being that democracy and checks and balances are very profoundly absent in the country, the Chinese government has a habit of bending reality and suppressing the truth any way they fucking please. So they covered it up in the hope that it was going to be a non-issue that would somehow resolve itself, maybe kill a few people along the way here and there, but who's counting when you've got a population of close to 1.4 billion. And you had those public festivities coming up, I can't remember what they were called, so some stray virus did not fit in with state propaganda.

And so, precious time was wasted during which the outbreak probably could have been contained regionally, or at least kept from spreading around the globe. It was only when the situation was gravely out of control that they decided to lock down entire cities, which was evidently too little, too late.
>> No. 34173 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 9:06 pm
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>>34172

>the outbreak probably could have been contained regionally, or at least kept from spreading around the globe

There's absolutely no chance of that with a virus as infectious as SARS-CoV-2 and a country as connected as China. Wuhan has a bigger population than London, a national railway hub and an international airport. The cat was out of the bag before anyone could have figured out what was going on.
>> No. 34174 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 9:16 pm
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>>34172
Chinese New Year, people travelling from all over the world to see family and celebrate with millions of other people.

It's almost comedic looking back at old videos going over the predicament and China's authoritarian regime influencing the flow of information because it represents a form of power in itself. We actually predicted this would all be over by spring 2020.

>> No. 34175 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 9:24 pm
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>>34172
I know it's a dangerous track to get going down, but I find it hard to imagine that our own government and structures of government (which fucked everything up very badly indeed) would've done any better. You say locking down cities was too little too late - but unless they're really lying about the numbers, it achieved a damn sight more to stop the spread than our approach did.
Sure, a more democratic system of government might've got the message out there earlier - but then you see how our government reacted when we got the message. Oh, it'll be nothing, we'll just have herd immunity, it'll all be over by Christmas. Are we somehow to imagine we'd have behaved more responsibly if the issue they had to deal with was "Some people in Wuhanshire have a new strain of illness" rather than the knowledge that a global pandemic was already in motion?
>> No. 34176 Anonymous
15th June 2021
Tuesday 9:49 pm
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>>34175

>Are we somehow to imagine we'd have behaved more responsibly if the issue they had to deal with was "Some people in Wuhanshire have a new strain of illness" rather than the knowledge that a global pandemic was already in motion?

I think the two weeks or so during which China tried to suppress information about a new strain of virus running rampant were absolutely crucial. Governments worldwide could have bought themselves and their people some time by issuing travel bans and closing borders not after the first infected travellers arrived from abroad, but before.

It also would have helped if China had investigated Sars-CoV-2 right when it became clear that it was a new, fast-spreading respiratory virus capable of killing people, and relayed that information to other countries. Pretty much all the way into the first month or so, nobody really had any idea what we were actually dealing with.
>> No. 34177 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 12:03 am
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>>34176

>I think the two weeks or so during which China tried to suppress information about a new strain of virus running rampant were absolutely crucial. Governments worldwide could have bought themselves and their people some time by issuing travel bans and closing borders not after the first infected travellers arrived from abroad, but before.

We took two months to do anything of substance. It's very clear that any delay by the Chinese made no difference whatsoever - the countries that responded promptly and effectively to the WHO announcement (Vietnam, Singapore, Australia etc) did fine, while those that waited until the disease arrived on their doorstep totally fucked it.

Hong Kong and Taiwan started screening and isolating arrivals from China at the end of December, immediately after a warning of an unidentified pneumonia outbreak was issued by the Wuhan Health Commission. By the second week of January, the SARS-CoV-2 genome had been sequenced and published by the Chinese authorities. We flew people back from Hubei at the end of January, then did absolutely fuck all until March.

In New Zealand, there have been 5 COVID deaths per million population. Singapore have had 6 per million. 21 per million in Thailand, 35 per million in Australia, 39 per million in South Korea. Our figure? 1,875 per million.

The warnings issued by China were more than sufficient for the countries that actually listened; for the countries that didn't, no amount of extra time would have made a jot of difference.
>> No. 34178 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 10:15 am
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>>34177

Either way, you would hope that it will have consequences for global prevention and contingency plans in the future.

Maybe the assumption that it was "just a flu" caught too many people, including governments, on the wrong foot. And now that we've seen the worldwide upheaval that a virus like this can cause, maybe next time we'll be better prepared.
>> No. 34179 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 11:21 am
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>>34159
That video is shit and shows none of the action.



The police have lifted the tattooed crusty, unfairly in my opinion. Presumably they knew who he was already. Man bun has my vote to take the fall for this.
>> No. 34180 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 12:41 pm
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>>34178
>Maybe the assumption that it was "just a flu" caught too many people, including governments, on the wrong foot.

If by caught on the wrong foot you mean 'actively pursuing a herd immunity strategy' before March. There's no excuse - I remember by February reading testimonies from British people living in China who had had the disease and described in horrific detail what it does to you. The other poster is absolutely right, the failure here is not China's, notwithstanding their attempt to cover it up in 2019.
>> No. 34181 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 1:00 pm
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>>34180

>If by caught on the wrong foot you mean 'actively pursuing a herd immunity strategy' before March.

It stands to argue that that was done exactly because BoJo thought it was little more than "just a flu".
>> No. 34182 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 2:07 pm
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I just talked to a friend who has an autoimmune disorder and is on permanent immune suppressants. He was in one of the highest priority groups, but a good few weeks after his second jab, he did an antibody test on the advice of his GP, and it came back negative today, i.e. his immune system did not respond to the vaccine at all.

Which is really bad news for somebody like him, because in addition to not having antibodies now, it means that he'll be much more vulnerable to serious symptoms to begin with from an actual covid infection.
>> No. 34183 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 2:11 pm
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>>34177
Again, whataboutism, China made a hash of thing and Britain made a hash of things. It's not either or, stop trying to deflect from the fact that the Chinese government is a fuck up.

>the countries that responded promptly and effectively to the WHO announcement (Vietnam, Singapore, Australia etc) did fine, while those that waited until the disease arrived on their doorstep totally fucked it.

Vietnam had outbreaks prior to the WHO announcement of a pandemic and even before the WHO had announced Covid as a cause for international concern. So no, people still died because the international response and monitoring wasn't good enough.
>> No. 34184 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 2:14 pm
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https://dominiccummings.substack.com/p/the-pm-on-hancock-totally-fucking
>> No. 34185 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 2:22 pm
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>>34184
I can't help but like Cummings for reasons like this. I don't like him, I think he'll sell out his own mother to get out of trouble, and of course he's full of spin, but he was clearly working at this with some pride. Would like to see some less cherrypicked screenshots.
>> No. 34186 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 3:12 pm
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>>34185

The length of that twitter thread leads me to believe that he is a Britfa poster...
>> No. 34187 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 3:30 pm
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>>34186
He'd certainly fit in our spectrum.
>> No. 34188 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 5:24 pm
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>>34183
Whataboutism is one of the most irritating charges there is. If you can't compare a scenario to a set of alternatives, what's the point in even having a discussion? "The Chinese government fucked up" "Yes, very true" "Great thanks, really enjoyed our chat today."
Just one of those awful little terms that originally started with a nice, clear case of obviously pointing out silly buggery ("The IRA did X" "Yeah, but what about the UDA doing Y?") but which can now be leveled at the basic conventions of writing itself.

I find it hard to even see this as even being a case of whataboutism. I read >>34177 not as "China fucked up, but what about our own fuckups?" but "Even if China did fuck up, the warning given was more than sufficient for other countries. You can't blame insufficient warning for our problems. If they'd warned us 2 weeks earlier, we'd have spent 2 more weeks dawdling." - Call that deflection from China's fuckups ("Yes, very true") if you want, but there's a big difference between deflecting by arguing for the irrelevance of their error to real world outcomes, and deflecting by just going "but what about these errors on our part?"
>> No. 34189 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 5:44 pm
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>>34188

>You can't blame insufficient warning for our problems.

Precisely. Worldwide there have been 3.8 million COVID deaths so far, of which approximately 3.8 million could have been prevented by people other than the Chinese government. We don't need hypotheticals and we don't need to speculate on how things might have played out differently if China had been more forthcoming.

If you crash when you're doing twice the speed limit, it's just silly to complain that you wouldn't have crashed if the speed limit had been lower - it's your own fault for ignoring the speed limit in the first place. We (like a lot of other countries) took months to act on the warnings given by China, so it's silly to argue that China should have warned us a couple of weeks earlier.

There's a legitimate argument that China engaged in a cover-up, there's a legitimate argument that China weren't sure how to respond to an uncertain and rapidly-developing situation, but it doesn't make a jot of difference either way. Arguments about the culpability of China are nothing more than a distraction.
>> No. 34190 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 6:24 pm
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>>34177
>We flew people back from Hubei at the end of January, then did absolutely fuck all until March.

Correction: We flew people back in January from Hubei in January, then let them walk straight out of the airport without even offering them tests or giving them advice to self isolate.
>> No. 34192 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 7:11 pm
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>>34188
We're specifically talking about whether we should investigate China's part in the pandemic. So yes, yes it is whataboutism.
>> No. 34193 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 7:24 pm
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>>34192
I find it hard to see the "whatabout" in an argument that runs: "Who cares? It would not have made a major difference to have had additional warning."
I suppose you could phrase it "What about the fact it wouldn't have made any difference", but you get into a very funny place when you start going "Well who cares that it wouldn't make any difference? they still messed up!" and having that ultimately meaningless error be your main focus in the midst of a global pandemic. (Now that is whataboutism - who cares about the structural flaws of Chinese government, whatabout the pandemic?)

Of course, while we're making whataboutism stop looking like a real word we're avoiding the potentially interesting point of contention: Would it have made a difference?
>> No. 34194 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 7:44 pm
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>>34193
>Now that is whataboutism - who cares about the structural flaws of Chinese government, whatabout the pandemic?

You'll never be the mouthpiece of the Soviet Union with that kind of limp-wristed accusation. You have to look at the speakers country and pull out the adjectives file for that nation.

>Would it have made a difference?

Yes. We're not just talking about Britain but the whole world, countries on China's periphery that could've avoided deaths. This is why the WHO goes on about improving international monitoring, not just to make themselves feel better.
>> No. 34195 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 9:11 pm
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>>34194

>countries on China's periphery that could've avoided deaths

Sure, whatever you say mate.
>> No. 34196 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 9:39 pm
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>>34195
Picking the one country that immediately went Madagascar because it knows it can't trust China isn't such a good argument m7.
>> No. 34197 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 9:50 pm
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>>34196

Fact I leaned the other day, the US has threatened to Nuke china if it invaded Taiwan. That is serious no fuck around diplomacy
>> No. 34198 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 10:07 pm
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>>34196
>> No. 34199 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 10:08 pm
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>>34198
>> No. 34200 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 10:10 pm
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>>34199
>> No. 34201 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 10:11 pm
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>>34200
>> No. 34202 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 10:13 pm
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>>34201
>> No. 34203 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 10:19 pm
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>>34198
Why are you trying to pass off deaths rather than infections?
>> No. 34204 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 10:27 pm
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>>34203

>>34194

>countries on China's periphery that could've avoided deaths
>> No. 34205 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 10:48 pm
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>>34204
Ah, so you're deliberately being thick on how an infectious disease in a population can kill over time and even remain undetected. I don't even get what you're trying to prove at this point - we know that China fucked up hard and that authorities utterly failed to limit the spread of the virus (instead choosing to turn against the whistle-blowers). There's not even a debate to be had.
>> No. 34206 Anonymous
16th June 2021
Wednesday 11:42 pm
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>>34205
If you don't know what he's trying to prove "at this point" you don't know what he's been trying to say all along: Earlier warning from China would not have made much difference. We can see this from the fact that all countries had about the same amount of warning and yet their outcomes vary wildly depending on the nature of their domestic response. Some, like Britain, did nothing with the warning they were given. Others, like New Zealand, responded early on. This isn't a function of geographical distance either: plenty of countries directly bordering China, which will have been infected before they were warned, nevertheless lead a far more competent response than other countries further away.

