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|>>|| No. 4450
just wonder for how long someone can make things up in th record book? I mean sooner or later all things to do will run out?
especially living in the deprived location
|>>|| No. 4452
If I hear that fucking Vivaldi loop one more time
|>>|| No. 4453
Simply go back to the start of your book and say you handed another app in at x, reapplied at x, it worked for me for years.
However. Now they've given those new sheets out they seem to have REALLY cracked down on things, and I was sanctioned the other week for not writing down that i'd telephoned 3 employers a week as I had agreed to do in my Agreement, despite having done 15 other things and applied for 4 jobs.
|>>|| No. 4454
I was sanctioned because I'd only managed to crank out one application in a week. My excuse was that I was limiting myself to short-term, temporary work with a near-immediate start, and that they themselves had told me that phoning up and finding it wasn't appropriate didn't count as an application. The adviser said I hadn't been reasonable to restrict myself in this way, even though I had been offered a job and was waiting to start. (I'm now in that job.)
|>>|| No. 4455
been quite a time Im on JSA, Nobody seems to read my stuff. I think they all understand that its hard indeed to find a decent job anyway. Who wants minimum wage one? Or dead-end one? And you you can't get along with people?
Fuck, my self esteem was less working mini-wage then on benefits.
|>>|| No. 4457
What is this job program? I have been signing for nearly a year now and they keep talking about this. I have been sanctioned now though and risk losing 4 weeks money if they're not happy with the amount of applications I'm sending.
|>>|| No. 4460
Basicly you get put on a 2 years course with A4E, Ingeus or whichever provider serves your area. You have to go visit them about once a fortnight as well as signing on, filling your book in etc. With Ingeus, they keep wanting to send me on useless training courses that would basicly give me a certificate to say I can speak English and count to 3. I did work over christmas, but because it was only for 5 months I was put right back in with Ingeus upon signing on again.
They also keep hassling me to accept thier offer of a work experience placement, despite me telling them in no uncertain terms shall I work for no wage.
|>>|| No. 4464
Those tests, so awkward.
>show up to room from people who look like they just stepped off a boat
>no English speaking people
>all stressing over 'test'
>sit down with test
>get up to check its the right test
>finish in 30s
>Angry glares from Johny foreigner
>29/30, spelled underneath wrong
Then I went upstairs to choose the job which would fit me and got told primark down the road were hiring when the computer said I would like being an industrial sea diver, 3 buses to get there too. bunch of cunts.
|>>|| No. 4465
I don't know if it's the same across the UK, but the jobcentre lot are pushing people to go for youth employment scheme stuff, which is basically work experience. I'm not in much of a position to be picky but fuck me if I'm going to work 39 weeks at £52 a week. Half the 'jobs' on the jobcentre site seem to be this now.
It's not limited to actual professions or anything either, the number of 'work experience as a sales adviser' positions is fairly shocking.
|>>|| No. 4515
How long do I have to wait after quitting my job before I can sign on to the dole?
|>>|| No. 4516
Depends, if you quit then it's 6 months, same if you were sacked.
Though you can always try claiming anyway, they dont check often.
|>>|| No. 4517
>Depends, if you quit then it's 6 months, same if you were sacked.
What's it dependent on then?
|>>|| No. 4518
If you're made redundant or left work through no fault of your own (constructive dismissal/unfair dismissal) then you're entitled to JSA immediately. If you left of your own volition or were sacked due to your behaviour, you can be sanctioned. The rules are quite complicated and subject to interpretation, so you should sign on anyway even if you expect to be sanctioned. There are hardship payments available, which you can claim even if you've been sanctioned if you'd end up completely skint. There are several rights of appeal which are often worth pursuing.
|>>|| No. 4519
I left my job and signed up for it straight away.
Make sure you find another job asap though. They fucked me over so bad by cutting me off without notice (becuase I quit my job), which stopped my housing benefit too so couldn't pay rent and had to sell all my stuff to do so, had to go 5 days without electric and surviving on dry weetabix, couldn't even get a crisis loan because I chose to quit my job.
|>>|| No. 4520
1. Quit your job without first securing alternative income
2. Receive benefit you aren't entitled to
3. Complain that the Jobcentre fucked you over
Modern Britain, ladies and gentlemen.
|>>|| No. 4521
>I left my job
You did read up about the benefit you were signing up to, right?
|>>|| No. 4523
What's the problem here? Applying for JSA when you walked out is like applying for a blue badge when you've broken your leg. You simply can't claim to be hard done by in that situation.
|>>|| No. 4524
First of all, it doesn't say here that people leaving their job can't claim JSA, and you would think that it would, given that it's an unemployed person's only means of support and therefore quite important:
And secondly, being forced to stay in a job you hate by the threat of no public support when you leave it is an affront to your economic liberty, so this situation shouldn't even exist in the first place.
|>>|| No. 4525
>First of all, it doesn't say here that people leaving their job can't claim JSA
There's a booklet you pick up at the JCP all about JSA. That you can't get it if you were sacked or left without good reason is mentioned quite early on. I daresay there's a copy of this booklet on the webshite somewhere.
>And secondly, being forced to stay in a job you hate by the threat of no public support when you leave it is an affront to your economic liberty
If you're genuinely being mistreated, then you can claim that you were justified in leaving.
|>>|| No. 4526
1) See if you can get a sick note off your doctor, even if it's stress related.
2) See if the doctor will backdate the sick note, as ESA will backdate the payments up to 3 months if a sicknote covers the period.
3) As for JSA, they usually apply a sanction for up to 6 months if you willingly leave a job. You could avoid this if there were good grounds for leaving, but you would need to lodge an appeal against the JSA decision.
4) While JSA is sanctioned, you can claim hardship payments after 3 weeks, but they are usually only 40% of the benefit. You can apply for this every week.
5) Housing Benefit and Council Tax benefit automatically stop when JSA stops as it is a passport benefit. You can still claim Housing Benefit without receiving JSA, you need to fill in a nil-income statement and possibly provide bank statements to prove your lack of earnings for your claim period.
6) Go to a CAB or advice centre whenever you need help with supporting yourself you fucking idiot.
|>>|| No. 4527
This government webpage will be the first port of call for a significant number of people who want to claim JSA. You should expect it to clearly say that people who have recently left work are ineligible. You shouldn't have to be furrowing around in some booklet. It's a con enabling the DWP to avoid paying benefit to deserving people.
It's not about mistreatment; it's about having the leisure to find a job you enjoy and are suited to, rather than having to be a wage slave.
|>>|| No. 4529
Alternatively, speak to people who are paid to interpret and understand what the government says before you just quit your job.
|>>|| No. 4530
>This government webpage will be the first port of call for a significant number of people who want to claim JSA.
Yes, and if they're not idiots it won't be their last.
|>>|| No. 4531
Maybe people don't have the time to do detailed research on what should be a simple entitlement because they, you know, have a full-time job. But, no, apparently it's their fault that
>The rules are quite complicated and subject to interpretation
|>>|| No. 4532
>Hi, I'm thinking of leaving my job, could you please advise me on that for free?
|>>|| No. 4533
>it's about having the leisure to find a job you enjoy and are suited to
If you feel that you're entitled to that by rights, then fair enough. Unfortunately for you, the majority of the electorate disagrees. Most people feel that the spirit of the welfare state is to provide a safety net for people who are in unavoidable hardship, not to subsidise the lifestyles of people who choose not to work.
You had a job, but you left because you didn't like it. You expected taxpayers - many of whom are also in jobs they don't particularly like - to pay your bills until you found a job more to your liking. Not unreasonably, the taxpayer told you to piss off. The benefits system is deliberately designed to prevent exactly what you wanted to do, because most people see it as parasitic. If you thought otherwise, then you were badly deluded.
|>>|| No. 4536
Yeah, I hated my job and stupidly quit, but the next day I was already looking for work.
My mistake for leaving before finding another, but I was actually seeking a job which I couldn't say for what % who claim Job SEEKERS allowance? So yeah, there's some entitlement and bitterness about the job centre fucking me over whilst they quite happily pay for other peoples weed who haven't had in interest in finding a job for years.
Anyway, I'm all sorted now, was just giving that guy a heads up as I didn't know the score when I quite, and this reply is primarily just to say fuck you.
Ta for the advice, and insult, but as said I'm sorted now and have been in work for a year since the incident.
Some of the people on this site, christ.
|>>|| No. 4537
I'm glad you're sorted, but I needed to provide proper advice on your situation and similar situations in case anyone should find themselves in a similar predicament.
If you can't handle someone calling you a fucking idiot on the internet, perhaps you should stick to reddit rather than imageboards.
|>>|| No. 4543
>but I was actually seeking a job which I couldn't say for what % who claim Job SEEKERS allowance?
>entitlement and bitterness about the job centre fucking me over
The job centre didn't fuck you over. You fucked yourself over.
|>>|| No. 4666
They're making me book in every week been about 4 months now.
When does it stop and I turn up every 2 weeks?
|>>|| No. 4742
I've been on probation at work for about 4 months now and I've been given another 6 weeks probation after which I will probably be let go for basically being too slow (I'm having a lot of trouble, this job really isn't for me at all). Will I be able to get JSA again afterwards or will I be rejected and starve to death?
|>>|| No. 4743
If you're fired then it's fine. It's just a problem if you voluntarily quit.
|>>|| No. 4747
Only it isn't.
>If you were dismissed from your job, we’ll ask your last employer for the reasons. You will be able to comment on what they say. Jobcentre Plus will decide whether you have lost your employment because of your own actions. If we do decide that this is the case, you may lose your entitlement to Jobseeker’s Allowance from one to 26 weeks.
Much like leaving a job voluntarily, you need to show you acted reasonably.
|>>|| No. 4748
It sounds like he's being dismissed for legitimate reasons. I think that bit's to stop people doing something ridiculous to deliberately get fired because they know they're not allowed to quit.
|>>|| No. 4749
Only it is.
>If you were dismissed from your job, we’ll ask your last employer for the reasons. You will be able to comment on what they say. Jobcentre Plus will decide whether you have lost your employment because of your own actions. If we do decide that this is the case, you may lose your entitlement to Jobseeker’s Allowance from one to 26 weeks.
If you get fired, no sanctions will be imposed unless you were trying to get fired, i.e. you left voluntarily. If you leave voluntarily, you will be sanctioned, no exceptions.
|>>|| No. 4751
You're correct, but you don't get sanctioned for misconduct related firing, unless the person on the other side of the desk is a cunt or behind on his quota. The JSA quote is misleading.
|>>|| No. 4752
I know someone who quit and told the Job Centre his work environment was so stressful he couldn't continue there because it would damage his health, and they accepted it. He was completely genuine though and got another job very soon after.
|>>|| No. 4755
Christ, I'd never have expected that to fly in this Tory day and age.
|>>|| No. 4758
Just been told I have to start signing weekly.
Cunts, where do they expect me to pull the extra busfare from? Especially paying the fucking bedroom tax.
it's like they want us unemployed folk to go on the rob.
|>>|| No. 4761
If you were dismissed for misconduct, you are liable to lose entitlement for 26 weeks, just like leaving a job without a good reason. AIUI, this isn't a sanction, you're simply not entitled and your claim will either fail or result in a nil award.
|>>|| No. 4762
I thought you could reclaim your bus fare while they make you sign on weekly?
|>>|| No. 4765
If they aren't mentioning this stuff, there should be plenty of leaflets sitting on the racks explaining what you're entitled to. Look for one about travel benefits.
One thing they seem to be keeping top secret is the Jobcentre Plus Travel Discount Card, it gets you half fare on the train. If you're in London you can get the slightly better-known Bus & Tram Discount Photocard for your Oyster.
|>>|| No. 4772
Ahhh fun times to be at the Job centre.
Was signing on today and then a bloke started shouting and kicking off, slamming the desk and knocking shit about.
From what I heard, he was sick of being treated like shit every time he went there, they cant cut his money off for doing 9 things instead of ten, he can barely get by as is and feed his kids etc so they're taking food form his daughters mouth.
Then the security bloke came over and grabbed him and they had a scuffle before the coppers showed up form over the road.
To be fair, I dont blame him.
|>>|| No. 4773
Sounds like he was a muppet for being suckered into signing for ten things. Most I've ever had on any of my JS agreements was two. Got no questions when I was doing much more, and didn't get into trouble during the slow weeks.
|>>|| No. 4774
I have to do 14 things a week and they wont take no for an answer. A large increase from 3 which i'd done for 4 years previous.
|>>|| No. 4777
A tip for the dolesumlads:
HE colleges often have some very good courses, which actually improve your employability.
I paid 30 quid for a course worth three grand due to providing a dole slip.
This is likely to be in breach of your JSA terms, but if you don't tell anyone at the job centre you will be fine. The colleges do not pass your info on to the government. Just keep your head down and ensure that your tutor knows in advance that once a week/fortnight you may have to miss a class.
|>>|| No. 4778
>This is likely to be in breach of your JSA terms
If you do a part-time course then you should be alright, although you'd be expected to give up the course for a job.
|>>|| No. 4779
Nah, only if it is less than 15 hours a week - my experience was 18 hours.
Kept mum and did it, bullshited the job seeking, then walked into a job 3 months later. A job dependent on the course, and arranged two months before I finished.
I kept in touch with one of the senior guys at the job centre, and we would go for a pint on a Friday. I mentioned what I had done one day, and he told me that he would have done the same. He was a thoroughly decent guy, which is why I ket in touch, but he also said that one word out of place and I would have been seriously fucked. But the fact that this risk existed was nonsence of the highest order.
|>>|| No. 4819
Last week I went in and they would not refund my dayrider ticket despite having done so an eternity of times before, they would only give me back the price of a return.
Today, they wont refund bus tickets in Cash anymore.
Nope, my £3.70 will be refunded to my bank within 5 working days. Lovely since I needed it for milk on the way home.
|>>|| No. 4873
When I was on the dole I was always weekly. Does this mean my advisor hated me? She always seemed really nice.
|>>|| No. 5012
So basically it's time for me to get some dole; I've been pretty much full on hikkomori for the last few months because of crippling depression and I'm getting into trouble now with debts (I was hoping I'd get a job without having to go on the dole, but of course I was a lazy twat).
>Online claims begin on the date they are submitted. In very exceptional circumstances only, it may be possible for a claim to start from an earlier date and then only with a valid reason provided. Do you want your claim to start from an earlier date?
This came up on the site, so is it possible I could get my claim started from when I actually lost my job? That was around May time.
|>>|| No. 5013
Only if you can prove that you were unable to make a claim at an earlier date. If you can get a diagnosis of depression or agoraphobia it might be worth a punt at getting your claim backdated.
|>>|| No. 5014
Then they'll argue because you were not well, you were not entitled to JSA for that period and should have claimed one of the various disability benefits.
|>>|| No. 5015
If he was too ill to be actively seeking work then yes. He was too ill to make a claim, let alone actively seek work.
|>>|| No. 5016
If he could get a sick note, maybe he could apply for ESA and try to backdate that.
|>>|| No. 5031
Cheers lads. I'll give it a go anyway, try and blag whatever I can from them. I should be able to get a sick note so that route might be a goer.
Went in for an appointment today and all they did was have me sign some forms and gave me an appointment for a different jobcentre that's technically nearer but is full of even more chavs. I assumed this is part of the normal bureaucracy but I didn't have the balls to ask when I'll start getting my fucking money- So when do I start getting my fucking money?
|>>|| No. 5032
When your claim gets processed. Last spell I was on, my first signing appointment was the day after my induction appointment, and I still hadn't been paid by the following appointment two weeks later.
|>>|| No. 5062
Went to sign on today, and been told for the next fortnight i have to sign on every day, starting tomorrow.
Great, thanks for the notice enough to put aside the extra busfares.
|>>|| No. 5063
Daily signing? What the actual fuck? You will of course be demanding a refund of those bus fares at your appointments and not leaving until you get it. Not a promise of a refund, but the cash itself. Be civil but firm.
|>>|| No. 5064
Oh they give refunds, but straight into your bank now, within 48 hours.
Cant get £3.60 out of the bank without fucking about.
|>>|| No. 5065
are you fucking serious?
im thinking of signing and theres no way i can hack going daily
|>>|| No. 5066
I think they only do that if you piss them off or slack with your jobsearch and need "extra help". If you act keen and apply for at least as many jobs as they ask you to, there should be no problem.
|>>|| No. 5067
To be honest, with your punctuation and capitalization, you're lucky they let you sign on at all. Arsecunt.
|>>|| No. 5078
been told it's because I've just come off the work program, so it's a period of increased assistance. Which means, in the 3 days I've signed on extra, I've been made to wait half an hour, signed a bit of paper and left without fuck all happening. What takes the piss is that during being on TWP, I worked for 5 months before being laid off. However you have to be in work for 6 for the slate to be wiped so to speak, so they treat me as If I've been out of work for over 2 years.
|>>|| No. 5087
Haven't claimed JSA before, went in for a meeting last week and was told "Your partner earns £800 a month? That's more than £400, so he should be able to support the both of you". Didn't even get chance to sit down, seemed like a firm no.
So is that that? Does that assume we'd be getting housing benefit?
|>>|| No. 5088
My friend had something similar, she was a couple of months short of being able to claim contribution-based JSA which, IIRC, she'd have been able to claim even though her boyfriend has a decent job.
No idea about housing benefit, call the council.
|>>|| No. 5113
I've just been told "off the record" By my Advisor blokey that starting next Thursday, everybody on JSA will be made to sign on weekly. And that advisor appointments are being rolled into regular signing on days. Therefore, the new rules are that you must show up at such and such time, but must allow for an hours wait to see an advisor.
|>>|| No. 5115
He said it was being introduced on the quiet, and people would get letters when they signed on next.
|>>|| No. 5205
Hey guys. I applied on monday and haven't gotten any replies back. So yeah, it's been an entire week when they said it'd take 2 working days. Any idea what's going on?
|>>|| No. 5209
Anyone with a bag of spuds might suggest that this was a sneaky way of keeping the claimant count down.
I remember applying online, and receiving a text message a couple of days later. The message said my appointment was the following morning.
|>>|| No. 5210
I applied and, IIRC, at the end of the form it said they'd text me within two days to set up a Job Centre interview. It got to 4.30pm on the second day and I hadn't heard anything so I went into the Job Centre and they told me they HAD made an appointment for me the following day, they just hadn't bothered to tell me about it.
|>>|| No. 5211
They didn't even apologise or anything. She just laughed and said, "It's a good job you came in then."
|>>|| No. 5289
They are utterly useless wanks. Sorry you have to deal with them right now. I've known some people who worked for them and they were all a bit strange, to say the least. It seems they like to pick a strange breed and run an even stranger ship.
|>>|| No. 5297
My dad has worked at a jobbie for 40 years, and to hear him tell it it's even more depressing to work there than it is to sign on there. He's had chairs lobbed at him, been threatened with a sawnoff, had people come in bollock naked to claim etc. I imagine it gets to you.
They don't pick 'a strange breed', they pick from the small, shitty pool of candidates that are suitably qualified, but autistic/offputting enough not to have any other offers. Generally supplemented with ex-Fraud Squad old farts like the old man, who remember the days when they had more powers than the police and are just hanging on until retirement and don't really give a toss.
|>>|| No. 5315
> How dare you say that.
Shouldn't that end in a question mark? Plus, why not dare? It's not like anyone here is scary or there's anything to really dare. It's not like Goodfellas here.
|>>|| No. 5322
I had the completely bizzare phenomenon of having a decent job center worker the other month.
I had transfered in after moving to the area, and in my first meeting with him, after he finished telling me all of the expesnes I could make claims for and how to do it. He then started offering me the abblity to get free training, I don't mean like shitty, how to apply for work and how do you turn on a computer level, I mean genuine training that job seekers would pay for (and up to ten grands worth). I was preparing a proposal for SQL and six sigma training when I unfortunately became employed, I think that doing those courses would have been potentially better for my career then getting a job right then.
The man was the very model of what the system should be like, and I don't understand why people like him don't exist more.
|>>|| No. 5324
>I mean genuine training that job seekers would pay for (and up to ten grands worth).
I think you ran the risk of being suckered into something there. That sort of thing isn't at the adviser's discretion at all. The office as a whole would have a budget for additional training, and unless you were signing on at Scum Central £10k would have likely blown that budget for the month, if not the quarter.
|>>|| No. 5328
Today I went in to sign and they informed me they'd closed my claim because I failed to attend an appointment on the 11th. They had supposedly sent me a letter about this appointment but I never received it so didn't know anything about it.
I've just completed my online "rapid reclaim". I wonder what the odds are they're going to "forget" to tell me when my new claim interview is again.
|>>|| No. 5335
Push them all the way on this one, because that FTA will be down on your record for the purposes of determining the length of any sanctions, which are now being given out willy-nilly.
|>>|| No. 5336
I had this happen to me before.
Had money cut off for a month while they investigated etc, got it all backpayed but they instantly blame you and not themselves.
|>>|| No. 5337
I got the text message at 16.23 yesterday saying the appointment was at 14.50 today. I got another text at 12.45 today saying
>Your Jobseeker's Allowance has been awarded. We will confirm this by letter. Please continue to attend the Jobcentre as advised.
The woman at the appointment was really nice and just asked if I'd been on holiday or something.
I was expecting them to mess about for at least a month because that's what they did last time I made a new claim. When I phoned them that time they said they'd lost the paperwork and had to print my online application off again.
|>>|| No. 5352
I am going to get an eye test and likely some glasses for basically nothing thanks to the JSA. Fellows, make as much as you can from what you're entitled to if they will help you in the long-run. They will also pay for you to get to interviews if you tell them, because it isn't a signing-on day, feel free to apply far and wide.
Only just started my claim, no cockups pissing me about like >>5337 just had, so hopefully I don't end up with the same of the other problems some of you seem to have had.
|>>|| No. 5353
If you haven't had a payment yet, expect it to take up to 4-6 weeks before they start (at which point you'll be back-paid to the start of your claim). Their "Universal Jobmatch" is not compulsory, and challenge anyone who tells you so. By using it, you risk giving DWP information that may lead to them stopping your benefit. If this principled stand doesn't impress, there's also the fact that it's shit and the competition (Reed, Indeed, Fish4) are much better.
If you are sent a job advert under the guise of trying to help you (it'll be a poor fit, and it'll be shit since half the office will have tried to fill it already), it may technically be a "notified vacancy" which can trip you up and lead to a stoppage.
|>>|| No. 5354
I got my payment today as it happens, no buggering about for some reason, I was probably ambiguous so sorry about that - I made my claim a week ago yesterday and had my first sign-on this Monday.
My adviser has told me I have to go to the universal job match site and sign up for that, but I know it's a sack of shit and there are tonnes of graduate level jobs I can apply for right now, I will only sign onto that as a last resort if they threaten me with losing my benefits in the meantime and they corner me with having to do it. I didn't sign my agreement with that as a requisite, so I shall stick by this. There are some good German language jobs on that site that I have gone for.
|>>|| No. 5359
I delayed going on UJM for as long as possible but finally signed up and it doesn't seem to be as bad of a privacy violation as I thought it would be.
You can browse it without logging on so if they were to ask you why you hadn't been on it for ages you could just say you'd been doing that.
If you apply for a job that's handled internally by UJM, it just sends the employer your CV and doesn't seem to allow you to put a covering letter. Nowadays at least 90% of UJM vacancies either ask you to email or send you off to an offsite link. If the JobCentre asked you why you hadn't made any applications, you could tell them they weren't showing up on your UJM account because of that.
A lot of advisors know UJM is crap and find it perfectly acceptable for you to use other recruitment sites instead. You can sign up just to humour them (and so they can meet their target for sign ups) and then not use it.
|>>|| No. 5377
When I was on UJW I would set a macro to roam around the pages and click on links then return and reset for a couple hours a day and then go look through myself and apply for a couple of dead end jobs with my professional CV or for professional jobs with my mundane CV. Nobody ever knew. If they required an email I sent them a good cover letter but my "sabotaged" cv which I designed specifically to be unappealing to employers without them really knowing why.
Worked for 9 months and then I accidentally got a job. Ho hum, at least I have money I suppose.
|>>|| No. 5378
I looked for 5 minutes a day, applying for 2-3 things a week with a naff CV.
They don't care about how long you spend on it, or if you apply for anything, only that the system flags you up as having logged on XX times a week.
|>>|| No. 5381
Seeing as there isn't enough jobs, college and Uni places or apprenticeships to go around, I think Dave might have just made a mistake here. 16 year olds are probably going to be able to vote by the next election. That's a rather large demographic to alienate in its entirety.
Not only can companies pay you less, you can't even count on a safety net if you happen to lose your job? I have lived alone since I was 17 without any family for help. I spent 3 of the years until I was 25 unemployed because no one would hire me and I needed to be out of my guardians care for 3 years to get a bursary from college. I couldn't go to Uni because I had no qualifications. Under this new rule I would have been homeless. That's scandalous. There must be thousands of lads and lasses out there who are in the same boat and they are being let down, damned to live on the streets.
Hopefully, Scotland becomes independent. I'd rather take that risk, with all we could lose, than be complicit in this blatant attack on the poor.
|>>|| No. 5382
>16 year olds are probably going to be able to vote by the next election
|>>|| No. 5383
For anyone not following, British general elections are on a fixed schedule since the Fixed-term Parliaments Act 2011, so the date of the next election is set at the 7th of May 2015.
|>>|| No. 5384
>>5381 >>5382 >>5383
My guess is the Conservatives aren't particularly popular among 16-18 year olds, and that alone means this would be very unlikely to happen this parliament.
|>>|| No. 5385
It's arsebackwards. Something needs to be done about low wages and high rents being subsidised by the state, but this isn't it.
Between January 2010 and December 2011 93% of new housing benefit claims were made by households with at least one person in employment. Apparently only one in eight benefit claimants are unemployed, with the remainder either in low paid employment, registered disabled or retired.
|>>|| No. 5386
Irrespective of political stance, does anyone really think that giving the vote to 16-year-olds is a good idea? They're still drawing anarchy A's on their pencil cases at that age.
|>>|| No. 5387
I don't know. I was a lot more right wing at that age because I didn't really know what looking after myself entailed when I was still living with my parents and I was still in the chase-my-dreams mindset, thinking the world was going to be my oyster.
|>>|| No. 5388
I'm 25 now and heavily political, and I'm racking my brains trying to remember if I had any strong political beliefs at 16. I think I was just trying to get through school.
|>>|| No. 5390
Yes. They're of age to join the forces (not actively go into combat, but any soldier is always at risk), be charged adult fares and so on.
Further, seeing as our elections are every 5 years the change will basically be more likely to include more young adults who missed out on a vote because of bad timing and would otherwise only be able to vote at 23.
|>>|| No. 5391
Are you proposing that under 18s should require parental consent to vote? You know, as they do to join the army.
|>>|| No. 5393
As easily as I've missed something, you missed my point. Ideas are better communicated when they're, er, communicated and not simply willed to the other party.
|>>|| No. 5395
But your post is a waste of time. I will not reply to it because it
a) ignores over 2/3 of the substance of my argument and
b) is just plain stupid. You may as well claim 'WELL ACCORDING TO YOU THAT MEANS VOTERS NEED TO SHINE THEIR SHOES AND LIVE IN A BARRACKS BEFORE THEY CAN VOTE. CHECKMATE ATHEISTS.'
|>>|| No. 5396
I really don't think there is enough of a demand to lower the voting age amongst 16 and 17 year olds.
|>>|| No. 5403
Hey lads. If I go on an internship for 6 months or so (no pay and no job at the end most likely) can I still get dole money?
My advisor said I can contact her if I need money for travel expenses and such but I was too scared to ask about this. They might think I'm working or some shit.
|>>|| No. 5410
I got pretty internally distressed at the Hull JCP the other day sitting near some guy who was telling his advisor that he would be getting his SIA training in the coming week or so, saying how he'd pass the test after walking into the place. By the looks of it, he'd be talking about it for years and was probably an abuser of the ol' white cider, aka an unemployable bullshitter.
It's a sad fact that there'll be people who will remain like that in the world, but there's no point trying to punish them at all when there are others who are temporarily or two years in unemployment.
It was probably more to do with the fact there was nothing to really help him out there other than what the state can do for him, or any bit on the side, and also that the government hates poor wretches like that so much they're willing to throw the baby out with the bathwater and propose utterly insane incentives like picking up shit for benefits.
Sage for hating IDS.
|>>|| No. 5440
I needed a JCP appointment to get a national insurance number. First they give me a date three weeks away, and then two days to it they call and say they'll have to give me a date two weeks later because they're "short staffed". I had a trip planned that day, so maybe two days later? Noo, they can't do that. I need to cancel and rebook for a new random time apparently. Lovely.
|>>|| No. 5623
Do they still issue them? I know the tight cunts stopped issuing replacements just recently.
|>>|| No. 5643
If you have a number, you don't need to replace it unless someone abused your identity. As for the cards, they probably shouldn't be necessary much beyond 21. If you can't recite your number immediately by the time you're 25 you need to see a doctor about possible neurological problems or check your job privilege.
|>>|| No. 5722
>go to dole centre
>lady asks what your career goal is
>4 people said Games critic
|>>|| No. 5724
Ahahahaha...oh God. I pity thee.
I actually saw a Games Review vacancy on a journalism website the other day. $5 an article, with maximum payment of $50 a week. Even if they printed thirty of your articles.
|>>|| No. 5725
I imagine you can do a lot of work on the side, though. And judging by their prices, they aren't big on quality, so you can just rewrite stuff from IGN or whatever.
|>>|| No. 5727
It's a decent income if you're living in the developing world and can do your weekly shop for $10, but there's no way you could survive on that sort of income in the developed world. You'd have to write an article in less than half an hour just to make minimum wage.
|>>|| No. 5728
It was more the cap on weekly earnings that had me chortling. Despite the fact that they were asking for 20-30 individual articles.
|>>|| No. 5729
I don't think it's supposed to be your only income, that's the thing. If you're a student and have enough time on your hand to write a bunch of low-quality articles for some extra cash, why not?