Now of course if China had caught the virus right away and there wasn't a global Coronavirus pandemic at all, that would be the ideal situation, but now you're substituting "China should have warned the world earlier instead of trying to cover it up" with "China should've locked down Wuhan the second the whistleblowers whistleblew."
>> No. 34213 Anonymous
17th June 2021
Thursday 8:30 pm
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>British Finance Minister Rishi Sunak has ruled out further extension of support to businesses in England, despite the UK government forcing many to close for an extra four weeks, The Financial Times reported on Thursday.
>"What we did was deliberately go big and go long in terms of the support, we erred on the side of generosity," Sunak said in an interview to the paper, adding: "We very explicitly said at the time that was to accommodate delays to the road map."
https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/uks-sunak-refuses-help-businesses-hit-by-extended-covid-19-restrictions-ft-2021-06-17/

That's nightclubs fucked then.
>> No. 34214 Anonymous
17th June 2021
Thursday 8:43 pm
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>>34213

Doesn't furlough continue until September? I didn't realise there was additional help on top.
>> No. 34216 Anonymous
17th June 2021
Thursday 9:47 pm
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>>34213

Good. Shit overpriced venues playing loud, shit music, designed to make you feel uncomfortable and then offer the solution in the form of an alcoholic solution.
>> No. 34217 Anonymous
17th June 2021
Thursday 10:12 pm
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>>34216
Not everyone is burdoned with crippling self-doubt only kept at bay by an impenetrable shield of misanthropy. I mean, I am, but not everyone else is.
>> No. 34218 Anonymous
17th June 2021
Thursday 11:47 pm
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>>34216

I don't know about you but I'm fucking dying for one of those nights out where you start off with halloumi bites in Spoons and end up doing lines in the bogs at a Reflex and spend an hour talking at length about the state of Labour to someone you are only mates of mates of mates with.

It's not something I make a habit of but the length of abstinence this situation has forced on us has sent me a bit loopy. I badly need a blowout.
>> No. 34219 Anonymous
18th June 2021
Friday 8:58 am
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tfUnjJXsZzE
>> No. 34220 Anonymous
18th June 2021
Friday 8:59 am
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>>34219

Simon Stevens CEO of NHS England btw.
>> No. 34221 Anonymous
18th June 2021
Friday 9:07 am
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>>34219
I always wonder how you lot find these weird little YouTube channels that upload clips of their favourite MPs with flattering video titles. Safe to say I've figured it out now.
>> No. 34222 Anonymous
18th June 2021
Friday 9:15 am
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>>34221
>Mordaunt
>> No. 34223 Anonymous
18th June 2021
Friday 5:12 pm
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>>34221

Phwoar
>> No. 34224 Anonymous
18th June 2021
Friday 5:23 pm
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The Delta variant has to be the last one of note, right? How much can a virus mutate?
>> No. 34225 Anonymous
18th June 2021
Friday 6:21 pm
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>>34224

>How much can a virus mutate?

Pretty much indefinitely. You need a flu jab every year because the virus mutates, not because the vaccine wears off. The relatively low effectiveness of the flu vaccine (40%-60%) is because there are multiple strains in circulation and we have to guess in advance which will be most prevalent.

We would eventually expect SARS-CoV-2 to mutate to become more infectious but less deadly, because that's an optimal evolutionary strategy for a virus. We'll also start to develop more durable immunity as people undergo several rounds of infection and/or vaccination. The problem is that we don't know how long it'll take to reach that level of equilibrium. The current vaccination program might be enough to keep hospitalisations at an acceptable level, but I think it's likely that we'll have some level of social restrictions re-imposed over the next several years as new variants emerge and seasonal outbreaks wax and wane.

>>34221

Her hair always looks carefully styled but slightly tousled, like she has been interrupted mid-shag and had to get dressed in a hurry. She reminds me of Mrs Purchase off of Toast of London.
>> No. 34226 Anonymous
18th June 2021
Friday 6:26 pm
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>>34225
> You need a flu jab every year
U wot m8.
>> No. 34227 Anonymous
18th June 2021
Friday 6:35 pm
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>>34224
As brief an answer as possible, basically there are a vast number of ways in which a virus can mutate, but any particular coronavirus only has a narrow window of possible mutations that are functionally useful. The delta variant is mostly just a cumulation of the same mutations we've already seen occurring separately. Other types of virus like HIV or the flu have much wider avenues of possible mutations due to their form.

https://theconversation.com/can-scientists-predict-all-of-the-ways-the-coronavirus-will-evolve-156673
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-coronavirus-variants-dont-seem-to-be-highly-variable-so-far/

>we can easily identify candidate mutations from the genome sequence data, because they have emerged over and over again during the course of the pandemic.
>These dozen or so mutations, in various combinations, are the defining feature of all variants
>Despite the increased caseload and death resulting from these mutations, can we at least take cold comfort from the fact that the total number of such mutations appears to be limited?
>But the properties of the virus are probably not determined by single mutations in isolation, but in how several mutations interact. This combinatorial perspective suddenly opens up new zones of potentially fruitful mutational space for the virus.
>> No. 34228 Anonymous
18th June 2021
Friday 7:01 pm
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>>34226

Older people and anyone who works in healthcare is encouraged to do so. It's often not thought of as a deadly disease, but somewhere around 400-600,000 people die of flu worldwide every year. The thing with flu is nearly every cunt gets it at some stage.

You can partially see why comparisons to flu were made early on with covid. There's a lot of hindsight going on in the discourse but, frankly, it wasn't all that irrational of an assessment back then, when we had so little information to go on. I think the biggest misapprehension at the time was that when saying it's "just a flu", most people didn't realise that just the flu still isn't actually something to be taken lightly. The health service goes to considerable lengths to prepare for and mitigate it every year.

Over time the evidence we are seeing with the new variants is that it is taking a similar path. In a few years time covid likely will be "just a flu", and we will deal with it similarly. People will still die like they do from flu, but it will be a smaller number we can tolerate and mitigate without the same level of disruption.

What's really fascinating is the way our actions in response to the virus have shaped the mutations.
>> No. 34229 Anonymous
18th June 2021
Friday 9:34 pm
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>>34228
But you said You!
>> No. 34230 Anonymous
18th June 2021
Friday 11:23 pm
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>>34229

Back to "Comment is Free" with you.
>> No. 34281 Anonymous
25th June 2021
Friday 6:56 am
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>The health secretary Matt Hancock has been accused of cheating on his wife with a close friend and lobbyist who is a taxpayer-funded adviser to his department.

>He was allegedly caught on camera kissing Gina Coladangelo, according to The Sun, which published photographs of what it called a “steamy clinch”. The security camera pictures were taken on 6 May but the pair have been seen together on other occasions, the newspaper said.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/matt-hancock-gina-coladangelo-affair-b1872505.html

Matt Hancock: Top Shagger.
>> No. 34282 Anonymous
25th June 2021
Friday 9:18 am
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>>34281
They both look slightly out of his league. What a seed. I understand why people do it, but to do it as the health secretary during a pandemic where you've been labelled as 'fucking useless' by your boss and the public...
>> No. 34283 Anonymous
25th June 2021
Friday 9:22 am
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>>34282
She looks like a Hispanic Konnie Huq.
>> No. 34284 Anonymous
25th June 2021
Friday 9:32 am
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Looks too awkward and staged to me. Just another pointless distraction though at this point I'm not sure if they need to distract anyone.
>> No. 34286 Anonymous
25th June 2021
Friday 9:43 am
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>>34284
Nah, he's doing the signature hand on bum that you have to do when cheating in public.
>> No. 34292 Anonymous
25th June 2021
Friday 10:32 am
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgHv4jenUr0
>> No. 34298 Anonymous
25th June 2021
Friday 12:18 pm
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>>34281
Imagine being her husband right now, who believed all those crayon marks on her collar came from volunteering at a pre-school.
>> No. 34299 Anonymous
25th June 2021
Friday 12:33 pm
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>>34298
I suppose the silver lining is that you're 150% secure from prosecution when you go absolutely chimpanzee mode on Matt Hancocks face and genitals. It'll go to trial, but no one's convicting.
>> No. 34300 Anonymous
25th June 2021
Friday 1:30 pm
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>Matt Hancock tells Brits to avoid casual sex and stick to 'established' partners
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/matt-hancock-tells-brits-avoid-22735271

We should've known something was up with how giggly Kay Burley got.
>> No. 34329 Anonymous
27th June 2021
Sunday 11:58 pm
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>>34300

Sweet irony.
>> No. 34330 Anonymous
28th June 2021
Monday 9:04 am
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>>34300

He can bollocks, I'm going to go to a festival and knob a Polish bird in a tent if it's the only thing I do this summer.
>> No. 34331 Anonymous
28th June 2021
Monday 10:55 am
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>>34330
Might want to pick up a newspaper m7. They've all fucked off back to their own country.
>> No. 34346 Anonymous
29th June 2021
Tuesday 2:20 pm
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KslXveK-qw8

Top lads.
>> No. 34347 Anonymous
29th June 2021
Tuesday 2:32 pm
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>>34346
So they'll investigate that? Pathetic.
>> No. 34348 Anonymous
29th June 2021
Tuesday 4:35 pm
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>>34347

As a rule, it's a bad idea to record yourself assaulting one of the most important men in Britain.
>> No. 34351 Anonymous
29th June 2021
Tuesday 8:05 pm
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>>34346

Don't know why, but this is really depressing. Whitty is just a doctor and epidemiologist, why is it top bantz to sling your arm around him?
>> No. 34352 Anonymous
29th June 2021
Tuesday 8:55 pm
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>>34351
Because he's part of the government, and if you dislike the government then he's ripe for some top bantz.
>> No. 34353 Anonymous
29th June 2021
Tuesday 9:18 pm
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>>34347
What do you mean? What have they not investigated that has given you cause to think this isn't worth investigating?

>>34352
I disagree, it's not even about disliking the government, this seems more about petty power games. Chris Whitty as a figure is almost antithetical to lad culture, looks a bit weird and is very nerdy. It's just like school dynamics, with the laddy lads being inclusive to the unladdy lads specifically to make them feel like an outsider.

I never got bullied.
>> No. 34354 Anonymous
29th June 2021
Tuesday 9:32 pm
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>>34353
This. He's a weedy pushover.
>> No. 34357 Anonymous
29th June 2021
Tuesday 10:54 pm
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>>34351
I know they were drunk but I'm surprised they lacked even the basic sense not to film it.

>>34354
What I don't understand is why he didn't retreat into his shell upon sensing danger?
>> No. 34361 Anonymous
30th June 2021
Wednesday 12:29 am
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>>34357
We discussed this at work today. I pointed out that if Chris Whitty had hulked out and decked the banter boyz like John Wick or something, they probably wouldn't have released the video, and then the news story would be, "Chris Whitty arrested for assaulting innocent lads in a park." They'd be on the news saying they were just minding their own business when Chris "Professor Chris Hitty" Whitty came out of nowhere and battered them all for no reason.
>> No. 34362 Anonymous
30th June 2021
Wednesday 10:13 am
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>>34354

HOW DO YOU GET THAT SHIRT SO CLEAN MATE?
>> No. 34363 Anonymous
30th June 2021
Wednesday 10:19 am
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>>34362
I can picture Whitty saying "I'm not the Borough."
>> No. 34364 Anonymous
30th June 2021
Wednesday 10:28 am
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>>34353
>What have they not investigated
The government for this past two years. This video is just some drunk tossers being drunk tossers, it's ultimately harmless. Unlike endemic corruption.
>> No. 34365 Anonymous
30th June 2021
Wednesday 11:47 am
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>>34364
Yeah, those two issues are really very close in scope and scale. Endemic corruption and the banter boys require the same strategies to conquer, and if you can't spare the thousands of man hours for one, you shouldn't spare the thousands of hours to investigate a video uploaded by the perpetrators themselves clearly showing their faces. Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good and all that bollocks.
>> No. 34366 Anonymous
30th June 2021
Wednesday 11:54 am
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>>34365
>Yeah, those two issues are really very close in scope and scale.
"Why bother investigating a murder when we've got someone littering on camera?"
>> No. 34367 Anonymous
30th June 2021
Wednesday 12:49 pm
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>>34366
I'm so sorry, I didn't realise you'd been lobotomised.
>> No. 34368 Anonymous
30th June 2021
Wednesday 2:13 pm
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>>34367
Sorry yes. It's a standard part of the induction week for the civil service
>> No. 34369 Anonymous
30th June 2021
Wednesday 2:29 pm
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>>34367
Mate your previous response was basically incoherent.

Nobody implied that the issues were close in scope or scale, that they aren't is even the point. It doesn't matter that they require different strategies to deal with if the problem is that they're actively refusing to deal with one at all. Then you managed to imply both require the same number of man hours to deal with, which is obviously not true and if it was would undermine the point you were trying to make about scope and scale.

Fact remains, if it were someone outside of the government being harassed like that, even on camera, the police would tell him to grow a thicker skin then shelve it.
>> No. 34370 Anonymous
30th June 2021
Wednesday 2:41 pm
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>>34369
>It doesn't matter that they require different strategies to deal with if the problem is that they're actively refusing to deal with one at all.
No it doesn't. The corruption exists and should be dealt with, but saying it's pathetic to investigate some low level banter while not investigating the entire government, that's mental. No one has said corruption shouldn't be investigated, or that ministers should not be held accountable. Whoever it was posting earlier just seems to have taken the twitter character limit to heart, and it's had an impact on their ability to say anything that isn't a pithy clapback.

>Then you managed to imply both require the same number of man hours to deal with, which is obviously not true and if it was would undermine the point you were trying to make about scope and scale.
>which is obviously not true and if it was would undermine the point you were trying to make
>obviously not true
>obviously
Yes, yes it was. I'm glad you got that.
>> No. 34371 Anonymous
30th June 2021
Wednesday 2:47 pm
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>>34370
>No one has said corruption shouldn't be investigated, or that ministers should not be held accountable.
Nobody except, you know, the people whose job it is to do those things.
>> No. 34372 Anonymous
30th June 2021
Wednesday 3:06 pm
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>>34371
So not on here, the only place that matters!

Just a skim, but it looks like they didn't take a 225 page dossier, independently produced, about Cummings drive, which likely would have been impeccable, concise, and precise in its presentation. The second article confirms their investigation determined that Cummings hadn't committed an offence. The third article just says it should be investigated by a different body. Let's not just make things up.

I agree that the police should be doing more regarding corruption, and the things ministers can get away with are absolutely fucking mental, it just seems completely pointless to the police pathetic for investigating the assault of Britain's premier epidemiologist.
>> No. 34373 Anonymous
30th June 2021
Wednesday 3:16 pm
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>>34372
Nobody on here, said that anybody on here said it, so your argument falls apart immediately.

>I agree that the police should be doing more regarding corruption, and the things ministers can get away with are absolutely fucking mental, it just seems completely pointless to the police pathetic for investigating the assault of Britain's premier epidemiologist.
If it was politically motivated then yes that would be worth investigating but it's obviously not. They probably didn't even know who he is. This is a case of some bloke being mildly harassed by some drunk tossers and if he were anyone else, would be ignored. I realise he's an important figure but I'm of the extremist belief that the justice system should treat us all equally and not play favourites.

>it just seems completely pointless
As is everything on this website.
>> No. 34374 Anonymous
30th June 2021
Wednesday 4:36 pm
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I'm usually loath to complain about supposed soft-touch sentencing, but it just seems a bit bonkers to be clamouring for a police investigation for Witty (against his wishes) when ordinarily the end result is this ineffectual:

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/joys-badge-read-please-patient-20902333
>> No. 34377 Anonymous
30th June 2021
Wednesday 7:41 pm
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>>34374
Yeah, I didn't mean to be in support of the idea specifically, more just against the notion that it's pathetic to spend a few hours of policing somewhere instead of spending millions of hours elsewhere. The principle just seemed off.
>> No. 34378 Anonymous
30th June 2021
Wednesday 8:07 pm
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>>34373
>>34374
I don't think you quite realise the image perception that the police doing nothing would have. Both for the vast majority of the public who saw the story and need to believe the police have everything under control, and for the random nutters who might become aware that the police are actually rather incapable of catching petty crooks. The fact that in the video he is literally across the road from the backgate to No10 and in particular the Treasury is also something when it was only last week the police looked like twats for not defending that reporter.

Yes 'they should catch the REAL criminals innit' but the police operate for social control rather than your justice fantasies.
>> No. 34384 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 1:25 am
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He said he had been drinking prior to accosting Prof Whitty, and was taking part in an anti-vax march at the time.

So one of them was an Estate Agent, who has just been fired. Fucking bellend.
>> No. 34385 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 5:07 am
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>>34384
It's even better when you read what he told The Sun about it.

>“I absolutely apologise for any upset I caused. If I made him feel uncomfortable, which it does look like I did, then I am sorry to him for that. He is quite a timid, shy person and I think that is why he didn’t say, ‘Get off me’. If he had said that and I had realised how he felt, I wouldn’t have put my arm round him.

>To be honest I just wanted a selfie with Chris Whitty to show my mum. There was no malicious intent, I didn’t want to upset him. I put my arm around him but he started moving away so my arm ended up going around his neck more.

>I feel very let down by Boris, for him to call me a thug. I actually voted for him as well. I have worked every day of my life since I left college, I have never been in any trouble. Now I have to start from the beginning again and I loved my job.”

Some of the anti-lockdown protestors at the weekend demonstrated outside of Whitty's house, chanting the usual shit, like traitor, murderer and that he should be locked up.
>> No. 34387 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 9:43 am
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>>34378
Oh aye, they're actually doing perception management that makes them look good, it's just that our perception of them that sees them looking bad is wrong.
Like this, they do things like this so they look good publicly:
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/police-breached-fundamental-rights-at-sarah-everard-vigil-and-bristol-protests-inquiry-finds

I do understand what you're saying but it's not as though we're the only ones who'll view it this way, them failing to actually uphold the law makes them look weaker than their performative actions can disguise. Our position is not particularly unique or privileged, acting like it is is just britfa exceptionalism.
>> No. 34388 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 11:58 am
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>>34384
>an Estate Agent

Absolutely despicable. I'd ask that he be deported to the colonies but I'm sure he would thrive in our tax avoidance industry.

>>34387
I've pointed out why police actions are influenced by outside factors and in this case in particular there's a moral outrage dimension that drives much of our criminal law. Even I, from my august position on the .gs tizer tower, think he should be prosecuted but borderline tolerate corruption being that it's normalised and something the police would struggle to crack by design. Who would you even vote for to fix that, the Lib Dems?

>Like this, they do things like this so they look good publicly:

To be honest, outside of some left-wing wrong'uns does anyone still give a fuck about this? One of them is just some generic story about Covid restrictions v. the mass outpouring of emotion from a white women being murdered.
>> No. 34389 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 1:34 pm
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Little shits.

https://twitter.com/i/events/1410549368478896128
>> No. 34390 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 1:43 pm
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>>34389
Surely if your child came up to you with a positive test you will make them repeat it in front of you, just on the off chance you won't have to deal with them?

Works with beer and cider as well for those resting actors amongst us.
>> No. 34391 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 1:45 pm
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>>34389
Should this be raising concerns about how falable these tests are? Or am I being daft?
>> No. 34392 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 1:51 pm
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>>34391
Unless you're made of lemonade I think you will be fine.
>> No. 34393 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 1:53 pm
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>>34392
Shit, you've got me.
>> No. 34394 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 2:09 pm
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Lads are these the covid symptoms? I've had a sore/bunged up throat for a few days now. A mild dry cough. My taste is fine and I don't have a fever. Day 2 of symptoms.
>> No. 34395 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 2:12 pm
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>>34394
I have had very bad conjunctivitis / red scratchy eyes the past couple of days - has now moved to a head cold in my ears. No cough, but for 4% of people getting covid, red eyes is all you get. Feels like a really bad head cold now. Have booked a test. Also, double jabbed.
>> No. 34396 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 3:18 pm
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>>34394
>>34395
Reported symptoms for Delta are different - you'll have to look into it.
https://theconversation.com/the-symptoms-of-the-delta-variant-appear-to-differ-from-traditional-covid-symptoms-heres-what-to-look-out-for-163487
>> No. 34397 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 3:25 pm
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>>34396
>Delta
Honestly, if I'm not allowed to call it the Indian chinky sniffles, I'm having second thoughts about whether I want to catch it at all.
>> No. 34399 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 3:29 pm
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>>34397
I thought Kung Flu was hilarious when I first heard it, and then Trump said it so it was immediately a Terrible Racism, which was a shame.
>> No. 34400 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 3:37 pm
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>>34397
I think it fitting that they named it after a union busting airline in the US. Being laid off from covid, I'm sure they now have time to enjoy their consoles.
>> No. 34401 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 5:04 pm
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>>34400

Could just be Baader–Meinhof but I'm sure I've seen Corona beer being mentioned and bought more often since it started.
>> No. 34402 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 5:46 pm
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2VF5l9Lo8Lg
>> No. 34403 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 5:51 pm
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>>34402
I would run over Boris Johnson's head with a steam tractor and not so much as wince as his skull popped. However, I will never, ever, ever choose to watch a video uploaded by someone with a cartoon Robespierre avatar.
>> No. 34404 Anonymous
1st July 2021
Thursday 5:58 pm
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>>34399
It's a great pun, but sadly tarred when it got taken up by That Lot.

>>34400
And I can never get over that image, it's so lazy and condescending that it would barely constitute plausible satire. Maybe in the background of a Paul Verhoeven flick.
>> No. 34415 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 1:59 am
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https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/07/03/bullish-boris-johnson-axe-face-mask-laws-nhs-no-longer-risk/

>Prime Minister will say, with public urged to use ‘personal responsibility’

Well we're fucked then. What an absolute fucking bellend. Increase in cases on the way, wouldn't be surprised if we got another lockdown in September. As usual don't listen to the government on this, the medical advice as it stands is to continue wearing masks, distancing etc, even if you are vaccinated.
>> No. 34416 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 2:54 am
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>>34415

>Increase in cases on the way, wouldn't be surprised if we got another lockdown in September

I'm fucking bored of this, I think I might just kill myself now to save the bother.
>> No. 34417 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 4:23 am
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>>34415
>Chief medical officer Chris Whitty and chief scientific adviser Sir Patrick Vallance are now pushing "to get as much open this summer as possible before winter which will be much more difficult", reports the newspaper.
https://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/mandatory-face-mask-rule-england-20947950

We had it all a few days back already. I'm guessing it will be a summer of fun to keep the nightclubs afloat and the population compliant and to celebrate it coming homei.e. to Madrid. We'll 'local' lockdown again as the winter crisis hits the NHS before a short opening up on Christmas followed by another lockdown January-March and so on with odd lockdowns on a traffic light system whenever cases threaten to overload the NHS.

The plan was always to arrive at herd immunity and we'll never be rid of Covid now. We've got jabs to make infections not-murder so now we'll all repeatedly catch it along with updated vaccines until it becomes on-par with other forms of flu. Returning to offices should speed things along. Of course a highly-virulent flu is still shit but we'll have a few years to get used to it and the economy will hopefully stay afloat as we make austerity look like magic money Endor.
>> No. 34418 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 4:40 am
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>>34417
Unfortunatey it's pretty much agreed that herd immunity is a pipe dream at this point. There have been a couple recent studies that conclude reinfections will be normal and vaccines will require multiple variant profiles to be effective. It seems there is evidence of this mounting already, especially with another recent finding that these variants appear to be drifting further apart antigenically. As well, the problem is it's a dangerous time to loosen restrictions: https://www.republicworld.com/world-news/global-event-news/world-in-dangerous-period-of-covid-pandemic-delta-variant-is-continuing-to-mutate-who.html

>"The Delta variant is dangerous and is continuing to evolve and mutate, which requires constant evaluation and careful adjustment of the public health response. Compounded by more transmissible variants, like Delta, which is quickly becoming the dominant strain in many countries, we are in a very dangerous period of this pandemic.”

Making it easier to spread will help in no way shape or form as current data on the delta variant is suggesting higher viral load and longer duration of infectiousness, which is likely why it's already spreading so quickly. It could be likely that variants will outpace vaccines.
>> No. 34419 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 5:13 am
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>>34418

Nobody will ever admit it, but the truth is it really would have been better to let this thing run it's course. Variants like this wouldn't have developed without selective pressure to do so.

There are parallels here to anti-microbial resistance. Our interference in nature only shows our inability to truly enact lasting impact on it. This virus is a lesson in humility humans are stubbornly refusing to learn.