You can also be from India, though.
|>>|| No. 5730
Most games journalism has always been rewriting press releases and copy pasting content from one or two news sources. It's similar to the mainstream news recycling newswire and other newspapers, but even shittier as it is the lowest on the ladder of quality and respectibility other than writing articles for porn mags and sites.
|>>|| No. 5731
Grimsbygazettelad here. Nowt wrong with "writing articles for porn mags". It blew my mind how many of them are actually true - we get bombarded with shit there is no way we would run in print and we are a fucking local rag.
|>>|| No. 5732
>we get bombarded with shit there is no way we would run in print and we are a fucking local rag
Instead, they get picked up by the local fucking rag. Is that my coat?
|>>|| No. 5733
I've never seen a local newspaper worth buying or anything in it worth reading. Utter drivel without exception. They make it even worse by actually aspiring to the quality of tabloids. Urgh.
|>>|| No. 5767
Gripping stuff. I hope they keep us updated with an extra edition or a breaking news bulletin interrupting TV viewing. Justice for the pool cue strong man!
|>>|| No. 5778
To get back on topic, any lazy dolescum after a topup on your state-sponsored beer money, have a word with some local agencies and see if any of them are handling the council's temps. They will want some in mid January to handle the extra load on their waste handling.
|>>|| No. 5782
H-hey guys. I was given a "job oppurtunity" (well its an interview), how do i fuck it up so they dont hire me?
i rejected a previous one and got told off for it, apparently you're not allowed to reject shitty job offers. what a load of shit.
It's for a fucking hotel retail and it's nowhere near what I wanna do. any advice? do i just go in with muh trainers/trackies (i assume thats chav-like?) or some thing?
|>>|| No. 5783
No, you get the job, work and try to find something while actually being employed.
|>>|| No. 5826
Does anyone know on which days jobs are advertised in the Metro (newspaper)? I know Monday is one. I'm in Manchester if that makes a difference.
I have a feeling it might be Monday and Thursday.
|>>|| No. 5867
I got called in for daily appointments this week to waste 2 hours travelling both ways for some "randomly decided benefits health check" in Hull. Yesterday I went in to confirm details, today I went in to be handed a list of agencies I got on my 1st week claiming in October.
Is there a point in any of this?
I also had a telephone interview on Monday for 2 jobs offered by an agency that both use my kraut-speak credentials, and I passed with flying colours. I am through to the next stage of the interviews, I'm 80% sure. The JCP hasn't helped in the slightest with anything, and they certainly haven't helped this week with pissing me around coming in at irregular times through the week.
|>>|| No. 5868
>Is there a point in any of this?
Tricking stupid people into thinking that they're actually doing something about all those supposed scroungers.
|>>|| No. 5871
>and they certainly haven't helped this week with pissing me around coming in at irregular times through the week.
They're not trying to help. They're just making it as much hassle as possible and making sure you're not working on the sly.
|>>|| No. 5878
This, it's changed over the past couple of years from actually helping, to just trying to get people off the books ASAP.
|>>|| No. 5879
and making it punitive. The "job club" entails doing a job search on a half-crippled computer with no right click and a ridiculously stringent firewall. They make people go in to do it at 9am (under threat of sanctions) even though they can do it much more effectively on a proper computer at home. They have people commuting for over an hour from far flung parts of Manchester to do it.
|>>|| No. 5880
and it earns the provider millions for the "help" they're giving.
|>>|| No. 5881
They also consider it a big coup when they get someone an apprenticeship as a cold-calling-PPI-pest.
|>>|| No. 5885
>>5867 here, when A4e had the contract they used to get quite the bonus from the DWP for finding someone "work." The condition was that it was supposed to be more than 16hrs a week (i.e. not part-time) and last for at least six months, now IIRC, they were investigated for fraud by the DWP and the rozzers for simply making things up - and they lost their contract to do job club. I had to go to the one in Hull back in 2009 amid this investigation into fraud, and all they seriously had us all do was breathtaking, we would sit in a room from 9-4 with 3 really shit computers and print off our CVs to send to addresses we had found in the yellow pages. I kid you not. A4e were simply getting money to watch people find addresses in the yellow fucking pages.
I went to uni in the meantime and absolutely hate this whole dole malarkey, it does nothing other than to waste your time and help whatever "outsourced provider" (read: absolute waste of government revenue) bag a quick buck for making sure people aren't working cash in hand down their local or whatever. I have had a previous interview back in November for a job that I was denied because I didn't have a certificate showing I know how to use SAGE, did the job centre help? Did they balls, they said because I had a degree, there was nothing they could do to help me get a basic little qualification to improve my "office readiness", so a half-decent job down the drain. Apparently the only thing they can do is teach the few older lads/drunks how to type and use the internet to fill out application forms.
|>>|| No. 5887
>>5885 Avanta is useless to. I had to pester them to get referred to some free training stuff. They also wasted tons of money for this company the course was provided by as they said they referred about 20 people. Only 5 or 6 people turned up... most of them phoned on the day to say they had to go on a course. They got their letters notifying them after the start.
Other than that it is sit about searching indeed.co.uk, Universal Jobmatch and so on in the offices every fortnight for an hour. And write down a list. Or they phone up about a job I can't do because it is an apprenticeship I don't qualify for or mess me about saying I've got an interview and ending up just going to Avanta a few times in a suit and the real interview never materialising.
|>>|| No. 5889
One time StandGuide phoned me at 5.45pm to tell me I had to attend a course at 10am the next morning. It's a good job I have the internet at home to find out the bus times. They'd actually informed most of the people it started at 9am so they had to sit there in awkward silence for an extra hour.
|>>|| No. 5890
My advisor nearly had a nosebleed when I told them I hadn't been on the UJM site since I started claiming in October. All that UJM does it just tell you to go to another website to make an application for something, so it just saves about 2 minutes of time if you've got a half decent connection at home, I won't even go into the quality of the computers we have to put up with, >>5886 is pretty much on it there. I think she was also annoyed that when I made my account, I ticked the box saying they can't snoop about.
|>>|| No. 5891
I make a point of avoiding answering the phone after about 4pm if it's not someone I know. I've been caught out by this in the past. Twice I've received a confirmed invite to interview after 4.30 on a Friday, wanting me on the Monday morning. Unfortunately, the JCP will only pay your interview expenses if you apply in advance - they have discretion to pay after the fact, but you need a really good excuse, and for some bizarre reason "the office was not physically open at any time in between" is somehow not good enough.
|>>|| No. 5894
You don't legally have to give them access, however they can legally demand printouts of screenshots of certain parts of it.
|>>|| No. 5895
Yeah, that's bollocks. Get some proper advice, untick it, and record any and all meetings with them.
|>>|| No. 5898
I went in for the stupid daily intensive thing today and it was useless, all the woman did was do my bus fares, ask me about work trials and experience, to which I knew I had to oblige to say "yes, thanks for that, I'll consider it" and "so if I apply for a job, I can tell them this?" - afterwards, she was going down the 5 day planner and kept asking me of the things on it:
"Are you alright for interview clothes?" - she might as well have asked me if I knew how to find the North Star, of course I do! I'm in possession of many a tasteful suit, blue, black ad grey.
"Do you know how to use the internet?" U wot lassm7? She basically said "I'll leave you to it, you're actually looking for work and know what you're doing, plus have a degree, so I won't need to see you Friday." (Yeah, so my head's screwed on and I know what I want in life?)
I am certain all this information was alreay gleaned from my every signing day and the repeated questions that cropped up during them. I guess the suit they'd let you buy be a nasty £30 George suit though.
|>>|| No. 5899
>I guess the suit they'd let you buy be a nasty £30 George suit though.
My cheap suit from george has done alright for me.
It's been to a wedding and a few job interviews. I'm not Hans Gruber or a Japanese business man so I'll stick with it for a while.
|>>|| No. 5900
Cheap suits are ace. I remember being a bit mournful when I got my jacket, but having something machine-washable is just such a bonus. When I think of all of the time and money I would have wasted if I'd got something 'better'...
|>>|| No. 5903
I walked past Salford Seetec half an hour ago and the shutter was down with a sign up saying "Office closed due to emergency". Dozens of people work in that place. Weird.
I'm all excited in case they found anthrax spores or someone went postal.
|>>|| No. 5930
Came a close 2nd out of 6 for the interview. The thing that swung it? The other cadidate didn't have to move house/flat and could begin immediately, seeing as though I'm a bumpkin outside Hull it seems extremely unfair to me to let me rot in this purgatory when I've been gradually urbanised. At least I can tell the job centre this half-decent news when they drag me in...again...for a stupid interview on Saturday. They really think I'm moonlighting!
|>>|| No. 6008
Being a graduate, living with parents and on the dole is a really horrible combination. I know they both mean well, but they keep telling me to apply for jobs that have absolutely nothing to do with what I am capable of doing at all. As they didn't go to uni, they aren't aware of the market for particular skills and sectors or what the type of work in a skill-based (French speaking, in this case) sector actually entails, nor have they researched it at all. My dad seems to think it's talking French 100% of the time when such work in the UK is closer to being about 25-75% of all work volume handled using it and is therefore impossible for me to do "a waste of time." Perhaps as he doesn't know anything about it, that's his issue with it.
It just seems that I am best left alone without any kind of interference (and it works, I get interviews, good feedback, occasional translations to do), but I really fear that the job centre will be total dickheads to me as I am approaching the 6 month barrier.
Sage for having a whinge about how shit it is.
|>>|| No. 6012
Before long they'll be pretty much forcing you to apply for 4 hours a week cleaning jobs.
|>>|| No. 6015
Signed on today, it was a simple matter of being signed through by some guy who looked like George Costanza. No exchanges of pleasantries or anything. This might not bode well.
|>>|| No. 6018
Are you on the Work Program now? I find signing with the Work Program Team is often like that. One guy doesn't even bother to look at the JobSearch, I guess they think Seetec or whoever will be leaning on you enough.
Oddly enough he's called Ming. When I saw his name on my appointment card I though that definitely boded badly but he didn't seem too merciless at all. (Might have been different if I'd made a moronic name joke in front of him.)
|>>|| No. 6023
Not him but I'm also on the programme. Pretty useless though cos in such a deprived town there are no jobs at all. They can help with courses though, might be useful if I finally save up to move to London. And saving from JSA is quite a challenge lol.
|>>|| No. 6026
Especially if the only social activities you can do at all involve spending £3 a pint in a pub.
|>>|| No. 6336
Council tax (Poll tax) for unemployed?
I got only 25% reduction, are they serious? How I can pay anything getting only JSA? Seems like 700until april next year. Is anybody on here been through this?
Worth to appeal i guess. Single, 1 bedroom flat, band A.
Please share your experiences how to deal with this.
|>>|| No. 6338
25% is the discount for occupation by a single eligible person (the same property can be occupied by exempt persons). Have you applied for Council Tax Benefit? If you're on income-based JSA, you should be eligible for at least something more than that.
|>>|| No. 6340
It is replaced by Coucil Tax Reduction since 2013 according to gov.uk site.
When you fill in housing application, that reduction application goes together with it.
Well, have to visit them on monday. It should be 100% reduction. Will appeal if neccessary.
|>>|| No. 6342
>It should be 100% reduction.
Much closer to 100% than 25% certainly, but you'll likely need more adverse circumstances than simply being on JSA to have the whole bill waived. The thing with Council Tax Support is that individual councils set their own rates of relief. I'm on JSA and receive an 81% reduction. I know some councils are more generous and probably some are less so.
|>>|| No. 6343
Thanks for responses, anonymous.
Yeah.. well, probably appeal might be the solution. In the beginning I thought that band A mean something that blocks the 100% reduction.
|>>|| No. 6344
You shouldn't be paying that much. Go to your local council website and use the benefit calculator, don't worry it doesn't want any personal details except your postcode. It will tell you what you're entitled to regarding council tax, that 25% is a generic discount for being single (I think) but you should get Council Tax Support/Reduction (which is a crapshoot depending entirely on how your council has decided to apply it) which has replaced the national Council Tax Benefit.
I just did a test on my own local council website using the details you provided and Council Tax comes out to about £2 a week.
The best advice anyone can give you though is to visit a local benefits advice centre or CAB and discuss the situation with them.
|>>|| No. 6345
>Go to your local council website and use the benefit calculator
Ha ha ha. You have a lot more faith in local councils and their IT teams than mine leads me to believe is sensible.
|>>|| No. 6346
They have a duty to make it work. If they don't, complain.
Just a quick thought - are you getting housing benefit? You must be if you still have a roof over your head. Council Tax S/R is calculated on the same claim form, so someone has cocked up there.
|>>|| No. 6347
I'm the guy who raised the question
Yes, housing benft all ok, just today I have received their award letter plus that shit about council tax.
Yeah, from all it's said here, somebody at the council is taking me for a fool to pay that much. I'll go to calculator as well tomorrow, so I can support my appeal (verbal first).
pic isnt good
|>>|| No. 6348
>They have a duty to make it work.
Says who, and where? (I'm probably not going to complain, but I would be better positioned to do so if I knew this.) My council doesn't have a benefits calculator, much less a working one.
|>>|| No. 6359
Just toddle down to your local town hall and look polite and bewildered. Tell them what you want, and reception will have you in front of someone surprisingly human within about 20 mins. Tell them your story and they will help you.
|>>|| No. 6388
No no, this is the place where councillors go to debate bullshit. Benefitslad wants something along the lines of a 'Contact Centre'; the website of his council will tell him where he needs to go.
|>>|| No. 6446
That was actually ok, in the end i got 100% reduction. It's just the way the letter was written, very very confusing.
Now I'm fighting with the work programme coercions and intimidations. They make me insane with those irrelevant to my job courses.. Try to argue-sanctions will follow. I believe intimidation is not the right tool to help people get back to work but individual plan, otherwise it's just putting everyone in one basket. I'm actually going to see psychiatrist soon.
Anyone on Work Programme?
|>>|| No. 6457
They're not there to help you. They're there to waste your time to make sure you're not working on the sly, harass the living hell out of you to make signing on a very unappealing option, take credit for the job you get yourself, then collect a huge bonus of £16,000 or something.
|>>|| No. 6458
>Take credit for the job
lol, they won't get anything with bullying tactics. The most annoying is that they decided to monopolize all my time.
When I do find a job I just shut down the claim first at JCPlus
|>>|| No. 6463
Is it Vivaldi? I call it the Job Centre song.
Sage for replying to a year old post.
|>>|| No. 6464
I had a test where there was a picture of a man, men, chops and chips, then four boxes with those words spelt out and I had to draw lines indicating which picture corresponded with which word.
|>>|| No. 6466
Ok, guys, I know there are professional anarchists on here who know how.
WP, it's going to be madness, i sense it and my mental health is deteriorating because of stress, intimidation and coercions.
What is that with that ESA? Is being mentally erratic and almost suicidal sufficient to claim? Anyone has a link to more info? What do I tell GP? What kind of letter I need to ask from GP to give it to WP provider? I am going insane, and not only because of that WP..
At the same time I am ok to visit JCP for signing as usual, so it's more between me and WP. JCP are actually alright, depending on the advisor.
|>>|| No. 6467
Seetec said a letter from your doctor saying why you can't do it because of health reasons is acceptable.
The first fortnight of Seetec I had to go in every day at 2pm and stay a few hours. There was this "tutor" who would talk to us about all kinds of digressive random stuff and he was very entertaining but it had no function at all. They're only there to waste your time.
The next month after that I had to go in every Wednesday morning for a "job search" AKA go and pretend to use one of their shitty XP computers because I've already done my real jobsearch at home.
Thereafter, it's the same thing but every second Wednesday.
You've got to bear in mind Seetec and the Job Centre are dying to give you a sanction so I definitely wouldn't trust them to phone in sick. Only don't go if you can't walk.
I'd give the Work Program a whirl before trying to get out of it. They only want to be paid for wasting your time.
|>>|| No. 6468
I can't even claim benefits without being treated like cancer, after paying my taxes for all those years. Seems unfair. I didn't even claim it because I feared the harassment I would face. I lived off my savings and personal loans from friends and family members until I got something. I don't want to pay for things I won't be allowed to use. I hate this country.
|>>|| No. 6469
I am a "professional anarchist" on ESA, first of all you will not get any extra money on ESA any time soon. I have been getting £57.45 a week for a year now without going to an Atos appointment. In theory this goes up after passing the Atos appointment, but that is no help if you don't get one.
You wont get bothered by the JCP on ESA, I get a letter asking for a doctors note every time the last note expires. For me that is once every three months, this is down to your GP though.
Things like being treated by a specialist will help your case. I recommend starting whatever treatment you can before trying to sign on ESA. Ultimately the JCP wants a note from your doctor, who in my case wanted a note from my specialist.
Whenever your doctor, JCP or whatever ask you how you are, say "On a bad day I..." (or similar) so for example if on a bad day you can not get out of bed then that is what matters so tell them.
If going back to work will make your condition worse you should say so, this is important.
There are some good resources to help on disability groups websites, but I recommend looking at ones specific to your illness.
Note: My advice is from signing on a year ago, it may have changed.
|>>|| No. 6470
Thank you for sharing..
I just saw some already doing that at my WP so I guess my punishment is coming.
|>>|| No. 6471
Thank you for the info.
You see, the most annoying thing with WP is that I can't plan anything at all ahead, so if I decide to visit my friends in another town next month and suddenly WP announces the new course, something like that...
And feeling isolated in my small town doesn't help my mental health either.
But yes, it's time to visit the doaktir and start the process. I do feel that the critical mass will be reached pretty soon and who knows how it will manifest itself lol
|>>|| No. 6472
I'd argue you are better off not going for an Assessment.
75% of the time, they'll listen to everything you have to say, acknowlege you have problems, then declare you fit for work anyway.
|>>|| No. 6473
True. You have to research it diligently and the descriptors are things like if you can pick up a phone and take a message then you can work.
|>>|| No. 6474
>I have been getting £57.45 a week for a year now without going to an Atos appointment. In theory this goes up after passing the Atos appointment, but that is no help if you don't get one.
Send a complaint in to Atos by email. The assessment phase is only supposed to last for 13 weeks. When you have your medical if you pass (I hate the way people describe being declared unfit to work as passing a medical) you will be awarded the man phase of £73 a week in addition to the relevant component (e.g. work related @ £30 or support @ £36). They will then take no further action. At this point you need to complain further and inform them that you have a right to backdated pay at the main phase rate in addition to your relevant component from 13 weeks after your award date. If you've been on ESA for a year then that will be about £600 for the main phase which is in addition to either £1170 or £1400 depending on where you are placed. I'm basing these figures on rough guesses (+/- £1) as my book is out of date by a few months. I'm also basing it on a backdating period of 39 weeks.
I should also add that if you get placed in the support group you should also automatically receive the enhanced disability premium which would be £16 x 39 = £630.
What I'm saying is, sort it out. You should also be aware that if you've ever missed a medical, appointment or failed to provide them with evidence etc in the time limits they have applied they will refuse to backdate your claim to the end of the assessment period, and they have every right to do so.
This is also true. However, you can be passed on scrutiny which means that you don't ever need a medical as they award it on your form. To get passed on scrutiny you need to fill in your ESA50 with a lot of rigidity to answering the descriptors without making it look like you're answering the descriptors. The same is true of the assessment however, so if anyone here does have to go for a medical you should read the following descriptors and try to answer the questions that are relevant to you in such a way that there is no ambiguity in your answer, but it doesn't look like you've actually read the descriptors.
One more caveat, if you meet any of the following descriptors (they look the same as the ones above but they're not) then you can instantly be placed in the support group with no further questions.
ESA is the biggest clusterfuck of a benefit anyone has ever seen. Nobody knows how it works.
|>>|| No. 6476
One of the jokes that went around last year was that Atos paid tribute to Thatcher by declaring her fit for work post mortem.
|>>|| No. 6478
>with a lot of rigidity to answering the descriptors
This phrasing irks me enough for me to comment on it, but not enough for me to delete the post and redo it.
Also if you get asked (and you will) "since you put your claim in has your condition got better or worse?" your instinct will be to reply "worse" and tell them why. They will then knock you off ESA and tell you to reapply with the new details because your condition is different. If you answer "better" they will say you no longer require ESA. Tell them it hasn't changed despite your best efforts.
And if you're going for a physical disability, when they say "what actions are you unable to perform?" do not fucking raise your arm above your shoulder and say "I can't raise my arm above my shoulder like this!" You would not believe how many people do this.
|>>|| No. 6479
>do not fucking raise your arm above your shoulder and say "I can't raise my arm above my shoulder like this!"
Christ on a bike.
|>>|| No. 6536
I had to attend a wide ranging interview today because someone had supposedly alleged they'd spotted me at the cinema with my girlfriend and child. I completely understand that living with a partner and child represents a change of circumstances, but I'm not so sure about going to the cinema. Either way, I have neither a child nor a girlfriend. Someone's playing silly buggers.
|>>|| No. 6537
There was something I read recently about large numbers of people not being able to live with (or perhaps marry) their (largely hypothetical) foreign partners for economic reasons. That and being unable to keep your dole money if you start a relationship... Are they trying to curb breeding?
|>>|| No. 6540
I got put on a "Business Admin" course a couple of weeks back, and I can safely say that providers of training for the unemployed must count among the biggest spongers of the government's money.
The course teacher failed to actually teach us today because she claimed to have been suffering hayfever. Truth be told, she wouldn't have taught us anything anyway.
Do any of you have experiences of such courses?
|>>|| No. 6541
A few years ago I was on one of those New Deal courses for two weeks. You know the ones; a fortnight of solid condescension and embarrassment. Had to get a forty minute bus every day there and back.
>this is how you create a CV, this is very important
>this is how you lift a box and put it back down, this is very important
>this is how you put a plaster and a bandage on, this is very important
>we want you to create a slideshow presentation and narrate it for five minutes, this is very important
>we want you to suck a willy, this is very important
The tutors couldn't be arsed, and neither could I quite frankly. Not to mention the other twats that barely showed up and probably ended up having to do the whole thing again. Shower of absolute numpties.
I ended up taking a part time holiday job at bloody Argos just so the Job Shop would fuck off with their shite. I swear to Christ it was like a League of Gentlemen sketch. Fucking bleak.
|>>|| No. 6542
My mum has actually taught some (as a volunteer), I think she made a decent go of it because she was spending a lot of time planning lessons and such.
|>>|| No. 6543
Hey m8s, I need some advice.
So basically I copy and pasted my job search 3 weeks in a row and they discovered it. Now I got sanctioned but the letter doesn't say how long for - it just says my benefits have been stopped, then i got a text saying no further action required.
|>>|| No. 6544
Most obvious bit of advice would be don't do that, you muppet. For a first one it will likely be stopped for four weeks. Ask for a hardship claim form and if granted you get about half the money when it's eventually paid.
|>>|| No. 6545
Well that was silly. Ask if there's a lying course you can go on.
|>>|| No. 6546
>tfw write a great cover letter to go with my CV
>Send it off to apply for a job
>spotted that I have spelt inquiries as enquiries
How much will that cost me?
(A good day to you Sir!)
|>>|| No. 6547
>spotted that I have spelt inquiries as enquiries
Unless you've worked in the legal sector or are a High Court judge, then you almost certainly didn't.
|>>|| No. 6550
Without seeing the letter it's hard to say, but there's a chance that they've just knocked you off benefits. They're not supposed to but mistakes happen. It's worth stopping in to check that you have only been sanctioned and to ask for a hardship form.
As said above you won't get anything for the first 2 weeks, unless you or your partner are classed as vulnerable i.e. you are responsible for a child or qualifying young person, are pregnant, are a carer, get a disability premium, suffer from a chronic medical condition which results in functional capacity being limited or restricted by physical impairment that has lasted or is likely to last at least 26 weeks and your health would decline during the first 2 weeks more than that of a healthy person, are under 18 and eligible for JSA at that age, or are under 21 and have recently left local authority care.
|>>|| No. 6551
Also see about food banks to tide you over, and ring the council to see if they have any crisis funding available.
|>>|| No. 6552
I thought that was a response to the other chap's enquiry/inquiry confusion at first glance.
|>>|| No. 6553
This Business Admin course is 8 weeks, 3 hours a day between Monday and Thursday. I also have to get a 40 minute bus in, but with leaving a whole 2 hours before the stupid thing starts and wait 45 minutes after it finishes to get a bus back due to being unfortunately rurally based.
I got an interview for Monday, and I went to see the dole at 9AM on Thursday to get a travel warrant (to Sheffield) and the woman on the course had a right strop at me for trying to get a job and being 5 minutes late. Fucking joke, she really is like Pauline from tLoG. Oh yeah, I applied for the job using a CV I edited myself, ignoring their stupid suggestions and also wrote a passionate cover letter explaining how I really want to work as a sales admin who speaks to Germans and Russkies in their own languages.
Dole can get fucked if they want to force me to sit the exams for this shitty course if I get it, I aren't going to be complicit in giving any money to a patronising harridan.
|>>|| No. 6564
ESA Assessment later lads.
Wish me luck, I figure I'll need it.
|>>|| No. 6565
Break a leg ladm8. If you're genuine you've got nowt to worry about.
|>>|| No. 6567
Thanks. It's not so much the worry about doing the assessment, in a common sense fair world I'd pass, for lack of a better word. It's the fear of having the money stopped and being completely fucked, with direct debits, bills, rent etc to pay. And of course they don't pay you owt while appealing anymore.
|>>|| No. 6572
There's no need to be worried. If you get knocked off you need to put a JSA claim in the day you get the letter. You should ask for your claim to be backdated to the day of the letter too, they won't do this unless you ask. They might try and tell you that you will have a 3 day waiting period of not being paid for new JSA claims, make sure you tell them that this is false due to the rules of linked claims. If you are due a payment between the date of being knocked off ESA and your first JSA payment you can apply for a short term advance (that's the name today, it changes weekly). To get this you need to ask your adviser in the JCP about it and do about 20 minutes of back and forth until one of you asks for a supervisor, who should know how to do it. The process is now done with a 48 hour callback.
All in all you won't be much worse off if this is your first assessment. If it is you'll just be a few days late.
If you do get told your ESA has been cancelled, put in for a mandatory reconsideration before you apply for JSA. This will then come back saying the same as the decision 9 times out of 10, but after that you can appeal the decision at a tribunal and go back on ESA while waiting for your tribunal. If your appeal fails there is another stage of appeal but we'll cross that bridge if we come to it.
The important things to take away from this are that you can continue to receive ESA during the appeal process but only after the mandatory reconsideration and until the tribunal, and you are entitled to JSA payments from the date your ESA stops up until you receive a reply about your mandatory reconsideration, or further if you would prefer to just stay on JSA during the appeal process.
No need to worry about your housing benefit either, they will cancel it on the day of your letter if you fail the medical as they are notified of negative changes to benefit, but if you go in with the JSA letter they will reinstate and backdate it. Oddly they aren't notified of positive changes to benefit. If you go back on ESA after your mandatory reconsideration you will have to go back and prove that you're back on ESA and again whenever something changes.
|>>|| No. 6573
Cheers lad. But surely if I'm signed off with a sick note from the Docs for 3 months, I cant claim JSA?
Seemed to go aright today, didn't make me move too much, asked a lot of roundabout questions about what do I do in spare time, can I wash my hair etc, but think I managed to navigate well enough.
|>>|| No. 6574
In a normal world common sense would agree with you, but nope. When you put your JSA claim in just say you're fit for work even though you're not. My first thought when I heard this was "isn't that fraud?" but it apparently isn't. I'd love to tell you exactly why but to be honest I didn't understand it when it was explained to me.
Just make sure you keep your sick notes up to date on the ESA side of things even if you go on JSA. I'm not entirely sure how you would go about searching for jobs that you can do if you have a physical disability (is that right?) or the JSA stance on not applying for a job they advise you to apply for if you physically can't do it e.g. kitchen porter with no arms, but I can find out tomorrow if you want more information.
No point in fretting about the wherefores and what ifs at the minute though, if you have a supportive doctor and a decent work history or a genuine disability they are usually very accommodating. Most of the horror stories come from 50 year old career benefit claimants.
I did hear a story about a man who was refused ESA on the grounds that he was fit to work even though he was a political asylum seeker who spoke no English, had one arm and no legs and his only arm didn't work because he was tortured in his home country. I'm convinced some of the lads were having me on, but you never know...
|>>|| No. 6575
Best my Physio can figure is I have Centralized Sensitization.
Put my back out at work a couple of years ago. Was layed up for weeks, yet the pain has remained constant, cant walk without a stick, cant reach up for stuff, anything that outs any pressure on my back causes a whole bunch of pain. But scans show nothing to be physically wrong. Which doesn't help.
|>>|| No. 6576
Personal advisers at the JCP have a sort of understanding with people waiting to go back on ESA, they won't push you too hard as long as neither of you are knobs. From what you're saying though I don't think there's any chance of you being knocked off ESA.
|>>|| No. 6578
Sorry to carry it on but I've only just thought, have you applied for PIP as well?
|>>|| No. 6711
I have got my letter for my ESA appointment, wish me luck lads. Taken them a bloody year.
Anyone know if they accept just birth certificate as ID? I have no prospect of going abroad so I did not spend money to renew my passport.
|>>|| No. 6712
Should be alright, but take a bank letter with you as well.
The good thing about the long wait, is if you should "pass", then you'll get a fat wedge of backpay.
|>>|| No. 6713
They accepted my expired passport and said it's fine as long as they can see it's me.
|>>|| No. 6809
Just got referred to the Work Programme and I can guess it will be a load of old shit, considering I have already been offered a full time job that will be mine in 6-8 weeks anyway and am just claiming so I can actually afford to live until then.
I can fully expect, as I have seen throughout this thread, that the private leeches will be worse than useless for the time I have remaining to claim and probably lean on me with totally irrelevant and extraordinary advice and suggestions (coercions).
I was on an A4e course a number of years back after being laid off, has much changed in the culture of these spectacular wastes of money?
|>>|| No. 6810
They'll probably like you if they can take credit for getting you that job and get a fat bonus.
|>>|| No. 6811
I won't give them the pleasure and simply sign off or get sanctioned if they want to do that, if either of those will work. I shall just say something like the whole procedure is demeaning and patronising.
I'm not paying for some fat leech's next cache of Hennessy when they will have done next to nowt.
|>>|| No. 6813
I'm currently on ESA. I am thinking of starting up a small business shortly, it would be part-time (within the hours permitted by my ESA, and as permitted by my disability). I have received a letter summoning me for the dreaded assessment and I'm worried they'll kick me off. It couldn't be worse timing as I'm also going to be moving across the country soon, the last thing I need is to lose the only income I've got right now through being caught out by some kind of hidden wait to get back on JSA.
Is there anything I can say to postpone the assessment?
|>>|| No. 6815
I take it that they're pretty ruthless in getting their bonus, even if the credit for finding work is nothing to do with them then.
I am certainly not going to enjoy any of this bollocks.
|>>|| No. 6818
Nope. Expect to do very basic common sense courses, be told your CV needs to be done differently by every person you meet, and be threatened with sanction for even the most minor stepping out of line, such as refusing non compulsory voluntary extra courses.
|>>|| No. 6819
>be told your CV needs to be done differently by every person you meet
They all act stunned by how mind-bogglingly bad the previous advisor made it. It's pretty comical.
|>>|| No. 6822
If you've just come off a disability benefit (including ESA) and there's a medical reason you can't work normal 9-5 hours, I think you can get tax credits for working 16 hours including unpaid work when you're self-employed. I think it works out as only about £20 less than JSA so some people only do a few hours and get creative about the number of hours they're claiming. It might be worth looking into if you have a solid idea for a business.