If it wipes us out, we deserved it. I don't care how edgy that statement is. We just never learn.
>> No. 34420 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 8:38 am
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>>34419

Not meaning to cause any offence here, but I think you've got this backwards. Unless I've misunderstood you...

Selective pressure is a factor in how pathogens develop, but the more important question for virsuses are antigenic drifts and antigenic shifts. Antigenic drift is the result of "copying errors" made over time, resulting in antigens showing up in different places. Antigenic shift is a more dramatic change, usually the result of zoonosis or recombination/reassortment of RNA when two strains of a virus meet in the same cell.

How many new variants of a virus appear depends, then, on whether the virus is prolific enough for RNA recombination/reassortment or zoonosis to occur, meaning we almost certainly would have seen more variants appear had we done nothing and allowed for faster spread of the virus with greater peaks of infection.

Probably the best evidence for this that I can think of is by comparison with influenza. COVID-19 has one long bit of RNA, which makes it less likely to recombine to create new variants than influenza. Influenza is made up of several bits of RNA and can reassort them when they meet in new cells, a much faster mechanism for change. Despite this faster mechanism though, human intervention (especially in the form of self-isolation and good hygiene) massively reduced the activity of influenza during the last leason, with some even speculating that several flu subtypes died off completely in some regions: https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6937a6.htm , https://www.statnews.com/2021/06/02/pandemic-upside-flu-virus-became-less-diverse-simplifying-task-of-making-flu-shots/

AMR is a very different beast in this context. Antibacterial resistance and antiviral resistance typically arise by quite different means; viruses do it by rapidly changing and making previous interventions useless, but bacteria do it by being absolutely ubiquitous. They're one of the building blocks towards larger organisms like ourselves, and typically exist in a kind of balance with eachother. Your skin is covered with bacteria that would be harmful, were it not already checked and kept in line by multiple other varieties of bacteria coexisting with it. Because of this built-in prevalence, the blunt tool of antibacterials work much more rapidly than any "natural" mechanism for change. The big hole that we leave with antibacterials, a resistant bacteria will fill because it's no longer competing with loads of other bacteria.

All the above being said, one thing I'd probably agree with you on is that we absolutely should not be banking on vaccination as the ultimate solution. As a public health wonk, I think it's already clear in countries that quickly had the virus under control that preventive measures are (were) far more effective. It's also worth noting that people have been writing about the possible dangers of novel coronaviruses since at least the 1990s. So much could have been done to prepare as it was a known threat.

A final note, this might sound like a copout but I also think there's a good case to be made that human life, by virtue of agriculture, urbanisation, settlement, travel, and so on, inescapably invites greater numbers of pathogens. Animals get sick too, of course, but no other creature domesticates and consumes as many varieties of animal as we do. Tuberculosis has been with us for as long as we've had draft animals plowing fields. Efforts to control infectious disease comes with the territory of being human. I also think it's a dangerous misconception that nature is in balance and harmony if only if it weren't for human intervention - we can certainly make things worse (e.g. anthropogenic climate change) or better (e.g. encouraging working ecological systems), but nature can be pretty tumultuous all on its own.
>> No. 34421 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 9:16 am
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>>34419
> Nobody will ever admit it, but the truth is it really would have been better to let this thing run it's course.
I'd admit it.
>> No. 34422 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 10:02 am
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>>34420

I wasn;t saying it's the same thing or the same mechanism, I just said there are parallels. It's a similar situation in that our attempts to outwit nature will only lead us to a steeper, harsher fall in the end.
>> No. 34423 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 10:13 am
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>>34422

Fair enough, but it's a difficult line to draw, and should probably be taken issue by issue. As I mention, agriculture is an insult to many ecological systems, and not even large scale industrial agriculture. Our greater interaction with animals (and eachother) creates far more opportunity for exposure to pathogens than other large organisms. If we didn't attempt to "outwit" nature in this case, it would leave us very vulnerable to disease unless we radically changed our means of living (e.g. massively reducing population concentration of major cities, perhaps having no cities at all).
>> No. 34424 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 10:53 am
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>>34419
>it really would have been better to let this thing run it's course. Variants like this wouldn't have developed without selective pressure to do so.
I'm putting this a lot less eloquently than >>34420 did, but this is utter bullshit.

All the main variants have emerged in countries where the virus was running rampant. NOT in countries where it was supressed by effective early lockdowns.
The only variant that has emerged since the vaccine programs have started is the Delta variant, and even that first appeared when only a tiny fraction of the population in India had received any vaccine doses at all.

What we have done to encourage variants to emerge is artificially keeping patients alive for months with ongoing infections and in some cases treating them with cocktails of antivirals and natural and synthetic antibodies, but that's a completely different argument.
>> No. 34425 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 10:57 am
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>>34424

They seem to have how evolution works backwards, that it pro-actively evolves to get around barriers it somehow knows about instead of random mutations which obviously happen more often when there are more instances to mutate.
>> No. 34426 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 12:38 pm
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>>34424

We've done both the bad parts of what you said. The countries where it was suppressed (presumably because the people in charge had played Pague Inc at least once in their lives) are the exceptions- You can count them all on one hand.

This is a global pandemic, the individual countries and the who done what ceases to matter.

>>34425

That's exactly how evolution works. What you appear to be confused about is that it needs something to "know" there's an obstacle. It doesn't, it's just that the thing that happens to get around the obstacle becomes the more prevalent. This is called selective pressure. If the obstacle hadn't been there it wouldn't have an advantage.
>> No. 34427 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 12:42 pm
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>>34423

>If we didn't attempt to "outwit" nature in this case, it would leave us very vulnerable to disease unless we radically changed our means of living (e.g. massively reducing population concentration of major cities, perhaps having no cities at all).

Yes.
>> No. 34428 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 12:45 pm
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>>34418
>Unfortunatey it's pretty much agreed that herd immunity is a pipe dream at this point.

Why are you talking about herd immunity. You're still playing the 'but what if it simultaneously evolves to beat the vaccines and stays dangerous' card because you don't understand evolution. We know this will happen because it's what has happened with it's cousins and is now happening with Covid itself. You're going to get covid, I'm going to get covid and we're going to get it multiple times but it won't kill it us because of the vaccines and gradually having infections build natural immunity.

That's not to say that herd immunity doesn't exist, it evidently does and we're seeing the effects of it right now.

>>34419
There's absolutely no fucking way Covid wipes us out you silly goose. This is about avoiding massive amounts of deaths from the breakdown of the NHS.
>> No. 34429 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 12:51 pm
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>>34422
>It's a similar situation in that our attempts to outwit nature will only lead us to a steeper, harsher fall in the end.

That's wrong though, smallpox didn't wipe humanity out and Malthus was wrong. In fact it's pretty self-evident that civilisation has been a good thing in terms of human population and our ability to actually survive into the far future.

Only way you could possibly think otherwise is if you've been huffing too much of XR's hot-air.
>> No. 34430 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 1:02 pm
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>>34429

It's a good thing your attitude is the majority, really. It only means this dead end of a species will die out sooner and something else can take our place.
>> No. 34431 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 1:21 pm
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>>34429

XR's quite heavily against the overpopulation argument, maybe stop huffing your own hot air?
>> No. 34432 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 1:32 pm
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>>34430

>> No. 34433 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 4:05 pm
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>>34432


>> No. 34434 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 7:06 pm
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>>34428
>Why are you talking about herd immunity.

Maybe because the person I was replying to was talking about it? A lot of the data is suggesting we are currently moving away from the idea of herd immunity, that's all. Israel for example got 50% vaccinated and still isn't hitting their herd immunity threshhold which is estimated to happen only with high vaccination rates. It is looking more unlikely now because of overall low vaccination rates, new variants and the lack of vaccinations for children who are now making up at least 24% of new cases. For example in the states if most under 18's can't/don't get vaccinated, 100% of over 18's would have to be vaccinated to reach 76% immunity in the population. This will of course vary from place to place as transmission intensity varies between countries and is affected by factors such as public health interventions and virus variants. There is some data suggesting that 1.8x more subjects might need to be vaccinated to prevent one more case of COVID-19 than predicted also. A lot of this is still guess work as more and more data comes available. We are basically in a race with variants and hamstringing ourselves by removing restrictions. Long covid is also a big issue still.
>> No. 34435 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 7:53 pm
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>>34428
>gradually having infections build natural immunity.

The problem with covid is in building lasting immunity. What we know so far about covid and delta suggests that any gained immunity wanes over time. There's also the issue that you can still catch it after having both vaccine doses and even if you've had covid before, and the long term health effects from catching covid which are still not completely known, but have shown to be quite harsh in some people.

>>34418
>>34428
>>34434

On the topic of herd immunity, short version is it's unlikely because the R0 is too high, vaccines aren't effective enough; not enough uptake of vaccines; ongoing variants making vaccines less effective, etc.

With the OG covid 19 and a 95-99% effective vaccine, it was estimated a region would need 70-90% of it's populations vaccinated to hope to reach herd immunity. We now have variants with much higher infectivity which increase the needed vaccine penetration in order to reach the herd immunity threshold. Additionally, the new variants are also reducing the effectivity of current vaccines, and most places are struggling to hit the desired 70% in vaccination numbers. It seems the best we can hope for at the moment is localised herd immunity in communities.

Since Israel was mentioned, you might find this interesting: https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/covid-in-israel-number-of-serious-cases-surges-as-delta-variant-advances-1.9967203

>The average number of new daily COVID infections in Israel has also risen by more than 50 percent since last week ■ Fourteen of the 35 cases defined as serious have received two doses of the Pfizer vaccine

>Last week, the ministry said that the country will soon face 600 new coronavirus cases a day, and that this figure is expected to rise to 1000 in 10 days as the delta variant continues to spread across the country.
>> No. 34436 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 10:05 pm
34436 spacer
m8 who I saw on Friday's just had a +ve lateral flow.

I'm praying to the pfizer gods now (and hoping that he wasn't infectious then). Jesus.
>> No. 34437 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 10:23 pm
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>>34434
>Maybe because the person I was replying to was talking about it?

Stop trying to gaslight me about my own posts. I explicitly stated we will never be rid of Covid now.

>A lot of the data is suggesting we are currently moving away from the idea of herd immunity, that's all

Vaccination rates are inexorably increasing, we're not giving the vaccines to under 18s at the moment because they're unlikely to be in danger of hospitalisation. This need to go to hospital being what is being targeted and where there has been a marked impact.
>> No. 34438 Anonymous
4th July 2021
Sunday 10:51 pm
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>>34437
>Stop trying to gaslight me about my own posts.

How on Earth is that gaslighting, mate?
>> No. 34439 Anonymous
5th July 2021
Monday 7:35 am
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>>34438
There's one of the posters here, apparently a mod, who is really thick when it comes to understanding how a conversation works because they struggle with grasping the notion that people will expand upon topics raised in posts they're responding to.
>> No. 34440 Anonymous
5th July 2021
Monday 8:46 am
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>>34439
Not as thick as the user who's constantly rude about the mods then acts surprised and offended when he gets banned.
>> No. 34441 Anonymous
5th July 2021
Monday 10:15 am
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>>34440
We don't ban people who insult us if they do it polysyllabically enough.
>> No. 34442 Anonymous
5th July 2021
Monday 12:45 pm
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>>34441
Away, you starvelling, you elf-skin, you dried neat’s-tongue, bull’s-pizzle, you stock-fish!
>> No. 34444 Anonymous
5th July 2021
Monday 3:38 pm
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>>34441

Mods are villainous plods.
>> No. 34465 Anonymous
7th July 2021
Wednesday 7:24 pm
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The fuck is going on here?

If they're going to pay bots to shill do they have to make it so blatantly obvious so that all the frothy mouthed anti-vaxxers have ammunition?

Or is this in fact an elaborate false flag by the anti-vaxxer anti-lockdown etc lot to make the other side look like propaganda?