I've just edited that to deactivate the link. I don't suppose HMRC checks where every clicked link comes from but it seemed prudent.
There were cases of work program providers forcing people to make spurious claims of self-employment and go on tax credits.
|>>|| No. 6823
Do you work as a welfare advisor?
I'm just wondering about tax credits for the disabled and housing benefit. A better-off-calculation told me I could get the same money with tax credits doing 10 hours a week. It also looks like housing benefit is highly variable according to your earned income.
I'm sorry about the colour scheme. A black and white printer ate the colours and I tried to colour it in with semi-run-out felt tips.
How does housing benefit deal with variable hours? Do you have to declare it every week or do they take an average?
My weekly hours and minutes have been as follows:
2:20, 4:17, 1:49, 4:32, 3:29, 4:37, 3:44, 4:47, 7:19, 8:11, 7:29, 3:01, 5:55, 4:43, 9:16
Also would they grass you up to tax credits for doing much less than 16?
I emailed them to ask (not about the last bit) but they replied to a completely different question about working less than 16 hours on JSA. I've emailed again and it says they aim to respond in 10 working days.
|>>|| No. 6827
I've done some research on ESA using the links in this thread but I've come away feeling more confused. The links say that work related activity ESA lasts only 1 year but I've been in this group for a while longer, possibly 2 years (with no re-assessments I can recall). I only have a few months left in this group but I can't figure out if this means my ESA claim will end. I've been told I'll go to the job center to be reassessed but I don't know for which benefit. I don't think I could cope with claiming JSA without 'special treatment' which, judging by the general tone of this thread, doesn't seem likely (though part of me is willing to try).
I feel like I'm on the right track in thinking my ESA claim will end and I can re-apply while living on JSA. I don't mind the idea of re-applying for ESA, though its a hassle and quite stressful. I do feel more comfortable now that I've read the descriptors legislation, so thanks to whoever linked that great resource of a website.
How will the claiming of DLA or PIP (I can't remember if mine was switched) affect my JSA claim?
|>>|| No. 6828
If you get DLA you you are automatically entitled to ESA and depending on your rate, you get more ESA money.
Local councils have a Welfare benefits department that can help you, they aren't affiliated with the DWP and give you all the info you need. They'll even fill in the forms for you.
|>>|| No. 6829
They've said I have to declare the hours every week and I didn't get the impression they'd grass on me, although I didn't explicitly ask.
|>>|| No. 6830
I get low rate DLA but when my Income Support claim ended, I didn't fail the ESA medical and was put onto JSA. The tribunal judge agreed my medical condition made me unemployable but said if I showed the Job Centre my letter from the hospital they wouldn't make me apply for jobs (lol). The Job Centre have me playing this game of making deliberately bad applications for jobs I can't do anyway, but it's very precarious, the amount of trouble you can get into for doing that.
|>>|| No. 6846
Just got the call lads, 0 Points. Cunts.
"Despite the assessor noting that you were in pain on the day, she has awarded you 0 points." Jesus Christ, who do these cunts think they are? Gonna need your help advicelad. I know about making a request for Mandatory Reconsideration, but with regard to council tax Benefit, Housing benefit, what so I do now? Scary to suddenly be left with nothing.
|>>|| No. 6847
Follow the advice in >>6572 and then get on the phone to your landlord and ask for a recommendation for a benefits advice centre. A lot of the bigger social landlords fund various charities themselves because in the long run they make more money by having a company who can sort out DWP cock ups when they cut off their tenants' housing benefit. The advice centre will handle your case, from this point on there is a lot of legal wrangling that can only really be done by a local place. The advice centre will request a statement of reasons from the decision maker and look for an error of law, then they will file an appeal listing the descriptors they think you qualify for, this appeal will go to a tribunal where you, a representative from the advice centre and a representative from the DWP will sit in front of a panel. If you don't turn up, you will lose, if the DWP rep doesn't turn up, you've probably won. It is important that you listen to the advice centre rep on the day, some judges and doctors are known for being extremely hard on benefit claimants and some are known for being extremely hard on the DWP. If your rep seems to be looking for any excuse to adjourn your case to come back at a later date with a different panel, do not stand there gawping at the judge saying "no, I'm happy to carry on today."
It's best to get down to the advice centre ASAP and let them deal with it entirely from now on, just sign the things they ask you to sign and give permission for them to speak on the phone. I think I've said this before but often the DWP will sucker you in to talking about the case while you're giving permission, resolve the matter with you and hang up before you put the adviser back on. If that happens just say "I'll just put you back on to x who is handling my case."
If your condition has worsened (e.g. you can now walk less distance than you could when you claimed) or you have a new condition (and you have a doctor's note to prove either of these) you can re-apply for ESA straight away. Still do it through an advice centre though, fool me once...
Out of interest, were any reasons given on specific descriptors? I can't imagine why you didn't get any points for numbers 1 or 2 on the list. Did you read the descriptors before your assessment and tailor your answers suitably? I posted them earlier but here they are again so you don't have to slog through the thread.
|>>|| No. 6848
Waiting on the official paperwork at the moment, was to fucked off on the phone earlier to say much. Will update when it shows up.
|>>|| No. 6882
So if you apply for the reconsideration, then go on JSA, do they switch you back over to ESA as soon as the reconsideration is dealt with?
|>>|| No. 7076
Bunch of useless bloody dickheads.
Applied for income based jsa, had no money for a month, finally get a letter with their decision, and they've decided I'm not entitled to contribution based JSA as have not paid enough insurance. Fucks sake now I'll be on the phone all monday.
|>>|| No. 7078
> Bunch of useless bloody dickheads.
You sound surprised lad.
|>>|| No. 7132
Always deal with the DWP through an advice centre, no matter how trivial. Most places do drop ins, you get a paper trail, expert advice and the advice centre has another successful case on its books when it comes to funding bids.
|>>|| No. 7157
Guys, I'm becoming quite worried I'm going to lose my ESA claim. I'm coming to the end of my 'work related activity' and will have an assessment early next year. My condition has improved since my application but only because I have the time to maintain my well being. I am confident going back to full time work or being on JSA will be bad for me.
I can't figure out if i'm genuine or not. I've been reading through the descriptors but none of them really apply to me anymore. The only way I can think to answer them would be to reply as if I was working again, that is to say reply as if they'd already sent me back to work; as if I'm 'back to square one' applying for ESA again. The thing is, I don't want to lie. I want to talk with the assessor honestly and have them help me. This anxiety counts for something, right?
I don't want to go back to my old mindset. Maybe this is the change I need to stop fighting? I could come out under or on top. I just have to try.
Sage for nothing. Just nothing. Its as if I know I'm dolescum; lazy, but unwilling to admit it. Look at my language for fuck sake; "its as if", there should be no 'as if', it fucking is but its 'as if' I'm trying to convince myself otherwise!
|>>|| No. 7219
How to deal with the Jobcentre pressure if the job offer is below my salary expectations? What is the best line of defence?
|>>|| No. 7222
Negotiate a better offer, obviously. I assume from your choice of words that this isn't a minimum wage McJob. If you don't get anywhere, and you weren't stupid enough to tell them you've had an offer, tell them you didn't get it.
|>>|| No. 7229
McJob indeed sort of.
Just wondering what to say without breaking the JS agreement
|>>|| No. 7231
Unless you have good reasons, they wont give a fuck.
Sanction for not taking an offered job.
|>>|| No. 7234
They'll say at least it pays more than JSA and take the job while you look for a better one because it's easier to get a job when you already have one.
|>>|| No. 7235
I think the Job Centre can phone the employer and ask why you didn't get it.
I overheard someone in the Job Centre getting threatened with a sanction because he'd gone to some recruitment event group interview type of thing and apparently they gave feedback his demeanour wasn't like that of someone who wanted a job and he'd left after lunch. He said it didn't happen that way at all so they said fill out an appeal form.
I'd noticed him before because he seemed markedly well-spoken, articulate and employable.
|>>|| No. 7243
He might be in a state of mental confusion and occasional erratic behavior
|>>|| No. 7290
Just learned the job centre are still paying me ESA two months after explicitly telling them to take me off it.
Because I have no access to a landline at uni I have to trek home to the parent's so I can call their 0845 number. Nothing to worry about or am I about to get done for benefit fraud based on the incompetence of these fools?
|>>|| No. 7292
This. Under no circumstances do DWP do anything wrong ever, unless a tribunal decides otherwise. They make Hyacinth Buckét look positively reasonable.
|>>|| No. 7293
Whatever you do, do NOT spend the money they paid you after your claim has finished. I had to pay back nearly four hundred quid because I found a job, called them to sign off and stop payments but they still kept paying me. Three months later I received a demand for £360 with threats of sending bailiffs round if I don't pay within a certain time.
Now I'm back on ESA and not looking forward to signing off.
|>>|| No. 7294
Even if I provide evidence of me going into the job centre specifically to stop the payments....oh wait of course they'll think it's my fault, I've dealt with the arseholes long enough to know they're nothing but incompetent idiots. I am curious to see what the full consequences will be.
I'll have to be more vigilant in checking my bank account which is fairly difficult as my balance sheet is posted at my parent's house and I have a joint account with my dad leaving me unable to check it online. It works out that they've paid me £810 in total over the course of two months. I'm fine with them taking that back but I don't want to charge "interest" for inconveniencing them. I can easily live off my student loan/grant providing they do not take any more than that.
On the plus side it's made my already high motivation to find a job immediately after leaving uni even higher. 8 years of dealing with the dole dump will do that.
|>>|| No. 7302
> joint account with my dad
That sounds deeply disturbing. You don't have your own current account?
|>>|| No. 7303
Seconded. Get down the bank and sign up for your own account.
|>>|| No. 7353
Set up that account when I was 17 and more or less a useless and lazy piece of shit and have seen no reason to change to my own account. Guess this is as good as any time to change it.
|>>|| No. 7394
Regarding bank accounts, I have two accounts. A saving account in my Mum's control and a normal one that I move money to to buy shit. This sounds horribly teenladish but do I need the approval of my Mum to get control of the savings acct?
I'm 19 if it helps
|>>|| No. 7395
You'll have to kill your mother, cut her heart out, and eat it. You also need to have two persons of impeccable social standing as witnesses. You can just print the form off that they need to sign don't bother with an attorney, it's just pissing your money away, and you can't get at that without mummy's permission, ha ha!
|>>|| No. 7415
In this instance it is okay to sound like a teenlad as are actually a teenlad.
|>>|| No. 7421
Has anyone with an existing claim under the Jobseeker's Agreement regime found themselves encouraged or forced to change the agreement to what they're calling the Claimant Commitment? New claimants fall under CC and Work Programme completers are transferred as a matter of public and official policy. They're trying to force me as a current WP participant to switch over and I feel like I'm being singled out and punished for what they (unfairly and incorrectly) perceive as a lack of job-seeking effort. I can find no mention of this policy online.
CAB were of very little help.
|>>|| No. 7422
My Job Seeker's Agreement got changed to the Claimant Commitment. I got the impression they were doing it to everybody.
The Claimant Commitment just says check Reed, Indeed, Monster and TotalJobs every day and doesn't say how many to actually apply for. In a way it's more lenient but it's more open to interpretation about how many jobs it implies you should go for and different advisors are totally inconsistent about it.
An advisor told me they're not called advisors any more but rather coaches. I got a mental image of him in a tracksuit blowing a whistle at me and stifled a laugh and he looked stung.
|>>|| No. 7426
>The Claimant Commitment strengthens the ability of Jobcentre Plus staff to support claimants back into work at the earliest opportunity
How true. I remember when I was "supported back into work" for a month because my new employer was dragging their feet over a start date. Fortunately (or unfortunately, depending on how you look at it) my start day came soon enough to ruin any chance I had at appealing, so now that's going to sit on my record for at least another 18 months.
|>>|| No. 7427
My difficulties are not entirely dissimilar. My advisor was encouraging me to start volunteering. I have a placement lined up and have had for a good month now. The only thing delaying my start is the Disclosure & Barring Service taking its sweet time. I was also complaining about roadblocks I know my dire WP provider is going to put in place (primarily making frequent but irregular mandatory appointments that are likely to prevent me from making much of a useful commitment). I did this anticipating that I might need her help getting them to see sense, but she perceived me to be making excuses and trying to wriggle out of something I'm genuinely looking forward to. Before I could protest the CC is being foisted upon me and the whole interaction with her and subsequently the manager continued downhill.
I feel like I could successfully contest a number of their actions but I'd sooner avoid the stress engaging the DMA entails. And don't they know it.
|>>|| No. 7565
Is ESAlad around? I have a few quick questions.
I'm applying for the appeal post-mandatory reconsideration. I got 9 points. Do I have a hope in hell of that number going upwards?
They have a section which asks about my "representative". Would it be worth the time to try and get someone from the CAB or whoever to help or is 9 points too low to be worth fucking around with it?
|>>|| No. 7566
I'm not ESAlad but going from 0 points to 15 points is very common so 9 is very promising.
|>>|| No. 7568
Thanks. Is there anything I need to know about the CAB? There isn't one I can visit near me, will my remoteness be an issue?
|>>|| No. 7570
The CAB is run as a confederation of 338 independent regional organisations, so it's a bit of a lottery. Some regions are well funded and offer a very modern and comprehensive service, others are creaking at the seams. Check the CAB website for details of your local bureaux. Being remotely located might be an issue if your case requires follow-up, as you may need to visit more than once.
If you would have a long journey to your nearest CAB, it might be worth searching for independent welfare rights services. Many local authorities run their own services, which might be more convenient for you to access.
The CAB has two distinct kinds of advice workers. The person you'll speak to first will be a gateway assessor, who will establish a case file for you, take the details of your problem and then figure out whether your issue can be dealt with on the spot, or whether you need to be referred to a specialist advisor.
Some bureau offer a telephone advice service that can make specialist referrals over the phone, some only allow you to make an appointment to see a gateway advisor in person and some don't offer appointments at all, working purely on a first-come first-served basis. It's often worth ringing a couple of different bureaux to see what they offer.
My main recommendation would be to get your paperwork in order before you visit. Advice sessions often grind to a halt because the client doesn't have an important bit of paperwork with them, or they have a huge pile of disorganised stuff. It's vital that you bring all the letters you've received regarding your claim. It can be very useful for you to re-read these letters and make some brief notes on the history of your case - when you applied, who you spoke to, when your claim was rejected and so on. The better prepared you are, the more your advisor will be able to help.
|>>|| No. 7571
Your local council will have a welfare benefits department which are seperate from government and exist solely to help you get the benefit you are entitled to. Call them and speak to them about this.
|>>|| No. 7573
Anyone on here who has completed the work programme?
What you are made to do now if you are still unemployed? I know it might depend on the region, some have so-called universal credits.
|>>|| No. 7574
Back to regular fortnightly signing on. Unless of course it's changed since last August.
|>>|| No. 7773
How much they get (outcome payment) per person?
hard to find info. I need it.
Is it split between all of the WP employees?
|>>|| No. 7775
I work a zero hour contract, this week I have done 0 hours, last week I did 25
other staff are telling me I can take my 0 hour wage slip down to the job centre and they will top it up for me, is there any truth to this? sounds too good to be true
no children and I don't own my own home
|>>|| No. 7776
That is fucked, m8. Honestly.
It's worth a try though, what's there to lose?
|>>|| No. 7777
I've already tried ringing around and no one seems to have a clue
I'll walk over to the job centre in half an hour to see what they say
|>>|| No. 7778
You're allowed to get JSA and work under 16 hours but they take all of your earnings off you apart from £5 so you get JSA + £5 whether you work 1 hour or 15. It's a peculiar disincentive to do part time work.
If it's jumping between under and over 16 hours week to week I don't know. You'd have to keep signing on and off again I think and housing benefit gets frozen for about a couple of months every time you do that. Maybe you could get tax credits if you tell them you're averaging over 24 hours a week. Of course you would be in a ton of trouble if they found out otherwise but I'm not sure how diligent they are about checking.
You can probably get help with housing benefit while working if your earnings are low enough.
|>>|| No. 7779
Contact the Welfare Benefits department of you local Social Work. They will help you get anything you are entitled to, they stand separate from the DWP and helped me get DLA and appeal when ATOS tried to put me in the Work Related Activity group for ESA when I was agoraphobic.
Welfare Benefit Department and CAB should be on the banner of this board.
|>>|| No. 7780
>you get JSA + £5 whether you work 1 hour or 15
The whole thing is a massive disincentive to work full stop. Unless you fall in the sweet spot between 21-24 where your maximum disallowance is only 8 hours' wages, it takes 10½ hours to burn down to £5. If you're doing less than this, you're working but not earning money. If you're doing more than this, then you've still got to do all the bollocks box-ticking in return for a whopping £5. If you're (un)lucky enough to have other things going on in your life, maintaining an active JSA claim gives you access to passported benefits, which you lose if you stop your claim, but for young single men there isn't really much in there.
|>>|| No. 7827
A bit of advice from benefitslad if possible.
I'm on ESA and living in a flat with one other person. I've been paying them rent. They are now moving out, and the offer has been given to me by the landlord to take on the tenancy in full, with me subletting to whoever I can find. No agencies or any of that nonsense involved, just me paying him nice and easy.
This sounded great, but looking into it, any rent I take from someone else (after the first £20 a week) counts as income, which presumably fucks both my housing bens and ESA. Is this right?
The alternatives seem to be a joint tenancy, which leaves me extremely nervous about trusting some random from spareroom (and presumably they'd feel the same), and asking the landlord to split the tenancy, which is hassle for him and he may well just kick me out in search of someone who can take the whole place on themselves.
Any advice? If I find someone who can live here on the sly and top up my rent, am I likely to get away with declaring single occupancy and hoping nobody notices? It's not like I'd be earning anything from subletting the place so it doesn't seem particularly immoral.
|>>|| No. 7831
>am I likely to get away with declaring single occupancy and hoping nobody notices?
Possibly not. Increasingly the various people involved are cross checking their data, so eventually someone will cotton on when they notice the credit agencies have two people down at the address.
|>>|| No. 7845
Just put in for Carers allowence. The missus and I were on Joint ESA but I was told we'd be better if I applied for CA because she gets PIP too. The calculator jobby reckons we'll be better off by about £35 a week, but does that affect Housing & council tax benefit?
|>>|| No. 7852
You'd be getting full housing benefit presumably and charging him on top of that, no? That is where you might fall down. If you are getting full housing benefit, just mention that he lives with you. If he works, you'll get half the benefit amount for housing benefit and the lad will have to make up the rest.
Far more appealing than fraud.
|>>|| No. 7895
If I work less than sixteen hours a week and then claim JSA, will I still have to sign on, and attend interviews, and get sent to the Work Programme, and all that bollocks?
|>>|| No. 7896
Before long, even those working part time above 16 hours will be dragged in for interviews etc because they're not looking for proper work hard enough.
|>>|| No. 7897
Were those stories about 18-21 year olds having to do community service for their benefits serious, or was that just political guff to get the OAP's hate-boners up and voting blue?
|>>|| No. 7922
It's been on the agenda for years. In some ways it's a good idea, get people out working and used to a routine, especially younguns. Though if it's taking people away from paid work because somebody will do it for free...
|>>|| No. 7923
>In some ways it's a good idea, get people out working and used to a routine, especially younguns.
I disagree. People want productive work and routine, even young people. I'm not sure where the stereotype comes from that teenagers (or anyone, for that matter, 'dole scroungers' or any other scapegoat you'd care to throw out) just want to arse about with their time, but generally the happiest people I've met are the ones who have learned to dedicate themselves to something; usually starting with music, arts, books, computers, that sort of thing. When you're passionate about something that transferable sense of self-discipline comes naturally. The motivation to then apply yourself to other pursuits comes from learning about the world.
The difference with a programme like that is that we'd be using the stick rather than the carrot with absolutely no financial need for it. We are one of the most secure and wealthy nations in the world, the idea of mandatory unpaid work for our young people out of some kind of 'tough love' philosophy is ludicrous. The mechanisms encouraging and making fulfilling work accessible to young people should already be in place, and I'm suspicious that any attempt to shove them into unpaid work en masse is a pretty thinly-veiled attempt to cover up the fact that they're not.
|>>|| No. 7925
I distinctly remember getting up at half 6 every weekday when I was young to go to school. This talk of routines is daft.
|>>|| No. 7926
You know how in Sim City 4, you'd build one awesome city with all the big skyscrapers and loads of fancy high-tech jobs, lots of high wealth offices and mansions and stuff, but then to offset it you had to have loads of shitty scum towns full of dilapidated slums, pollution and general decay? That's exactly what the UK is like right now.
There are opportunities for our young people, but they are concentrated in one place. This creates both a highly competitive environment for the ones who are in the right place, but for those who aren't, there really are no prospects- The choice is either uproot, leave your family and home behind and essentially gamble 3-5 years of your life on some kind of qualification, or you can plug yourself into the matrix and sell your brain energy for barely above minimum wage in some battery-farm of a call centre. There's too many people and not enough to go around. The little buildings are going grey and no matter how much you fiddle with the sliders or put new railways in, they're showing no signs of coming back.
The young people who don't WANT to work are in a minority, and even then it's just because they were probably raised to believe they are capable of more than what the labour market is offering them and have become disillusioned. I grew up in a fairly rough area and I've only ever met 2 people in my whole life that you could classify as scroungers- One of them was a manipulative bint who keeps popping out sprogs to live off the benefits and conned one of my mates into getting her pregnant. The other one is actually from a rather upper class family, his father was a city councillor, hardly a council estate type, and he was frankly unemployable simply by being a bit of a useless tit. A nice guy and intelligent enough, but mostly incapable of any kind of time-keeping or general common sense.
|>>|| No. 8125
Got a WP thing at Maximus later today, wish me luck fellows.
I hear they are useless as all the other providers in offering next to nothing in terms of qualifications, maybe apart from ones worth less than the paper they're printed on.
|>>|| No. 8126
>popping out sprogs to live off the benefits
How does this work, though? Any benefit you get as a result of having a child (of which I'm only aware of there being one, guess what it's called) is supposed to be spent on the child, right? So by having no other source of income and spending it on yourself you are literally taking out of the mouth of your child, right?
|>>|| No. 8128
Child Benefit is intended to help pay for the increased costs that come with having a family, which is why the first child is worth more. For the purposes of Housing Benefit ands social housing children are entitled to rooms. The tabloid line is that this nets the family bajillions.
|>>|| No. 8129
>Any benefit you get as a result of having a child is supposed to be spent on the child, right?
Not in any meaningful sense, no. Benefits will generally be paid into a single bank account and it is for the recipient to use the funds as they see fit. Mothers have a tendency to be concerned about the welfare of their children, so usually it works out okay without the gestapo overseeing things. There are studies out there looking into how child benefits are spent in reality.
Apart from Child Benefit and Child Tax Credit, there's Income Support available to lone parents of children under 5. Income Support will unlock all the other benefits available to paupers, though Universal Credit will supersede most of these.
|>>|| No. 8130
I love how UC is being touted as the cure to all benefit ills and rammed down our collective throat. I work in CAP administration and we had the same thing with the introduction of the Single Payment Scheme years ago. Unsurprisingly that's being ended and reformed because it was too complex. Of course, its replacement is shaping up to be just as awkward.
|>>|| No. 8131
It went alright lad, cheers for that bit of info (bookmarked to help anybody else who needs). It was a load of shite about why I didn't get previous jobs from a recent flurry of interviews, I had to be diplomatic and not tell them that it's because recruitment agents are either thick, illiterate or both, and that their job descriptions were like fitting a square peg into a round hole when compared with what the actual employers stated, but apportion the blame on me for "lack of experience", 6 years of admin work and pt labouring written off in a stroke. Twats.
|>>|| No. 8132
Apparently they're relying on bribes now and offer you £50 of vouchers if you fill in a form to "help keep their records up to date".
|>>|| No. 8137
Got welfare rights on my side now representing me at my ESA Tribunal and he reckons we should be able to sort it out. Things are looking up.
|>>|| No. 8138
I could have asked on unemploymentmovement but there are competent lads on here as well
For how many months should I shut down my JSA claim not to be back on WP? I got 7 months left, monitored jobsearching, and its waste of time and health.
Say, WP expires in October, if I sign off before that and sign on afresh after, in november?
|>>|| No. 8139
I heard it was three months but I've absolutely no authority to be answering this question so take that for what it's worth.
|>>|| No. 8140
I thin it's 6 months now, otherwise you just get stuck back in the queue wherever you were.
|>>|| No. 8144
As a disabled student living in Scotland, I think I'm the only type of vulnerable benefit claimant that the the Tories can't force into a suicide pact with their minimum wage care workers.
It'll be Greens or perhaps SNP for me. I think the Greens would need it more though, SNP are on a political rampage up here.
|>>|| No. 8145
This site has somewhere in the maze that is this website is a link to graphs of constituencies where the # of benefit claimants outnumber the majority that incumbent Tories have. I've had a few as watching England, so can't find it again. It was enlightening. The graphs included Tory majorities of 4000.
|>>|| No. 8147
Receiving no benefits of any kind and living in a Tory marginal, I'll be voting Conservative.
|>>|| No. 8149
>Receiving no benefits of any kind
Don't tempt fate, lad. Your life could change for the worst in an instant.
|>>|| No. 8153
I know we'll not change your mind, but if you feel like you have the tools to deal with any eventuality yourself, you are either mistaken or just very fortunate.
|>>|| No. 8156
I employ a private protection agency.
|>>|| No. 8158
OK, Ayn. How are you supposed to call an ambulance in your libertarian paradise if your heteral life acquaintance has taken your weakened state as an opportunity to steal your phone for a quick profit? Bupa don't have ambulances, as far as I know, so how would you even get there?
|>>|| No. 8161
Somalia has no individual freedom system or any kind of libertarian society, whiteboi.
|>>|| No. 8164
Sorry, blud. I defer to your superior knowledge of Somalia's vast infrastructure of government and comprehensive functional public services.
|>>|| No. 8165
The thing is, I do have vastly superior knowledge of Somalia's vast infrastructure of government and comprehensive functional services, compared to you.
|>>|| No. 8318
Signed off on Friday because I start work tomorrow, and the person on the phone said they'd notify my work programme provider. Should I ring them up myself or not bother? Would the WP people be able to send their tentacles forth and smear my record if I don't sign documentation with them? This is presumably so they can get some kind of bogus bonus for doing fuck all for me.
|>>|| No. 8319
If you're concerned about them claiming credit and money for getting you a job (which they will), ring them yourself and say you're no longer in receipt of JSA. Decline to answer any questions about having a job. There's a good chance they'll harass you in future at which point you're going to have to tell them not to. You probably fucked up by telling JCP though, who as mentioned will pass the information on. It might not be enough for their purposes; I don't know.
It's possible the WPP will try to have you sanctioned for failing to turn up because their staff and systems are known to useless. Personally I'd not worry about it because your actions while not a JSA claimant are no business of JCP (in both principle and practice) and you have a cast-iron defence for anything they might do.
-Some dude on an anonymous image board.
|>>|| No. 8320
>your actions while not a JSA claimant are no business of JCP (in both principle and practice)
Except when it comes to leaving employment I suppose. What I meant is you're not expected to maintain your JSA claim when you don't have one.
|>>|| No. 8321
Until ARE DWP decides anyone doing part time work and not looking for full time isn't trying hard enough and starts doling out fines.
|>>|| No. 8322
Had a mate who signed off about the same time, same length of claim. Difference is he did 2 voluntary things at schools, had 2 part time jobs and I had nowt for 2 years. Guess who ended up being forced to sign on every day on the grounds of "not trying hard enough"?
|>>|| No. 8323
>Guess who ended up being forced to sign on every day on the grounds of "not trying hard enough"?
You know what? Given how incompetent and arbitrary the DWP can be, I genuinely can't figure it out.
|>>|| No. 8341
Chaplad, the JCP stopped actually giving a fuck about trying to get people work a couple of years ago, now it's just trying to get you sanctioned as fast as possible.
|>>|| No. 8342
This. Welfare's outta control, innit. Got to get that budget down somehow.
|>>|| No. 8382
ESA Tribunal later today lads.
Wish me luck.
|>>|| No. 8384
Huzzah! Gone from 0 points to 18, and in the WRAG.
Thats almost 3 years of waiting to be assessed, waiting for reconsiderations and fucking about appealing over. I could almost cry lads.
|>>|| No. 8385
Good eggs. Big e-hug, because I'm a soppy cunt. I've been through a tribunal and it almost killed me with stress, I ended up sectioned. Did the tribunal add any stipulations about them contacting you in the future? I didn't get contacted for 2 and half years after I won mine.
|>>|| No. 8386
Waiting on the paperwork to find out timelines etc. My rep called with the news a couple of hours afterwards. I honestly expected fuck all because the Dr lass was nice enough, and had great huge fucking tits, but the Tribunal Judge was a miserable old cow who kept calling me out on stuff.
|>>|| No. 8389
What's the fastest way to find out one's national insurance number? I haven't seen the thing in years and it may well have rotted away or been carried off by one of those big moths I used to get.
|>>|| No. 8393
I got so used to seeing my number, presumably on the payslips for my first job, that one day I found without meaning to I had committed it to memory.
|>>|| No. 8394
I memorised it as soon as my card arrived in 1995 and I'd lost the actual card a year later.
|>>|| No. 8545
Work programme is over, what to expect next? Is it true that it will become intolerable after? Anyone on here who went further than WP?
I'll have an interview allright, just want to know what to expect
|>>|| No. 8547
But if it's a small town with no jobs I might be left in peace
|>>|| No. 8548
For me, bear in mind this is a couple of years ago, back to regular signing on. Chance are you now have to do something daft like sign on every day or look for work 24/7.
|>>|| No. 8549
Seems to depend where you are in the country. They might shove you on the intensive action program which is basically a couple of classroom sessions with several hours worth of bullshit "homework", very clearly aimed at mongoloids who can't get a job because their idea of a CV and covering letter consists of a note scrawled on a napkin saying GIZ A JOB LOVE FROM STE X.
Could do with some advice anyway chaps, I've got myself into the sticky situation of having an interview for a job that I don't particularly want, despite having an open offer of a job to start in September. Naturally the jobcentre will want to force me to go anyway even though I'd prefer to just wait and take the other job. Catch is it's a job in the DWP itself so I can't just try blag it and purposely throw the interview or just not go, since they'll no doubt sanction me there and then. The fuck do I do.
|>>|| No. 8550
Make references to how you personally know Ian Duncan Smith to and discus his surreptitious sanction targets etc.
|>>|| No. 8551
I'd be inclined to give it the big one about how claiming benefits has made you realise what a great opportunity there is to improve customer service in the DWP by making sure claimants know their rights, and how you'd be keen to feed into team meetings and to management with a "claimants view" where you notice opportunities to make the system clearer and fairer.