I don't know anymore.
>> No. 34466 Anonymous
7th July 2021
Wednesday 7:44 pm
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>>34465
It may be a double false flag of pro-lockdowns pretending to be anti-lockdowns pretending to be pro-lockdown propaganda.
>> No. 34467 Anonymous
7th July 2021
Wednesday 7:52 pm
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>>34465
I think it's probably not a false flag, just they know most people won't be aware of it no matter how obvious it seems to the terminally online.
>> No. 34468 Anonymous
7th July 2021
Wednesday 9:23 pm
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>>34465
My brother has just tested positive for covid. The delta variant. He has been double jabbed. How on earth can Johnson go ahead with relaxing the rules on the 19th July. It's madness.
>> No. 34469 Anonymous
7th July 2021
Wednesday 9:31 pm
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>>34467

I'm not even terminally online, I just scroll through rudgwicksteamshow.co.uk on my fag breaks. It's not hard to run across stuff like this.

I think we mistakenly put too much stock in the terminally online vs normal people distinction, but the truth is perfectly normal people are terminally online nowadays.
>> No. 34470 Anonymous
7th July 2021
Wednesday 10:16 pm
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>>34469
No the problem is that the perfectly normal people are online long enough to read that one or two posts that's at the top of their feed, post and angry comment, and then read nothing else.
This sort of astroturfing/shill posting really works at shifting public opinion if it's targeted right.
>> No. 34471 Anonymous
8th July 2021
Thursday 10:39 am
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>> No. 34472 Anonymous
8th July 2021
Thursday 10:47 am
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>>34471
What did they predict in December that the spike in January would be?
>> No. 34473 Anonymous
8th July 2021
Thursday 11:11 am
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>>34471
>70% a week
I don't understand.
>> No. 34474 Anonymous
8th July 2021
Thursday 11:34 am
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>>34471

The important thing is if that translates into deaths. The government is taking a big gamble here make no mistake, and it would do no harm to keep things like mandatory mask wearing on public transport etc.

On the other hand though, to be totally fair the lockdown earlier this year and the easing of restrictions since have been almost entirely symbolic. To the best of what I can see people have largely become so used to the situation that everything is more or less going on as normal already, and has been for some time; so we should already be fucked by now if the vaccine wasn't working.
>> No. 34475 Anonymous
8th July 2021
Thursday 11:35 am
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>>34473
The video is from 2nd July. There's probably some delay in the testing and reporting process that skews lower the current week's numbers.
>> No. 34483 Anonymous
8th July 2021
Thursday 8:42 pm
34483 spacer
I'd be interested in seeing the age breakdown of current and past test results. I'd expect a big proportion of the current rise in cases being in schoolkids who by and large weren't getting tested in the past waves.
>> No. 34487 Anonymous
8th July 2021
Thursday 9:19 pm
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https://graphics.reuters.com/world-coronavirus-tracker-and-maps/regions/europe/

It's all getting a bit shit again.
>> No. 34488 Anonymous
8th July 2021
Thursday 9:31 pm
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>>34474
If we're in an exponential phase, it'll almost certainly translate into deaths. If we're now 90% less likely to die, that just means that we'll be waiting a few more days before the bodies hit the floor.
>> No. 34556 Anonymous
12th July 2021
Monday 4:11 pm
34556 spacer
May the odds be forever in your favour lads.
>> No. 34568 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 9:56 am
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So if I enter a shop on Monday and some officious man / woman insists I wear a mask, am I obliged to do so?
>> No. 34569 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 10:41 am
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>>34568
Shops can refuse you entry for any non-protected characteristic reason, can't they?
No mask, no entry seems quite likely. You may be able to argue that your disability makes you exempt. Have fun
>> No. 34570 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 10:44 am
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>>34568

You're not committing an offence by doing so, but they are within their rights to kick you out. It's not a legal requirement to wear shoes and a shirt, but you'll probably be asked to leave if you go shopping in only your boxer shorts.
>> No. 34571 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 10:47 am
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>>34568
Well you're not obliged currently, so probably not.
>> No. 34574 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 1:35 pm
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>>34569
There's no disability that makes it impossible to wear a mask for short periods of time, at least none that mean you'd be out of the house walking about like normal, but we all know this by now.

Keep wearing your masks, lads. Governmental advice is not health advice and it is still strongly recommended you keep wearing masks, especially if you haven't been double jabbed yet and also if you live with/are in contact with somebody vulnerable.
>> No. 34575 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 2:01 pm
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>>34568
Which shop are you talking about, exactly? No-one's been strictly enforcing masks anyway since it was generally accepted there are exemptions. Why would they suddenly start questioning people at the door?
>> No. 34576 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 2:16 pm
34576 spacer
>>34574

COPD.
>> No. 34577 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 2:22 pm
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>>34568
You are obligated by the rules of gentlemanly conduct. Anyone seen breaking the old rules shall be subject to nothing less than tuts and be regarded as a tramp by all who they encounter. I mean, if you're going to spread covid at least do it properly with rampant shagging.

>>34574
>There's no disability that makes it impossible to wear a mask for short periods of time

PTSD - I feel like we went through this last year. I fully believe that most of the people who aren't wearing the masks are chancers of course but I hate this kind of attitude as it plays into anti-masker delusions.
>> No. 34578 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 2:25 pm
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>>34576
Masks are fine to wear for short periods even with a lung disease. If your lungs are that weak and/or you do have a serious disease that you can't manage wearing a mask for a short period of time in a shop, you shouldn't really be out and about in crowds and the like, you should be shielding because the risk of death from covid is far far higher in that instance.
>> No. 34579 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 2:38 pm
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>>34577
>PTSD - I feel like we went through this last year. I fully believe that most of the people who aren't wearing the masks are chancers of course but I hate this kind of attitude as it plays into anti-masker delusions.

It's a bit shocking how this is just a repeat of the last year and a lot of people don't appear to have learned anything. It's bizarre logic too about the masks, to say you don't need to wear a mask because you have a serious condition, but then you're going out in a pandemic without a mask in a weakened state which puts you at an even greater risk. Oh well, won't be too long until restrictions are reintroduced anyway.
>> No. 34580 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 3:11 pm
34580 spacer
I will take my mask with me, but not put it on unless someone asks. I've been vaccinated, and so have like 86% of other people. I'm not letting the anti-vaxxers stop the world from seeing my beautiful smile. If peer pressure gets in the way, then so be it and I will sheepishly resume the old face covering fashion, but so many people are using anxiety as an excuse that they need a brave leader like me.
>> No. 34581 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 3:20 pm
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>>34580
>and so have like 86% of other people

It's more like 50%. Keep wearing your masks, chaps.
>> No. 34582 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 3:29 pm
34582 spacer
>>34581
For a bonus, look for the numbers from about 3-4 weeks ago to find the number of people that are actually fully vaccinated - as in, both doses at full efficacy.
>> No. 34583 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 4:20 pm
34583 spacer
>>34582
And for those that aren't looking for reasons to remain alarmist over turbo flu, remember that it's believed 27.4% of the population has already been infected and therefore have natural immunity.
>> No. 34584 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 4:35 pm
34584 spacer
>>34583
>alarmist over turbo flu

Lad. When are you people going to stop with this utter, utter bollocks?

>it's believed 27.4% of the population has already been infected and therefore have natural immunity.

Further bollocks. It is currently believed that any immunity gained is waning, which has been covered in this thread before, as have all the other reasons as to why there is still a big need to be vigilant, such as variants and reduced vaccine efficacy.

Pack this "it's just a flu" shite in already, it's been over a year and it's just embarrassing now.
>> No. 34585 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 5:16 pm
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>>34583
You are the reason we're in a third wave. Kindly project yourself from the top of a convenient cliff.
>> No. 34586 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 5:20 pm
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>>34584
Have you told SAGE about these beliefs of yours? Because I'm only quoting them. Only 33% of the population remains susceptible, they say.
>> No. 34587 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 5:25 pm
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>>34585
I've had no contact with anyone since July of last year (admittedly not because I'm afraid of spreading turbo flu). I think it very likely you and the people you know who have been out working and socialising are more responsible. You should feel bad for making people die.
>> No. 34588 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 5:29 pm
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>>34586
>Only
You should be paying that word a living wage for all the work it's doing here.
>> No. 34589 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 5:43 pm
34589 spacer
>>34585
Don't be a braindead kneejerker like >>34023, save your venom for someone who might actually deserve it. Sage for pissing in the hyperbolic wind.
>> No. 34590 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 5:45 pm
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>>34586
This is where it gets a bit tricky as a lot of this is still guess work. We don't completely understand covid and its variants yet so we're having to operate on a best guess all the time, they even admit this in that report.

>Only 33% of the population remains susceptible

It's worth noting too that this is just regarding the Delta variant.

https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/uk/third-of-population-in-england-still-susceptible-to-delta-variant-40648569.html

>He said experts do not know about drops in immunity in any great detail and “any waning immunity” could alter the figures, pushing up cases.

>Prof Medley said he agrees that UK will always experience a wave of infection when it releases restrictions “because the vaccines are not perfect and we’re not vaccinating everybody, so there is room for another wave of infection”.

More data is coming out that suggests immunity is waning but we don't know to what degree, it's worth keeping in mind but we just don't know how it will affect things yet. We do know the immunity gained from catching covid, while good, is not perfect. You can still be able to catch it again even if you've recently had it, you can also be less immune to variants which are now on the rise and will most likely continue to rise, which can lead to newer variants still. The issue there is that over time this can reduce the efficacy of the current vaccines.

Basically it's just a terrible idea to get rid of all restrictions at this point, that's the message from the scientific and medical community at large, as it's what the data is telling us. At best this is a gamble and it's why we still need to be cautious, and why the world's watching us to see how we do.

We can look at another country to see how well they did when they got rid of restrictions though, having only roughly 50% of their population fully vaccinated like us:

https://bnonews.com/index.php/2021/07/coronavirus-cases-in-the-netherlands-surge-more-than-800-in-one-week/

>The Netherlands reported more than 10,000 new coronavirus cases on Saturday, an eightfold increase when compared to last week after most restrictions were lifted despite the rise of the fast-spreading Delta variant.

Pic related.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-57811538

>Dutch Prime Minister Mark Rutte has apologised for "an error of judgement" in scrapping most coronavirus restrictions in the country.

Sure, there is much less risk of death if you catch covid and have had both of your vaccinations, but that's "for now". This could still well overwhelm the NHS too. There's also the issue of long covid which hasn't had too much coverage, but is seemingly devastating to younger people. I'm seriously doubting under this governments plan of "living" with covid that there will be any kind of compensation for any younger members of our work force who end up with long covid symptoms.

Really we should be doing what Scotland are doing, reducing some restrictions while keeping others, like masks. Under our governments plan though it seems that society as a whole will be at the mercy of the least responsible, instead of us all being personally responsible for catching it. The government
has thrown its hands up and effectively said "I can't handle this anymore, it's on you now".

Funnily enough Boris is already saying "We must rule nothing out" about restrictions being reintroduced, which is a completely change from saying he wants all unlocking to be irreversible, so make of that what you will.
>> No. 34591 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 5:45 pm
34591 spacer
>>34586

In other words, only 20 odd million people.
>> No. 34592 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 5:51 pm
34592 spacer
Surely natural immunity is superior to vaccines because it confers immunity across a wide variety of antigens rather than the more selective vaccines?
>> No. 34593 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 6:02 pm
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>>34592

Sorry, mate, I wish that were the case. But saving everyone yet another long and rambly post about microbiology, it is very much possible to suffer from COVID-19 repeatedly, even though the body builds up some immunity.
>> No. 34594 Anonymous
13th July 2021
Tuesday 6:04 pm
34594 spacer
>>34593
I was under the impression that subsequent exposure to the virus after being infected, even variants, would result in a much milder experience or nothing at all?
>> No. 34599 Anonymous
14th July 2021
Wednesday 7:04 pm
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https://www.ft.com/content/897bb179-af82-47cf-ac25-69d60edaa0b8

>Much of his decision was forced by parliamentary arithmetic. A growing number of Tories argue that the need for masks has passed thanks to the vaccination programme. One backbencher, Miriam Cates, recently claimed (incorrectly) that there is no scientific consensus on masks. She won’t be wearing one because “freedom is very important”.

>A senior government minister confesses that Johnson’s hand was forced. “Colleagues have reached the end of their tether with restrictions. We couldn’t have got [continued restrictions] through on Tory votes and there’s no way we could have passed with Labour. It would have been the end of Boris, so he indulged his libertarian side,” they say.