You're bound to be asked questions about prioritising workload and working as part of a team, and you might want to explain that whenever there was any kind of conflict in achieving two tasks you'd refer it in writing to your manager so that they could advise you what was most important, and so that you had an audit trail because you have experience in the past that managers can otherwise misunderstand your workload and expect two tasks to be achieved in the time of one, and actually it's their job to manage workload, not yours, so you're keen for them to have the full picture to make decisions from.
When you're asked about working within a team, maybe you could tell them that you like to be clear about boundaries so that you don't end up doing other peoples' work, and hiding their failings, because that's not good for the team. Instead you would raise anything like that with management, because it's their job to make decisions about allocating work, and you realise they need to know the full picture to make good decisions.
That should make you look like an unmanageable pain in the arse, without saying anything that's actually unreasonable.
|>>|| No. 8553
Oh yeah, and during the "any other questions" at the end, be sure to ask about levels of annual leave and sickness allowance, allowance of paid leave to attend staff support groups/do union work and what opportunities there are for flexible and home working.
|>>|| No. 8554
Graduated, applying for jobs. Is dole advisable? I have £120 of overdraft leleft but I'm currently at home spending a tenner a week on fags and not mch aelse.
|>>|| No. 8555
Go on it mate. Don't be put off by all the negativity attached to it. It is your right.
|>>|| No. 8556
If I was you, I would try and get ESA, go to your GP tell him about it, embelish your story a bit if you have to and ask to get a backdated doctors note. Get the same and sometimes even more than JSA and non of this signing in, job applications bullshit.
|>>|| No. 8558
Yeah, that spare time question. Its to try and catch people out. So say if you have reduced mobility. Because of MFL in school I usually say I play football instinctively to that question.
|>>|| No. 8559
Community work placement.
Treating unemployed like criminals but let's try and turn it into some collateral benefits.
Don't know yet what's gonna be.
(Stop trolling the DSS and get a job)
|>>|| No. 8560
Do as little as possible.
Harass whoever you get placed with about taking you on full time. They wont, but they deserve hassle for essentially freeloading.
|>>|| No. 8561
Of course, lad.
I just realised it's all against the convention of human rights article 4 but who cares about European conventions in the UK anymore lol.
The challenge now is how to get a GOOD placement, not far and cosy. Will post here with more details unless totally demoralised.
Gonna take it like a man anyway
|>>|| No. 8562
I believe the matter went to court, and the judges said no. I could understand small local businesses or charities using them, but there's really no excuse for massive, highly-profitable businesses to be sponging off the state for free labour.
|>>|| No. 8563
Charities might be ok, something not so autistic as supervised jobsearch.. anyways lets see.
|>>|| No. 8564
If you get a charity shop you might be alright as it's a good chance to dig through stuff and have a giggle. Really depends on the people you get placed with.
|>>|| No. 8565
>Gonna take it like a man anyway
My girlfriend got put on a work placement at Home Bargains, she did a week of it and then when her advisor asked why she'd stopped going she basically told them to shove it up their arse because there wasn't going to be a job at the end of it. She didn't get sanctioned or anything.
She's from a family of council estate untermensch though so she probably knows how best to blag the system. I think you do just have to be ballsy with them.
|>>|| No. 8566
When they tailor the community placement to my needs in order to develop professionaly and personally (company) there is nothing too bad. It's for sure better evil than supervised jobsearch in front of the screen for 20 a week. That's what Ive been doing for the last half year on my work programme.
The first meeting thats when we gonna discuss the opportunities. I guess it's important not to sign anything straight away
|>>|| No. 8568
>It's for sure better evil than supervised jobsearch in front of the screen for 20 a week.
|>>|| No. 8573
5 hours a day, 4 days a week, sat in a computer room with 20 other chaps while somebody from the DWP sits and supervises making sure you are constantly jobsearching and not on facebook otherwise you get no money.
|>>|| No. 8575
I remember when I got conned into something similar years ago. They had someone providing a bunch of short courses (12 hours over two weeks) each covering something like CVs, interviews, applications, etc. They insisted that they could only put me on one, and if I needed help with more than one of these I'd have to go on a 15hr/wk thing for a month during which they'd cover the entire lot. What they didn't tell me until I arrived on the first day was that after going through the initial four weeks of learning and assisted job search, I'd have to keep going there for another nine weeks for 15 hours supervised activity. Of course, this was long enough ago where this included time at the computers, looking through newspapers, lists of known employers in certain sectors, telephone directories (no, I'm not kidding - I was made to go through the Business Pages and send out some letters). The one thing that they did do was ensure that we could get everything out. If you were filling in forms, they gave you envelopes and they'd put them in the post for you - on one occasion where I'd discovered a public sector vacancy the day before its closing date, they were willing to send it through by fax.
|>>|| No. 8576
About 5 years ago I was on a similar scheme. I must have sent out a thousand letters to different places over the course of 2 months. I received 3 replies.
|>>|| No. 8577
I think I got about half a dozen rejections. I did get invited for one interview, but it didn't go well. Not least because it was only around halfway through when by chance I flippantly said that those weren't the sort of questions I was expecting for such a junior role that it turned out that they had two jobs going and were interviewing for the other one. That isn't quite as bad as the incident I had during an earlier spell when I turned up at an interview and one of the first things they said was "so, I see from your CV that you've got experience of X", to which I had to answer "and where do you see that then?" The twat at the agency had taken the Word document he'd insisted on and "enhanced" it with a few extra skills which I'd deliberately omitted from the CV on account of not actually having them. That was the last time anyone got my CV as anything other than a PDF or hard copy.
|>>|| No. 8578
>The twat at the agency had taken the Word document he'd insisted on and "enhanced" it
This happens all the time, agents generally have little to no understanding of the jobs they're recruiting for, this sometimes leads to them wasting everyone's time by getting people interviews they're just not suited to, and sometimes ruining someones chance of an interview because they're added in contradictory statements that make no sense. One such example I know of; our company received a CV from an agent, on the agencies letter-head paper and with an identical format to every other CV they gave us, the comments were along the lines of "knows how to use word and excel" and later "no experience of using computers"
>That was the last time anyone got my CV as anything other than a PDF or hard copy.
That might be a good idea and I'll bear it in mind in future, however there's nothing to stop an agent rewriting it completely into their own template.
|>>|| No. 8579
>there's nothing to stop an agent rewriting it completely into their own template.
It is at least much easier to spot when their copy of your CV looks nothing like your CV. Since I've had interviews where my CV didn't even make it to the desk, as a matter of course I ask who and how many I'm facing and bring that number plus one (for me).
|>>|| No. 8593
Ok thats what I got.
Community work placement, charity shop, starting monday.
The question is how to navigate my way out of it without being "fired" for misconduct?
So far what I understand it can be one week here one week there, not just the same place for 6 months
All i need to be left alone for some time before going back to France.
|>>|| No. 8594
Mate charity shops are the best ones. When I did it I ended up sat in a quiet shop with another guy and we just chatted for hours on end and tried to rip off pakis.
|>>|| No. 8595
I agree it's the best of all placements, it's just too many hours, that's all. 10/week+4h jobsearch thats the most reasonable i guess.
|>>|| No. 8596
None, if you want to keep getting your money.
The best thing to do would be to get first dibs on anything good you can make a profit on.
|>>|| No. 8775
Got sanctioned (1 time in 4 years but twice in a row), 2 months altogether lol. Good, cos the second sanction should be 16 weeks, not 4 weeks.
Hardship stuff 60% JSA
No more CWP.
|>>|| No. 9132
Anyone have experience of Universal Credit?
|>>|| No. 9133
I don't even understand what the fuck it is. Because it's a Tory policy I'm trying to see through the smoke and mirrors to see the real reason this is being introduced but I can't find it yet.
|>>|| No. 9137
In theory, UC consolidates six confusing and overly complicated benefit schemes into one simple benefit scheme. It's currently a complete clusterfuck, because the old and new systems are running in parallel.
|>>|| No. 9138
>In theory, UC consolidates six confusing and overly complicated benefit schemes into one simple benefit scheme.
In practice, UC consolidates six confusing and overly complicated benefit schemes into one confusing and overly complicated benefit scheme.
Really, lad. That was an open goal. How could you miss it?
|>>|| No. 9397
Good afternoon chaps and chapettes, I've started getting calls from a Back to Work provider, namely Maximus/Job Company, constantly nagging me to provide my payslips to them as proof that I am still working and, as they claim, for auditing purposes.
I'm just wondering if I am under any compulsion at all to provide such evidence, presumably so they can get their ill-gotten money from the DWP for shoving their fingers up their arses and not really helping anybody find work at all. It's the second time they've rang me in the last 4 weeks, and the last time they rang me was back in November when they promised me that it would be the last time they would ever ring me up.
|>>|| No. 9477
Assuming you didn't sign some sort of contract with them agreeing to supply them with such proof, you definitely have no obligation.
I wouldn't show any company my payslip. I wouldn't even disclose my salary to anyone let alone have them nose through every penny I earn and where it goes.
|>>|| No. 9478
As for tips, just remind them next time they call that you're not willing to supply them with such sensitive information, particularly since (it sounds like) they didn't even help you to get the job you're in.
Alternatively tell them you won the pools and have retired to the Algarve.
|>>|| No. 9776
ARe the pools even a thing nowadays? My Dad used to do Spot the Ball.
|>>|| No. 9777
So when it comes to ESA, are they more lax with the support group than the descriptors would make it seem, or is "oh, and I'm suicidal, I'll probably kill myself if you put me on work related activity" the only ticket for someone who's not completely disabled?
I've a wonderful mish-mash of depression, anxiety and tism, but I'm not suicidal. From every way I read the descriptors that means I'm in the work related activity group because while I've got a nice mix of limitations, none of them are the max score in their category which = no support group.
Which means I'm fucked because there's no way I can do work related activity. I only leave the house for food and the occasional hospital appointment, and even then it's usually hours after I planned to do it or an isolated instance. There's no fucking way I could reliably turn up to work or work related activity (Even if just a weekly meeting), even if my body is physically capable of it.
Am I fucked if I'm honest with them that I'm too fucked to work, but don't want to die?
I haven't even started applying yet and this really puts me off, but actually having some kind of income would be nice.
|>>|| No. 9778
Get help from welfare rights from the first pen on the page of he form, to the decision. Clue yourself up on how the descriptors wok etc. Sometimes saying he same thin in a different way can make the difference between 3 points and 0.
|>>|| No. 9843
I'm working on that
My problem is that from what I read, you need at least a 15 in one descriptor or a serious risk to your mental/physical well-being (what i interpreted as "suicidal") to get put into the support group, otherwise you'll be put in work related activity.
Which leaves me thinking I've managed to fall into a crack where work-related-activity isn't viable, but I don't qualify for support group.
|>>|| No. 9844
You aren't quite correct in thinking that you need 15 points in one descriptor to be placed in the support group. There are actually two separate assessments - the "capability for work assessment" and the "capability for work-related activity assessment". They have subtly different criteria, but they are both based on your functional capability. Being suicidal doesn't necessarily stop you from turning up at work, so it doesn't qualify you for ESA in itself.
You are unlikely to qualify for the support group. If you're capable of applying for ESA and attending the assessment without substantial assistance, you're pretty much automatically deemed capable of taking part in work-related activity. A clever welfare advisor might be able to argue that you qualify, but I wouldn't bet on it.
Consider applying for ESA anyway and having a go at participating in the work-related activity group. I know what it's like to be seriously mentally ill. I was a homeless alcoholic for a substantial period in my youth. Things don't get better with time, you have to actively work towards recovery. Narrowing down your experiences temporarily alleviates your anxiety, but it just makes it worse in the long term. The less you do, the more anxious you feel about doing things. You get trapped in an anxiety-avoidance-anxiety cycle until your life narrows down to nothing. In my case, that nothingness was a dirty sleeping bag and a can of K Cider.
I think you can attend a WRAG meeting regularly. It might be an unpleasant experience, but you won't actually die. Your mind isn't incapable of getting you to that meeting. It's doing what it's supposed to do, which is to convince you to avoid painful stimulus. Unfortunately, it doesn't know the difference between unnecessary pain and pain that is a necessary part of growth. It takes conscious effort to experience that pain willingly.
Your current way of coping clearly isn't working for you. Are you willing to try something different?
|>>|| No. 10015
So I have been turning up to UC meetings and "signing on" (though apparently signing on doesn't exist under UC) for the past 5 weeks and I was due my first payment yesterday which didn't arrive. I rang up the centre and they claimed I was currently ineligible because I haven't proved that I don't have children to them, so they don't know if I'm eligible or not. So why didn't the spacker I've been going to see this last 5 weeks pipe up that something was fucking wrong and my payment will be delayed?
Luckily my zero hours employer has decided to give me a magnificent 8 hours a week while I look for something not totally shit.
|>>|| No. 10020
The general state of Universal Credit makes me rage whenever I hear about it and I've escaped to full time work.
It's a fucking disgrace.
|>>|| No. 10023
It's ridiculous. In this past week I've earnt enough from seasonal work to not be eligible for any payouts at all, which I am fine with, but I will still be forced to attend meetings for no reason other than finding a reason to slap a £50 fine on non-attendance. It's just last month's money when I was absolutely flat broke that I am due now, but they can't seem to get that right.
Talk about "simplifying" the benefits system, it's been a total mess from day one and an expensive one to boot.
|>>|| No. 10026
Universal Credit seems to have done its job of taking six over-complicated incomprehensible benefits and merging them into one over-complicated incomprehensible benefit.
|>>|| No. 10084
The Missus just went for her ESA assessment.
No doubt it'll be a 0 points jobby, a failed mandatory reconsideration and then a 6 month wait for a tribunal date. last time she went from 0 to 18 points.
|>>|| No. 10133
In a completely unexpected turn of events, she's been put right into the support group. Only for 6 months though.
|>>|| No. 10134
That'll just be to see if her condition improves. I have a chronic illness and haven't heard from them in nearly 2 years. I just handed them all my consultant's letters and answered the questions and that was it; silence ever since.
|>>|| No. 10135
I wish they'd just fuck off and leave her be. It's been a real hell for her since the day the form came through and a big relief today, albeit tinged with the fear of having to go through it all again so soon.
|>>|| No. 10411
What does 'change of condition' actually mean?
I've been claiming ESA for roughly 4 years and my day to day life has become easier as a result, significantly so over the past 2 years since I've adjusted my worldview. All in all I am much better now than when I applied for ESA.
What I don't understand is if my condition has changed, and therefore need to re-apply/assess for benefit. Every time a review (or whatever the terminology is) come up I feel very guilty and have to justify my claim.
I feel it is the support of ESA that allows me to live a reasonably stable life, without which I would soon fall back into the shit I once was (I have actually experienced this, its not just an idea).
For the most part I've found honesty the best policy when talking with ESA staff, but with each note they take regarding my comments my confidence fails and I wonder if I'm digging myself deeper into a hole, if I'm sending myself back to the start were I'd consider desperate options.