Absolutely fucking disgusting. How many people have to die for this mans ego? And why is it conservatives around the world are becoming the party of giving up and science denial?

"Freedom is very important so I'm not wearing a mask" what is this American bollocks.
>> No. 34600 Anonymous
14th July 2021
Wednesday 7:14 pm
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>>34599
Doesn't seem like it is his fault really. It would appear he would lose if he went forward with extending the restrictions, so what do you expect him to do?
>> No. 34601 Anonymous
14th July 2021
Wednesday 7:20 pm
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>>34600

I don't know about "expect" but maybe he should have cultured an environment where they actually follow the science instead of one where his MPs follow his example of lying about it?
>> No. 34602 Anonymous
14th July 2021
Wednesday 7:22 pm
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>>34600
Ah yeah, not his fault at all he completely mishandled the pandemic and botched the response entirely is it? And not his fault at all he continues to do so, because staying in power means more to him than the peoples wellbeing. No blame on Boris ever, he's just a cheeky chap, got to love him!
>> No. 34603 Anonymous
14th July 2021
Wednesday 7:58 pm
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>>34601
>>34602
Boris Johnson isn't magical lads, he can't force the Conservative party - of which the libertarian wing is currently ascendant. If anything it's the opposite of ego, the mythical anti-ego in giving up. Your knee-jerk criticism should instead be that he hasn't had the ego to try and force it through in a confrontation with Parliament where even if he loses at least people will be well aware that the science says stay the fuck inside (alone).
>> No. 34604 Anonymous
14th July 2021
Wednesday 9:12 pm
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>>34603

The fundamental problem with Bozza is that he has a desperate lust for power, but doesn't actually want to use it. Throughout Brexit and the pandemic, he has consistently opted for the path of least resistance, punting difficult decisions down the road until external pressures force his hand.

That's a perfectly acceptable level of mediocrity and cowardice for a middle-manager at a shoe company, but it falls well below the standards we have a right to expect from the leader of our country.
>> No. 34605 Anonymous
14th July 2021
Wednesday 9:45 pm
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>>34604

To be fair though, I'll take the middle manager of a shoe company over the types of people who do have the vision and ambition to really use their power. The last few times we've had one of those, they have invariably been unspeakably evil, because out of the current crop of MPs, it's only the utter bastards who do have that determination.

I'm sure there are good people out there who would both be able to use power competently and lead the country morally, but when was the last time we had one? At the end of the day Boris has a fucked a lot up by being a bit of a dithering idiot, but I like him a lot better than Cameron, who would have fucked a lot more up by being a callous, cold hearted reptilian.
>> No. 34607 Anonymous
14th July 2021
Wednesday 10:24 pm
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>>34604
You mean like that time he tried to prorogue parliament against its will in order to force a No Deal Brexit and allegedly misled the Queen to make it happen. Or that time when he removed the whip from many longstanding members of his own party who voted against his Brexit deal. Or the time he demanded that Ministers fire their SpAds which then led to him effectively firing his own Chancellor when he refused.

Should I go on?
>> No. 34622 Anonymous
15th July 2021
Thursday 12:24 pm
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>>34607

He didn't do any of those things of his own volition, which is precisely my point. The shenanigans over Brexit were totally dictated by the ERG; the Treasury coup was entirely the work of Cummings. He puts on a good show at the dispatch box, but someone else is always grinding the organ.

He would rather lie to the queen than tell Steve Baker to fuck off. All the lies, all the betrayals, all the breaches of ancient convention, they're motivated purely by cowardice. It's precisely the same cowardice he has demonstrated time and time again in his personal life - he'll do or say anything to avoid responsibility, whether that's for 150,000 COVID deaths or an unspecified number of illegitimate children.
>> No. 34626 Anonymous
15th July 2021
Thursday 5:08 pm
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It's not looking good, is it lads?
Reckon we're heading for another lockdown?
>> No. 34627 Anonymous
15th July 2021
Thursday 5:26 pm
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>>34622
So for everything Boris does you're just going to claim it was someone else giving him a talking to. Should you instead be talking about PM Carrie and her failings then?

>>34626
>Reckon we're heading for another lockdown?

No, we should but now it's politically impossible. Best you can hope for is a local lockdown once local health services are overwhelmed. This summer's clubbing scene will be to die for:

>> No. 34630 Anonymous
15th July 2021
Thursday 7:41 pm
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>>34626
September unless our bluff works.
>> No. 34631 Anonymous
15th July 2021
Thursday 7:52 pm
34631 spacer
>>34626
> It's not looking good, is it lads?
What isn't?

Good news , seems train companies aren't mandating masks, except for TFL. I may start using the train again.
>> No. 34632 Anonymous
15th July 2021
Thursday 8:32 pm
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>Covid: More than 500,000 app pings in a single week

>Some 530,126 alerts telling people to self-isolate were sent in the week to 7 July, a 46% rise on the previous week. One union has warned factories are on the verge of shutting because of staff shortages, with Nissan and Rolls Royce the latest firms to raise concerns. Social distancing rules are being lifted in England on Monday, leading to concerns about a bigger rise in the number of alerts.

>Unite said hundreds of employees were off work at some sites, with the app causing "havoc" on production lines. Assistant general secretary Steve Turner said it was no exaggeration to say factories were on the verge of shutting and that at some sites hundreds of staff are off work. "It is clear that something has to be done in time for July 19, or else people will simply start deleting the app en masse to avoid isolation notices," he said. Tim Moran, who runs cold supply chain company Lineage Logistics, said he had more staff absent than at any point during the pandemic and it meant the firm couldn't meet the demand to deliver food to customers.

>Prof Lucy Easthope, who advises the government on disaster planning, said the issue of staff shortages because of the app hadn't come as a surprise. She told the PM programme: "We feared we would see in some workforces 80% absenteeism. There will come a point where we simply can't operate like that, particularly around things like food production." She said she knew of some companies advising people not to have the app, which she said was in its "death throes". "The app is not the way to do this now. It has always been that we should have had local contact tracing through public health and that now needs to be properly resourced."

>It has already been announced that from 16 August, people who have been fully vaccinated in England will no longer have to self-isolate after close contact with someone who tests positive. The BBC has been told the team behind the app has been asked to adjust the measurements that trigger the alerts so that fewer are sent out - although the time frame for the change is not yet known.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-57854999

Ah yes, employees made to stop seeing covid so they can keep factories fully staffed. App sensitivity being decreased because it's too effective. What could possibly go wrong?
>> No. 34633 Anonymous
15th July 2021
Thursday 8:56 pm
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>>34631
Is this just a display of wilful ignorance? Have you recently come out of a coma? How is this good news?
>> No. 34634 Anonymous
15th July 2021
Thursday 11:01 pm
34634 spacer
>>34633
> How is this good news?
Well I don't fancy sitting on a train for an hour with a mask on.
>> No. 34635 Anonymous
15th July 2021
Thursday 11:26 pm
34635 spacer
>>34632
I'm surprised people are still being told to self-isolate if they have coronavirus. The whole point of the impending Freedom Day is that we start ignoring it and getting on with our lives, and hoping only our enemies die from it while taking no further precautions to stop that. So why stay home to protect people? That will only obstruct the herd immunity that is clearly the new plan. And I'm sure we all agree which side the Conservative party would come down on if forced to choose between keeping the economy running and saving the lives of a few impoverished immigrants.

I'm not saying it's the right thing to do; I'm just saying that not doing it is logically inconsistent with everything else they're doing.
>> No. 34636 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 12:27 am
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>>34635

The Health Protection Regulations automatically expire on the 18th and extending them would require a vote in parliament. Boris knows that there are enough back-bench rebels to defeat such a vote and doesn't want to endure the humiliation of begging Labour for votes. He hasn't "given the go-ahead for Freedom Day", it just happens by default unless he does something difficult and unpleasant.

The government might actually believe it'll work, they might be hoping that if they say "personal responsibility" enough they'll be able to blame a fourth wave on the general public, but there's no actual rationale for the date.
>> No. 34640 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 9:00 am
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Covid hospital numbers could get scary - Prof Chris Whitty

The UK is "not out of the woods yet" and people should act with caution as Covid restrictions in England end on Monday, Prof Chris Whitty has said.

England's chief medical officer warned that Covid hospitalisations were doubling every three weeks and could hit "scary numbers" in future.

Prof Whitty said the pandemic still had a "long way to run in the UK".

He said: "I don't think we should underestimate the fact that we could get into trouble again surprisingly fast.

"I think saying the numbers in hospital are low now, that does not mean the numbers will be low in hospital in five, six, seven, eight weeks' time.

"They could actually be really quite serious."


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-57858864
>> No. 34645 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 12:09 pm
34645 spacer
>>34640
Isn't that the bloke who refused to take a selfie with some fans and kicked up a fuss about it afterwards? No wonder he's uptight and downbeat about the upcoming summer fun.
>> No. 34646 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 12:23 pm
34646 spacer
Planned to go to France for a weekend at the end of August.
Any continental lads here? What's the mood in France about our case rises - are they going to weld up the Eurotunnel?
>> No. 34647 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 1:03 pm
34647 spacer
>>34646
>Planned to go to France for a weekend at the end of August.
Well that was a silly idea, wasn't it?
>> No. 34648 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 1:07 pm
34648 spacer
>>34647
To be fair flights were booked in January 2020...
>> No. 34649 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 1:25 pm
34649 spacer
>>34646
My parents worked for the EU and live just outside Brussels. They come over to England every August for my dad's birthday. They're retired now, so they can come whenever they want. They haven't mentioned coming over to me at all so far, whereas in most years, they would. I've booked the week off work, and if they don't come, I'll just go somewhere on my own like Bradford or Preston because I've never been there, having grown up in Belgium myself. They might still come over; I don't know. Sorry this isn't more productive; I'll let you know if I hear from them in the near future and I remember.
>> No. 34650 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 1:33 pm
34650 spacer
>>34646
>>34649
They're both double-vaccinated and they came over last year, by the way, when restrictions were relaxed. My understanding is that this country is going to remove restrictions as an experiment, and other countries will watch us to see what happens. I think that's the case, but I might have read that here.
>> No. 34651 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 2:03 pm
34651 spacer
>>34649
> I'll just go somewhere on my own like Bradford or Preston
You're joking right? Please tell me you're joking.
>> No. 34652 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 2:05 pm
34652 spacer
>>34648
So you've had 18 months to cancel them.
>> No. 34653 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 2:30 pm
34653 spacer

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346533465334653
So when will we be hitting our next lockdown, any guesses?
>> No. 34654 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 3:20 pm
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346543465434654
>Winter vomiting virus warning for England
>Unlike for Covid, alcohol gels do not kill off norovirus
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-57865112

"It's just a light bit of 'rona" Norah said to herself as she boarded the crowded tube carriage in the summer heatwave "I've been jabbed so it will be fine".
>> No. 34655 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 3:48 pm
34655 spacer
>>34653
Simple Politics for Simpletons
>> No. 34656 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 3:52 pm
34656 spacer
>>34649
Both really shit. Firstly, don't go anywhere alone because it's boring. Find a group to join and do a hike in the Lakes, the Peaks or the Yorkshire Dales. Assuming you're somewhere in the North West.
>> No. 34657 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 3:55 pm
34657 spacer
>>34655
Care to enlighten us?
>> No. 34661 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 7:23 pm
34661 spacer
>>34651
I am considering genuinely doing it, for a joke. I have always been very insistent that trains should be nationalised, and when Northern Rail was renationalised, I thought I should reward them for it by buying some train tickets. It's been a year and a half and I still haven't done it, of course, but that's because I am an exceptionally dull person with a Zen-like reluctance to ever do anything.

>>34656
My autistic-stereotype friend group love travelling alone, and they claim to meet people and make new friends whenever they do it. I admit that I don't believe them at all, plus they're mostly female so maybe it's just a different dynamic and people are more willing to approach them, but I'll never know for sure unless I try it. I might even be able to get one of them to come along, although I massively doubt it.
>> No. 34662 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 8:17 pm
34662 spacer
>>34661
>mostly female
You've solved the mystery
>> No. 34663 Anonymous
16th July 2021
Friday 11:00 pm
34663 spacer
>>34661
One time I was four beers in on the train, and passed a note to a girl behind me asking if she wanted to chat. For some reason she said yes, and we just talked for a half hour. I asked for her number when I was getting off but she had a boyfriend, so only a dozen people heard that. Nice encounter overall. Couldn't manage it again.
>> No. 34667 Anonymous
17th July 2021
Saturday 1:36 am
34667 spacer
>>34661

Get a Rover ticket and go on a heritage crawl.

https://www.yorkshire.com/view/culture/wakefield/national-coal-mining-museum-for-england-125738
https://www.yorkshire.com/view/culture/malton/eden-camp-modern-history-theme-museum-125359
https://www.yorkshire.com/view/attractions/sheffield/abbeydale-industrial-hamlet-593913
https://www.yorkshire.com/view/culture/sheffield/kelham-island-museum-125565
https://www.yorkshire.com/view/culture/sheffield/national-emergency-services-museum-125399
https://www.yorkshire.com/view/culture/york/allied-air-forces-memorial-and-yorkshire-air-museum-1095030
https://www.yorkshire.com/view/culture/york/national-railway-museum-125741
>> No. 34668 Anonymous
17th July 2021
Saturday 1:51 am
34668 spacer
>>34667
Alternatively, stay at home so you don't end up with Long Quadraspazzed On A Life Glug because of some antivax rona-minimalist idiots.

In all seriousness, that looks like a cracking idea for when the plague dies down a bit. Not him, but thanks lad.
>> No. 34674 Anonymous
17th July 2021
Saturday 6:45 pm
34674 spacer
ARE SAVID has the turbo lurgy!
>> No. 34675 Anonymous
17th July 2021
Saturday 8:08 pm
34675 spacer
>>34674
He'll be fine. His dad was a bus driver, remember, which makes him immune to absolutely everything. Shame it doesn't make actual bus drivers immune as well, but they should have worked harder and been MPs instead, which is a proper job.

I do not like Sajid Javid. I'm not saying I want him to die from it, because then we'll have to put up a statue of him and praise his brave sacrifice, but a couple of days in hospital would really add some much-needed excitement to the news.
>> No. 34678 Anonymous
18th July 2021
Sunday 9:51 am
34678 spacer
>Coronavirus patients who recovered from the virus were far less likely to become infected during the latest wave of the pandemic than people who were vaccinated against COVID, according to numbers presented to the Israeli Health Ministry.

https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/309762

For the lad here who won’t stfu about his previous vaccines.
>> No. 34679 Anonymous
18th July 2021
Sunday 10:00 am
34679 spacer
Did anyone seriously consider the optics of Boris and Rishi not isolating after being contacted by NHS track 'n' trace?
This is the closest to a 'let them eat cake' moment that I can remember in UK politics.
>> No. 34680 Anonymous
18th July 2021
Sunday 10:08 am
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flatten;crop;jpeg_quality=70.jpg
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>>34678

Looks like herd immunity's back on the menu, boys!
>> No. 34681 Anonymous
18th July 2021
Sunday 10:48 am
34681 spacer
>>34679

Optics don't matter when you have no opposition.
>> No. 34682 Anonymous
18th July 2021
Sunday 11:23 am
34682 spacer
>>34678
Lads:
>Study: Coffee offers protection against COVID-19
>A newly-published study has shown that drinking one cup of coffee per day may reduce a person's chance of contracting COVID-19, Israel Hayom reported.

>The study, which included 40,000 participants, was conducted last year by researchers at Illinois' Northwestern University and examined the participants' daily routines and eating habits. Though the study did not prove causation, those who drank one or more cups of coffee per day were 10% less likely to show symptoms of coronavirus than those who did not drink coffee daily. In addition, the more coffee a person drank each day, the lower his risk was. Coffee drinkers also have a reduced chance of suffering severe COVID-19, the study showed.
https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/309793

I looked it up and it's true. Seeming to suggest 2-3 cups is best.
https://www.mdpi.com/2072-6643/13/6/2114
>> No. 34683 Anonymous
18th July 2021
Sunday 11:33 am
34683 spacer
>>34682

And you ridiculed me for five to six. Well who's laughing now?
>> No. 34685 Anonymous
18th July 2021
Sunday 1:10 pm
34685 spacer
>>34683
Always bet on Big Toilet Paper, they can't lose.
>> No. 34690 Anonymous
18th July 2021
Sunday 2:51 pm
34690 spacer
>>34682
Coffee shirkers are just weak and sickly, prone to whatever ailments come around. They're morally suspect too.
Wonder what the real reason is?
>> No. 34691 Anonymous
18th July 2021
Sunday 2:53 pm
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4192EZFBKTL._SX404_BO1204203200_.jpg
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>>34685
>> No. 34693 Anonymous
18th July 2021
Sunday 5:42 pm
34693 spacer

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346933469334693
Got me second Pfizer in today lads. It's only been 5 weeks since my first, but I reckon that having more protection in the coming weeks is preferable to having a slightly higher protection long term.
>> No. 34694 Anonymous
18th July 2021
Sunday 9:07 pm
34694 spacer
>>34691
This is giving me a horrible flashback to when I was a infant using a potty in the bathroom and my dad came in and dropped a log in the shitter. I'm sure he got a chuckle out of his son wincing while unable to escape.

Also I'm pretty sure apples don't poo although that might just be the one's you find in a supermarket.

>>34693
I'm making the same gamble. Well, the rest of society made a decision and I'm just the one trying to live with it.
>> No. 34695 Anonymous
18th July 2021
Sunday 9:17 pm
34695 spacer
>>34694
It also seems that Pfizer is in short supply and will be until September at the earliest, so not a gamble I'm willing to take even given I did have an appointment for late Aug.
>> No. 34696 Anonymous
18th July 2021
Sunday 10:14 pm
34696 spacer
Had any of you boys ever heard of this "ignore the self-isolation warning as long as you get a negative test result every day" pilot scheme before a couple of days ago? Or was it really announced purely so Boris and Rishi didn't have to self-isolate?
>> No. 34697 Anonymous
18th July 2021
Sunday 10:30 pm
34697 spacer
>>34696
Home test said Covid so I signed up and got a confirmed Covid PCR test. I'd met two people in a pub just before the first positive test, I checked in with them and they were both fine with getting pinged. One of them was invited to a shorter lock down process via daily tests, the other signed up after finding out about it. As I understand it they had to stay indoors for fewer days (seven, I think, instead of the usual ten). II was tested positive and the chase up calls re-inforced the idea that staying indoors was mandatory for me, I have no idea how mandatory it was for my mates. That was a bit more than a month ago.

The Boris and Rishi thing in particular is nothing like that, they clearly don't give a fuck.
>> No. 34698 Anonymous
18th July 2021
Sunday 11:02 pm
34698 spacer
>>34696
Oh come on. Boris might tell lies sometimes but he's not Trump.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/government-to-launch-40000-person-daily-contact-testing-study
>> No. 34699 Anonymous
19th July 2021
Monday 12:13 am
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Lockdown has now ended, get ready to take off.
>> No. 34700 Anonymous
19th July 2021
Monday 12:17 am
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Glad that whole pandemic has finished now that the clocks have struck midnight (in England and Wales).
>> No. 34701 Anonymous
19th July 2021
Monday 12:30 am
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>>34699
Hold on, haven't booked my flights yet.
>> No. 34702 Anonymous
19th July 2021
Monday 1:02 am
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347023470234702

>> No. 34703 Anonymous
19th July 2021
Monday 1:04 am
34703 spacer
>>34702

HODL
>> No. 34706 Anonymous
19th July 2021
Monday 9:44 am
34706 spacer
I just completed my first shop in a major supermarket in the last year without wearing a mask.

AMA
>> No. 34707 Anonymous
19th July 2021
Monday 9:57 am
34707 spacer
>>34706

Do you take into account when you last had a poo or ate when you weigh yourself or not bother with that sort of detail?
>> No. 34708 Anonymous
19th July 2021
Monday 10:11 am
34708 spacer
>>34707

Do it in the morning right out of bed, ideally before you drink any water. You'll get heavier throughout the day as you hydrate and eat food, but at least you'll have a relatively consistent measure of your "dry"-ish weight, enough to spot a trend if you're aiming to gain or lose.
>> No. 34709 Anonymous
19th July 2021
Monday 11:39 am
34709 spacer
>>34706
Do you feel like a Hero yet?
>> No. 34710 Anonymous
19th July 2021
Monday 11:52 am
34710 spacer
>>34709
Yes, try it. Rise up and cast off the shackles of your respiratory oppressors.
>> No. 34711 Anonymous
19th July 2021
Monday 12:00 pm
34711 spacer
>>34706
Biscuit or cake?
>> No. 34715 Anonymous
19th July 2021
Monday 4:12 pm
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Capture.png
347153471534715
Stage 2 has been activated.
>> No. 34716 Anonymous
19th July 2021
Monday 5:25 pm
34716 spacer
>>34715
Click-driven non-news nonsense. Apart from continuing to not shit ourselves in public this won't effect us at all. However, it defintely appears frightening when you report it like some unknown new thing and overlay a giant cell over a flag and some masked plebs.
>> No. 34717 Anonymous
19th July 2021
Monday 5:48 pm
34717 spacer
>>34716
>Apart from continuing to not shit ourselves in public

I think you've misunderstood the symptoms of norovirus.

Come to think of it I was pissing out my arse at the weekend and went speed-dating. I suppose that was one way to get some ladies knickers down.
>> No. 34718 Anonymous
19th July 2021
Monday 6:12 pm
34718 spacer
>>34717
I thought Norovirus was a bowel buster? Whatever, it's still nothing. Even if it does become widespread, so to speak, it seems some of us can learn to live with anything.
>> No. 34719 Anonymous
19th July 2021
Monday 6:20 pm
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Freedom Day.

What can possibly go wrong.

https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/cases
>> No. 34724 Anonymous
20th July 2021
Tuesday 11:49 am
34724 spacer
Not shaved today so I'm still taking a mask to Asda.
>> No. 34725 Anonymous
20th July 2021
Tuesday 11:58 am
34725 spacer
>>34724
We're supposed to shave every day?
>> No. 34726 Anonymous
20th July 2021
Tuesday 1:00 pm
34726 spacer
Geuinely surprised lads, some faith in people as been restored as most are still wearing masks in the majority of places I've been to. Tesco's seem on it too. In fact the handful of businesses in the small town I'm in have all put things up in shops/online encouraging people to keep wearing masks because "We've come this far and need to keep looking out for eachother", while keeping hand sanitising stations and all. I guess localised herd immunity within communities is still on the cards.
>> No. 34727 Anonymous
20th July 2021
Tuesday 1:21 pm
34727 spacer
>>34726
My girlfriend popped to Sainsbo's on Monday and said most people were still wearing a mask; it was mainly young women without them.
>> No. 34728 Anonymous
20th July 2021
Tuesday 2:31 pm
34728 spacer
>>34727
>it was mainly young women without them

Now that you mention it, everyone I spotted last night without a mask at Sainsbury's was a young woman. Is it a lipstick thing?
>> No. 34730 Anonymous
20th July 2021
Tuesday 3:56 pm
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>>34726
I guess people actually enjoy being good little boys and girls.
>> No. 34731 Anonymous
20th July 2021
Tuesday 3:57 pm
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347313473134731

>> No. 34732 Anonymous
20th July 2021
Tuesday 4:03 pm
34732 spacer
>>34731
Everything he says is right apart from the “get covid and live longer” which doesn’t make any sense.

I’ve heard, anecdotally admittedly, of so many stories of dismissive doctors and nurses in the NHS. My mate owns a business and says he’s lost count at the number of women says they work for the NHS “so can I get some money off?”.

The NHS overwhelmed BS is a lie and an excuse for the politicised body as it is to buy more time / resources / cash (pay rises).
>> No. 34733 Anonymous
20th July 2021
Tuesday 4:05 pm
34733 spacer
>>34732

Could you repeat that? I can't hear you over all the videos of nurses dancing.
>> No. 34734 Anonymous
20th July 2021
Tuesday 4:18 pm
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>>34732
It was right a year ago, now not so much. As usual with Boris he can't think long term.
>> No. 34735 Anonymous
20th July 2021
Tuesday 6:12 pm
34735 spacer
The most egregious thing about the message is that when referring to an age bracket he's listed the numbers in descending order. Seriously, what kind of utterly depraved mind would do this?
>> No. 34737 Anonymous
20th July 2021
Tuesday 6:21 pm
34737 spacer
>>34736

No that can't be true because some women asked his mate for a discount. Can't you read?
>> No. 34738 Anonymous
20th July 2021
Tuesday 6:22 pm
34738 spacer
>>34736

>>34732

>The NHS overwhelmed BS is a lie
u wot m9?