I want to say this to during my meetings but I'm too scared, should it affect my benefit.
|>>|| No. 10426
If you want to stay on ESA, NEVER EVER mention anything about feeling better. Do not assume an assessor to have common sense or sympathy.
|>>|| No. 10427
From the sounds of it, you are coping better with your condition now but your condition itself hasn't changed. If this is correct, then don't say that your condition has improved to the ESA staff.
|>>|| No. 10462
Universal Credit is bloody brilliant, innit. Been getting a stonking great penny a month since May and now I don't even get to live off such generous largesse now my pay has gone up and I'm more or less full time again (seasonal work). Still get made to go in every fortnight at the expense of my own time and bus fare, even though I'm working at least 25 hour weeks (much of it overtime for unsociable hours) and there is absolutely no remuneration for upholding my end of the bargain.
I can't just "quit" because "it doesn't work like that" and apparently signing on doesn't exist anymore, so signing off is also not an option.
I can understand the idea behind it, but you get suckered into having someone having a detailed nosey at your income, earnings, your schedule etc. way past you're reaping any kind of benefit.
|>>|| No. 10468
Not long fella and they'll be threatening you if you dont hammer away looking for a job with more hours.
|>>|| No. 10474
An interesting development. I rang up the centre and asked to close my claim and they did within minites. So much for all the coercion and what turned out to be hollow threats.
|>>|| No. 10793
I rang up and signed off universal credit in September. Got paid in November , thought great, they must just be paying my remaining money for the last month. But I've just been paid £500 as of today. I even worked the entire last month. Although having said that a few days ago I sent in a claim for UC , although I haven't received an interview date or any contact whatsoever. Is this for my new claim? It can't be can it? Or is this some error on behalf of my old?
|>>|| No. 10794
I was also on sanction 'pay' for the last few months. Could they be totting up the -50% Pay I was on and giving it to me?
|>>|| No. 11084
This is a huge thread so I'm not sure if it's been covered before, did a quick ctrl+f but found nothing. I've recently gotten back into the country and was away for sometime. I'm a UK citizen but now I'm looking for work again and I have a sign on date for Monday, they have however just called me asking if I can come in early to fill out some other forms since I was out of the country for a while. All I can seem to find on Google is something about a habitual residency test and also a news article about a bunch of people not being able to sign on for 3 months after being out of the country.
Anyone know any more about this or been through it? Am I fucked for 3 months? Obviously I'm still going to look for work on my own and already am, but it's slim pickings around here as it is.
|>>|| No. 11160
So I don't know if anyone was paying attention to this but I just got several letters through (Why not just one?) saying that I'm not entitled to Jobseekers Allowance because "the law says we cannot pay you". Which law? Don't know. Why? No idea. Apparently I have to get on their asses to actually get an explanation. Luckily I have some savings and family to stay with, otherwise I'd be out on the streets.
|>>|| No. 11161
If you were working outside the EEA, you can be declared "Not Habitually Resident"; you will not be entitled to claim benefits until you have been habitually resident in the EEA for at least 90 days. If you were working outside the UK but within the EEA, you will be entitled to benefits immediately (Swaddling v. Adjudication Officer).
If you were working within the EEA, you should appeal, giving evidence of where you were working. Assuming you are otherwise entitled to benefits, you should receive JSA backdated to your original claim date. If you were working outside the EEA, you should probably still appeal, although you might be on a sticky wicket.
|>>|| No. 11171
Just don't expect council housing lad.
Trust I, don't even bother applying for 6 months. And then expect to be told to fuck off.
|>>|| No. 11261
Got my Universal Credit interview on Thursday, I'm going to break my vow of never returning to the job centre.
|>>|| No. 11263
Expect no money for 2 months and then irregular ever changing amounts afterwards.
|>>|| No. 11264
I left my last job so I'm already expecting no money for a while, Only really going on it so I have proof I was doing something inbetween the gap of unemployment.
I wouldn't have signed on at all otherwise, I hardly need CV writing lessons or to be locked in a room with a bunch of chavs and made to look at jobsites for a few hours.
|>>|| No. 11265
I'm in a job club! 3 days a week for a month I'm expected to attend a 1 hour session with a bunch of mouth breathers on how to write CV's, apply for jobs and other bullshit I already know how to do.
Some daft bint wants to talk to me about how the YMCA can help me too, I agreed to talk to her and next thing I know I'm being told to signed all kinds of shit.
|>>|| No. 11267
Maybe, The last time I signed on was 7 years ago and back then I was an unexperienced herbert so I was expecting to be treated like one.
I've been going from job to job moving up for the past few years and I know all the do's and dont's, how to write a CV, how to dress for Interviews and how to deal with them, all that stuff. So when I'm told I'm going to have to waste my time with stuff I already know it's understandable why I'll become cuntish.
I know they're only trying to help but I'm hardly some tracksuit wearing chav stinking of booze unwilling to look for work. As said I'm only really on it so I have a record I was doing something, I'm not going to be jumping through all their hoops this time.
|>>|| No. 11275
Because no one will believe the answer to life the universe and everything even if I told them.
|>>|| No. 11585
Had a PIP payment out of the blue of £1600.
Turns out the reassessment I had months ago has put me in the Standard Daily and Enchanced Mobility, instead of just Standard Daily and no Mobility.
The system works sometimes.
|>>|| No. 11587
I need to pay off my plasma screen from Brighthouse and I'm buying us all a takeaway as a treat.
|>>|| No. 11589
Don't make fun of the lad. He's not necessarily retarded just because he receives PIP.
|>>|| No. 11605
I've landed myself a part time job for 15 hours a week due to start in the next 2 weeks. I'm on universal credit so I'm guessing I'm still going to be on a leash with the job centre.
Are they going to make me look for work for 20 hours a week now rather than the usual 35? Do I still have to jump through all the hoops or will they remove some hoops now I've got some income?
|>>|| No. 11607
You don't have to pretend to us it takes even an hour a fortnight to produce the evidence the Jobcentre asks for.
|>>|| No. 11623
They can track your job applications through the system so they'll know if you're on it every day and what you searched for and applied for
|>>|| No. 11626
Got to spend millions on stalker tech to catch those benefit cheats who've roont ARE country, mate. However much money it takes to stop them leeching money from the system... Wait.
|>>|| No. 11631
Yes, but then you get pestered every week begging for access and they want dated printouts of applications etc.
|>>|| No. 11655
I'm going to lose my job soon, and I've looked to the local councils universal credit helpline for an estimation. It turns out I am eligible for £10 a week, because my girlfriend earns 17k. Now my girlfriend is by no means someone I am going to have support me, principles aside it is simply impossible, she can't afford to do that. I mentioned to the lady this and she said there's nothing they can do. I asked if it would be different if I told her she was just a friend, and she just said "well is she on the tenacy agreement?" which of course she is, and left it at that.
My question is this: 1) How can they quantify a girlfriend as a partner when there is no legal basis for what that even means?
2) If I submit an application under "No partners", and class her simply as my friend, is this benefit fraud?
3) Could they use that phonecall I just made as evidence?
|>>|| No. 11656
On the turn2us website, if I class her as simply a joint-tenant I am entitled to £900 odd a month apparently.
|>>|| No. 11657
In cases where there's a man and a woman of similar age living together and claiming joint tenancy, the council will sometimes send someone around to see if they're a couple (theoretically this applies to any pairs of joint tenants, but I doubt many gay couples ever get hassled). If you have two bedrooms and one is a double bed while the other's full of boxes and a spare mattress then they aren't going to be fooled. They'll expect to see two totally separate bedrooms that are obviously in individual use.
If they do start paying you and then find you out later they'll certainly send you a bill to recover however much they've given you during that period (it's on you to tell them if your circumstances change, i.e. you becoming a couple. "We became boyfriend and girlfriend last month, honest" likely won't wash - I'd expect them to ask for the full amount). Don't know if there's a fine on top.
|>>|| No. 11661
Wouldn't the council have to get permission from a court in order to have the right to enter the property to check this?
|>>|| No. 11662
No, they just come around. Same deal with social workers; they can poke around and ask to come in and you can refuse, but if you refuse them entry they will escalate the case, and that involves the police etc. and a court order eventually. Since they are in the position of power, fucking with them like this won't end well.
In >>11655's case the council might also consider refusal to enter as circumstantial evidence of being a couple and refuse to accept joint tenancy status until you let them in. Basically, you have to play by their rules if you want benefits.
|>>|| No. 11663
Any of you ladchaps know anything about Bennys and Compo payments?
|>>|| No. 11664
>the council might also consider refusal to enter as circumstantial evidence of being a couple
Do you know for a fact that that is legal?
|>>|| No. 11672
I'm on the verge of ending my decade-long unemployment spell but if my employer can't grease the wheels and make a formal offer before Universal Credit comes in next month I'm gonna lose out. And if they offer me fewer hours it just gets worse. Thanks for helping me into work Theresa.
|>>|| No. 11673
I cant see UC ever making it completely out of the blocks. Way too much uproar over it nowadays. Even the Tory Rags are slamming it.
|>>|| No. 11787
Haven't been paid "muh dole" for tomorrow, guess it's time to argue on the phone.
|>>|| No. 12229
I've been disabled for the last couple of years, something I'm working on resolving, but I sometimes wonder how the DWP even functions.
They just called me, off their own back I didn't call them, to tell me that since fucking October I have been getting £75 a week LESS than I should have been (despite me questioning the amount at the time and informing them I thought it was a mistake) and they're chucking me an arrears payment of over £1200. How does a mistake that glaring go unnoticed for so long and who even noticed that it was wrong? Do they periodically assess claims? Bizarre.
|>>|| No. 12230
My deadbeat dad briefly worked for the DHSS back in the early 70s. Nobody bothered to tell him what his job entailed, he was just shown to a desk with a massive pile of forms on it. After fruitlessly spending all day trying to find out what he was supposed to do with these forms, he just shoved them down the back of the desk and went home. Next day, new pile of forms, same routine. He quit after three weeks, because he had run out of places to hide the forms.
I imagine that little has changed at the DWP, except the pile of forms is now a massive Excel spreadsheet that takes nine minutes to load and crashes whenever you try and scroll right.
|>>|| No. 12231
I've long fantasized that we could sack every single person who works for the DWP, bring in a universal income, and still save money in the long run. Useless cunts the lot of them.
|>>|| No. 12516
Unfortunately that would require the admin costs to be 110x higher than they currently are.
|>>|| No. 12756
ESA Decision came back today.
Gone from Support group to 0 points for anything.
Another DWP Miracle cure! For fucks sake.
|>>|| No. 12757
How on earth?
Please tell me you didn't go to the interview alone? You did, didn't you? Appeal it. Assuming you had doctors evidence, they shouldn't have a leg to stand on. Not having a corroborating witness is fucking naive, at best, though mate.
|>>|| No. 12759
Nope, was with the missus.
I'm waiting on their report now to see how big the lies are and how many times they can contradict themselves on each page.
I swear it's DWP Policy to kick you off every time just to catch out the people who don't fight it.
|>>|| No. 12760
Is your missus a qualified advocate or health care professional? Did she take notes? I took my support worker and a folder full of consultant/GP letters with me, he took notes while I recorded it (you aren't obligated to tell them you're recording, if you do they'll terminate the interview though) which I told them after we had finished and I was leaving and I got a very reticent letter saying I wouldn't need to go back for an assessment for 3 years.
I hope you get it sorted, the tribunal aren't affiliated with DWP. 60%+ of appeals are successful, which is a shocking margin of error. You could forgive 5% for human error, but 60% is an agenda.
|>>|| No. 12761
We took what little evidence we could dig up, the GP's have essentially given up and left me to tramadoll and diazepam, refusing to put me forward for any more scans etc.
had the same issue when first applied for ESA in 2012, no points, placed in WRAG at appeal, then moved to support next time round.
Thing is, i'm waiting on the result of my PIP review at the moment too. I can see that being knocked on the head too.
At the moment we still have that and carers allowance coming in, plus Child Benefit & Child Tax Credit for the lad, though being knocked off ESA has taken his free childcare hours away, but if they take the PIP that takes the money, the carers allowance, the motability car and generally any hope of a credible day to day life.
|>>|| No. 12773
A recording made with your Iphone or similar equipment has no legal value, since the file could be tampered with. I am due for an assessment on day 15 and I am quite worried, my condition is permanent but I have been on ESA for two years. I fear that those assholes will declare me "fit to work" and hope that I croak for an heart attack the moment I receive the letter. I am switching to UC, I hope that they do not fuck me over. I cannot lift anything bigger than a cup of tea and I cannot walk more than 100 meters.
Strangely, my first assessment involved no medical exam. I just brought my extensive medical documentation, chatted a bit with an assessor, got my blood pressure checked and went on my way. Were you medically examined by the assessor?
|>>|| No. 12774
>A recording made with your Iphone or similar equipment has no legal value
Does that matter outside of court? They might not know that anyway.
|>>|| No. 12775
It's just the DWP being awkward cunts. It's not hard to prove the integrity of a digital audio recording; the DWP have just made a set of rules that are superficially reasonable, but a pain in the arse for most people to comply with. How many ESA claimants have the facilities to make a recording directly to cassette or CD and then provide two copies immediately?
|>>|| No. 12776
It's standard practice in cyber forensic. No court would accept a piece of evidence that could have been tampered with. The usual procedure is:
A) Take the recording
B) Put it through a cryptographic MD5 hash function.
C) Give a copy of the hash value to the person that has been recorded.
D) Bring a copy of the recording to the lab and study it.
This way, you cannot even modify a single bit of the recording without the hash value changing. Any change in the hash value invalidates the piece of evidence.
|>>|| No. 12780
MD5 isn't secure, as people have found ways to modify inputs to give the same output.
|>>|| No. 12783
No problem, if I stay 2 days without taking 'prol and 'mide I am unable to walk 20 meters without gasping for air.
|>>|| No. 13283
How long is a "month's notice"?
Is it 28 days/4 weeks or if I hand my notice in on the 5th, I'm expected to be there till the 5th the next month?
|>>|| No. 13285
Write the date you want to leave on your notice as 28 days from the day you hand it in. Let them argue if they want to.
|>>|| No. 13287
Most likely a working month, so four weeks. If they meant a calendar month everyone would just wait until February to quit.
|>>|| No. 13324
I think I've slipped through the cracks of the Universal credit system. Still got the income but I've not had to go in for a meeting in months and no sanctions. Surprising incompetence really. During the time it's been going on I've landed a full time job in a new city, starting in the new year, not sure if I should contact them and tell them about it now or wait until I start. JC+ did nothing to help me look anyway they just kept tabs on me while I did. Are there any pitfalls of telling them? I mean, I broke the contract by not posting 15 job applications on their journal every week, but I landed a job anyway, so surely that evens us out...
|>>|| No. 13325
Man, they don't give a shit, just tell them. They can mark it up as a win on their system.
|>>|| No. 13336
Difficult here. They might demand cash back for breaking your contract. I suppose you could just tell them you want to end the claim for personal reasons without informing them of the job, but.. things might get complicated here.
|>>|| No. 13338
That money is earmarked for the poorest in our society. You have a moral duty not to claim it if you're self-sufficient.
|>>|| No. 13507
This is a bit ridiculous isn't it? Penalising people with degrees.
Is it worth just lying on my CV and saying I don't have a degree? Anyway they can find out? What would be the best way to do it?
|>>|| No. 13508
Is it an apprenticeship or vocational scheme? In which case they only get funding for providing education to people who don't already have it.
|>>|| No. 13509
Would you turn up at a food bank and lie when your cupboards at home were full?
|>>|| No. 13510
I don't think it is ridiculous when their stated mission is to help people without degrees - why should you jump the queue when you've already had that opportunity?
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