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-57865958

Potentially life saving operations are being cancelled due to the increase in COVID cases. Now you may say that the NHS' problems has less to do with the pandemic and everything to do with over a decade of the politics of austerity, and you'd be correct. But this is a really weird take on the conversations being held by a PM whose callousness is rivaled only by his incompetence (and surpassed only by his abject corruption) at a time when literally dozens of people were dying.
>> No. 34739 Anonymous
20th July 2021
Tuesday 6:24 pm
34739 spacer
>>34732

>tell me you're a tory shitheel without telling me you're a tory shitheel

(A good day to you Sir!)
>> No. 34740 Anonymous
20th July 2021
Tuesday 6:33 pm
34740 spacer
>>34736
People look at the number of people in hospital and think "it's only a couple of thousands, that seems okay" without realising how many beds a hospital usually has. According to the BBC there are around 4000 people in hospital with the 'rona right now. That's more beds than the entirety of Northern Ireland. Queen Elizabeth Hospital Birmingham is one of the ten largest hospitals in the UK by bed count, and that case load would fill it more than three times over.

England has around one bed for every 500 people. Currently there are places that have more than one case for every 100 people. Thankfully, as more people are vaccinated, they're less likely to need hospitalisation, but right now unvaccinated people account for around 60% of hospitalisations and over 90% of deaths, while representing only around 20% of the population.
>> No. 34744 Anonymous
20th July 2021
Tuesday 9:20 pm
34744 spacer
>>34735
>when referring to an age bracket he's listed the numbers in descending order
Not in that picture he hasn't. The median age (for COVID-19 fatalities) is 82. It's a median age of 81 for men, and a median age of 85 for women. But I guess more men die, so the median age for everyone is 82. I know it looks like he mentions a group aged from 82 all the way down to 81, but that's because he's shit at grammar and has made it his life's mission to annoy me, personally, in every way he can manage.
>> No. 34745 Anonymous
20th July 2021
Tuesday 11:30 pm
34745 spacer
>>34740

I'm not sure what has gotten into BoJo that he's leading us head-on into an unmitigated unprecedented clusterfuck not just waiting to happen, but actually already happening.

He's going to run not only the NHS but the entire country completely into the ground.

And people still look at me funny when I say I voted Lib Dem (I've always hated Labour with passíon, but even as a traditional Tory voter couldn't bring myself to vote for a pound shop Donald Trump).
>> No. 34747 Anonymous
21st July 2021
Wednesday 12:06 am
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347473474734747
Saw this and thought of you. Should we send the unvaccinated to prison and bar them from access to children?

>>34745
I don't think we can put Johnson on the hook for all that's happening now. For some reason news stories are talking about a 'pingdemic', we have a minister going rogue by talking about choice, reports of companies actively sabotaging effort by telling staff to ignore the app, and ARE LASSES are breathing all over the supermarkets.
>> No. 34749 Anonymous
21st July 2021
Wednesday 12:19 am
34749 spacer
>>34747

>I don't think we can put Johnson on the hook for all that's happening now.

People being useless fucking cunts and a waste of air is no excuse for a lack of leadership.

Even a country full of useless fucking cunts can still be run in such a way that there's damage control.


I don't think there's a developed Western country on the planet that would let "Freedom Day" go forward as planned with 7-day case rates of more than 400. The Netherlands just closed all their clubs and bars again, and their case rates are similar to ours.

We're back at square one, it's almost as bad as in early January. There are still millions unvaccinated, and a significant portion of them run the risk of fucking dying. Especially once hospitals really become overcrowded again with critical patients.
>> No. 34751 Anonymous
21st July 2021
Wednesday 12:26 am
34751 spacer
>>34747

<referring to your picture

I don't know what these cunts are aon about because I've never installed no app or nothing, and suffered absolutely zero impediment to my daily life. Literally the only impact has been having to wear a mask in the supermarket and on the train.

I mean, I get where they are coming from but the fact is if there's an authoritarian clampdown conspiracy here, it's the shittest authoritarian clampdown in history by virtue of being completely optional.
>> No. 34752 Anonymous
21st July 2021
Wednesday 12:34 am
34752 spacer
>>34749

Are you including the US in that? They've basically been ploughing head regardless since about February. Apparently the force of socialist hero Saint Biden alone is enough to keep them safe. God alone knows how big the bucket of salt you have to take their data with is.

The fact is, if you wanted an answer to the question "how long does a global pandemic stay a worthy reason to disrupt the gobal neo-liberal economic system" you have your answer. Approximately 12-18 months. If you don't like it tough shit, should have voted for our side.
>> No. 34753 Anonymous
21st July 2021
Wednesday 1:39 am
34753 spacer
Even the tabloid newspapers are turning on Boris now. The "pingdemic" really is going to ruin everything for everyone, because the plan makes no sense. We're going full herd-immunity and just not calling it that, with everyone getting the Wuhan Cold until it's no longer deadly, but as soon as anyone who works in any gathering place gets the coof, all the staff have to immediately stay home for two weeks. So how is anywhere meant to stay open? It's completely impossible.
>> No. 34758 Anonymous
21st July 2021
Wednesday 3:15 pm
34758 spacer
Why is the local NHS Trust allowed to spam me daily - sometimes multiple times a day - advertising their vaccine? There's no opt out and I can't even blacklist their delivery service without also blocking other local government services. Leave me the fuck alone.
>> No. 34759 Anonymous
21st July 2021
Wednesday 4:30 pm
34759 spacer
>>34758
Because you're an evil anti-vaxxer killing grandmas left and right!.

They only text me once or twice a week.
>> No. 34760 Anonymous
21st July 2021
Wednesday 4:49 pm
34760 spacer
>>34759
>They only text me once or twice a week.

Coronavirus has been kind of good in a way. My brother-in-law is virtually unemployable but thanks to coronavirus he's got a job with the NHS calling people to ensure they haven't left home when they should be isolating. I think it's the first time he's been properly employed since he was kicked out of uni about eight years ago.
>> No. 34761 Anonymous
21st July 2021
Wednesday 7:22 pm
34761 spacer
>>34753
That's also a problem for the supply chain, not just restaurant managers.
https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/uk-food-supply-chains-edge-failing-meat-industry-says-2021-07-21/
>> No. 34762 Anonymous
21st July 2021
Wednesday 9:00 pm
34762 spacer
Anyone had experience getting their 2nd dose early?
Got my first through my GP about 5 weeks ago, they've not contacted me about my second appointment yet but at this point I've got no idea whether the official guidelines are still at 12 weeks or not.
>> No. 34763 Anonymous
21st July 2021
Wednesday 9:06 pm
34763 spacer
>>34762
I don't know about the official guidelines, but if they DO still say 12 weeks, then nobody is listening. I listened because I kept putting off the second dose, but they were pestering me after 9-10 weeks to go and get it.
>> No. 34764 Anonymous
21st July 2021
Wednesday 9:16 pm
34764 spacer
>>34762
I think they've changed it to 8 weeks. I had my first jab 26th May and the earliest I could originally book my second jab for was 12th August, but I cancelled that a couple of weeks ago and rescheduled it for tomorrow morning.
>> No. 34767 Anonymous
21st July 2021
Wednesday 10:24 pm
34767 spacer
>>34762
>>34763
>>34764
12 weeks is the latest it's recommended to leave it. If you can get it earlier, but no earlier than 4 weeks after your first dose, then it'll work out even better.
>> No. 34769 Anonymous
21st July 2021
Wednesday 10:52 pm
34769 spacer
Testing lad here. Everything's going properly tits up.

No staff, no supplies, half our equipment is knackered and we're waiting up to six weeks for an engineer. Not sure who to point the finger of blame at but it would appear to be an abdication of responsibility all the way to the top, as every stage of management shrugs and assumes it's the person above's problem. Nobody seems willing to admit this thing is here to stay, they're all acting like at some point in the near future it'll be back to normal and failing to grasp that this IS normal, for the next several years at least.

Might get sacked to shouting at the patient flow coordinator before the end of the night, but then again, I'm probably the most indispensable individual in the entire organisation right now. Wonder how much I can get away with. I can't be fucking arsed with this shitshow any more.

Sag for aimless rant.
>> No. 34773 Anonymous
22nd July 2021
Thursday 12:45 am
34773 spacer
>UK food supply chains ‘on the edge of failing', meat industry warns
https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/uk-food-supply-chains-edge-failing-meat-industry-says-2021-07-21/

I'm so tired of all this now. I hope we don't end up with selfish twats clearing everything off the shelves again.

>>34769
You just described every job in the country at the moment.
>> No. 34774 Anonymous
22nd July 2021
Thursday 12:50 am
34774 spacer
>>34769
I find it amazing that you actually care. I would tape up the smoke detectors, smoke in the lab, and put my feet on the table.
>> No. 34777 Anonymous
22nd July 2021
Thursday 2:17 am
34777 spacer
>>34773

True, apparently my missus' work have just made her boss redundant despite the fact he was the only one capable of authorising anything and half the team are so new they have no idea what they're doing. I think we might just be witnessing the very slow collapse of society.

>>34774

I'm on a very definite slow strike, the trouble is with healthcare work it's hard to totally fuck it off and justify it to yourself. You'd have to be very misanthropic at least, which I am, but I'd feel like a hypocrite if I indulged it.

I'm fairly sure I could spark up in the CL3 lab under the cabinet and nobody would be any the wiser, they're just big extractor fan hoods. But the smoke detectors don't pick up vapes anyway, I've already checked.
>> No. 34778 Anonymous
22nd July 2021
Thursday 4:42 pm
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GG Dawn Butler. Or F, I don't know.
>> No. 34779 Anonymous
22nd July 2021
Thursday 6:02 pm
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>>34778
During her intervention and then expulsion procedure it seemed like the acting Deputy Speaker attempted to identify Dawn Butler (or her constituency at least) but completely drew a blank.

I guess I don't blame her.
>> No. 34780 Anonymous
22nd July 2021
Thursday 6:05 pm
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>>34773
If they don't run with a headline like MEAT TAKES A BEATING I'll be very disappointed.
>> No. 34781 Anonymous
22nd July 2021
Thursday 6:08 pm
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>>34778

I had no idea who she was before this but fair play to her. From the article I just read, for anyone not keeping up:

>Dawn Butler was asked to leave the House of Commons for the remainder of the day after refusing to withdraw comments about the Prime Minister's handling of the Covid crisis.

>The Labour MP said Boris Johnson had "lied to the House and the country over and over again".

>Ms Butler, MP for Brent Central, was told to withdraw from the chamber by temporary deputy speaker Judith Cummins following her remarks in a Commons debate.

>It is considered not within the boundaries of parliamentary etiquette to call another member a liar.

I mean.

>It is considered not within the boundaries of parliamentary etiquette to call another member a liar.

Funny that. Probably about time we dispensed with that bit of "etiquette" honestly.
>> No. 34782 Anonymous
22nd July 2021
Thursday 6:24 pm
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>>34778
We mustn't allow these kinds of radical far-left infiltrators into the Labour Party, get her out!
>> No. 34783 Anonymous
22nd July 2021
Thursday 8:07 pm
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>>34781
Thank you very much. I assumed she had pulled a gun on Priti Patel or something like that from the way people were posting.

And the parliamentary rules are all crazy; I've noticed that MPs never address each other either and only ever talk to the Speaker, in addition to not being allowed to say each other's names, leading to all manner of complicated exchanges like, "Mr Speaker, could I please ask the honourable member for North Somerset why he's such a stupid gaylord?" and "Mr Speaker, surely the honourable member for Islington is aware that I am rubber and he is glue, and his words bounce off me and stick to him?"

They should have done all parliamentary debates on Twitter during the lockdowns so they could insult each other directly. Everyone knows that's what they want to do.
>> No. 34784 Anonymous
22nd July 2021
Thursday 10:47 pm