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>> No. 3840 Anonymous
19th September 2013
Thursday 10:03 pm
3840 Pensions
The OFT have come out and said that many old (i.e. set up before 2001) pension schemes have high charges and offer savers poor value for money. They've also suggested a cap for auto-enrolment schemes, but it's going to be an almost meaningless gesture as you'd be very hard pressed to find a provider offering auto-enrolment terms with annual management charges greater than 1% anyway.


The pension scheme I'm in at work (contribution: 5% employer, 5% employee gross) has management charges of 0.6%, which I'm alright with as it's less than I'd get if I was investing in collectives through an ISA.

However, I've put the charges and contribution details into Invidion's pension calculator for an idea of what I'd get when I'm 65, 40 years from now, and if my salary increases in line with National Average Earnings and I took the 25% tax-free lump sum I'd be looking at a pension in today's terms of 27.5% of my current salary. If I wanted a pension that would be about two-thirds of what I'm earning now then I'll need to contribute, assuming the employer contribution stays at 5%, 15% gross (12% net) of my salary every year for the next four decades. This does depend on what annuity rates will be like then and I'd also be getting the State Pension, as long as they haven't upped the age you receive it to 80 by then.

If it wasn't for the tax relief and my employer matching my contributions then I doubt I'd bother and I'd look into other ways to support myself while I'm in retirement. What about you lads? What are your thoughts on pensions? In my opinion to have any form of decent retirement income you're at the mercy of your employer offering a good pension scheme.
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>> No. 7284 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 2:02 am
7284 spacer

Well the Timpson's bloke isn't going to prison for cutting my works safe key, so I'm sure I'll be fine. There doesn't seem to be any law against cutting a key from a photograph, indeed the only proof Timpson's has that you have legal access to a lock is that you walk in holding a key, which isn't particularly solid evidence, really.

As long as you followed similar policies to locksmiths (i.e not copying security keys) then I honestly don't think it'd be a problem. It's probably a shitty business idea for many reasons, but I don't think it'd be operating against the law in any way.

Look for Keey in your app store soon.
>> No. 7285 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 2:06 am
7285 spacer

Thinking about it, the USP (and ultimate downfall once it's hacked) could be the database of keys registered to users. If someone else uploads your key, it could flag that up for you. Then the sensible thing to do for everyone who owns a key is to get my app and use it.

Again, it's a terrible idea but I bet someone would pay me for it.
>> No. 7286 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 2:29 am
7286 spacer
>which isn't particularly solid evidence, really
It's evidence of physical access. Your average person doesn't tend to have keys on their ring that they've never used. Gaining physical possession of a key takes effort. Just ask the guys that reversed the TSA keys without ever coming into possession of them.
>> No. 7287 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 2:48 am
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>It's evidence of physical access.

That's just saying we should reward the burglars that put the work in.

In this system you'd have to be delivered the copied key, so at least there'd be a paper trail to the bloke who cloned your key, or at least far more potential of one than going to a Timpsons.

I will take my seed capital now please.
>> No. 7288 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 2:51 am
7288 spacer

Fuck me, it already exists and there's infrastructure in place.

>> No. 7289 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 7:46 am
7289 spacer

Old fashioned key cutting is on the way out anyway (at least when it comes to your front door key.)

In recent years, burglars have twigged onto just how easy a traditional euro-cylinder lock is easy to break into. From methods such as simply snapping the front of the lock off with a pair of pliers, to using a bump key which will open perhaps 50% of the doors on any one street in seconds.

Locks made to new standards are much harder to cut, the proper way needs a CNC Machine and perhaps some special tooling, and the manufacturers will only be distributing blanks to certain locksmiths.
Some manufacturers are also setting up their own key registration schemes, so you can only get a new key cut if you can remember the answer to the security questions you set.

>> No. 7290 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 10:55 am
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>Some manufacturers are also setting up their own key registration schemes, so you can only get a new key cut if you can remember the answer to the security questions you set.

That feels like the equivalent of using your mother's maiden name to generate encryption keys.
>> No. 7291 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 12:34 pm
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>What was the name of the street you grew up on?
>> No. 7292 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 12:42 pm
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Pensions? You lads have got little interest in discussing them. Where Timpsons may branch out into next and what the future holds for the business of cutting keys? That's certainly got the juices flowing.

Never change, lads. Seriously.
>> No. 7293 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 12:42 pm
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Key control has been around since the beginning of locksmithing and has been the norm for decades in high-security locks. Most domestic users will probably stick with normal pin tumbler locks, since they were never much more than a deterrent even before bump keying and cylinder snapping.

Even if everyone abandons the conventional pin-tumbler lock in favour of high security locks, it won't be a major problem for a company like Timpsons. The little independent key cutters might be driven out of business, but Timpsons have the scale to do some amount of specialist key-cutting in store and the logistics to provide controlled keys from either the manufacturer or a central cutting facility.

Ultion's "encrypted security algorithm" is bollocks - you can duplicate their keys on a perfectly ordinary cutting machine with dimple capability. The cheap manual machines won't do it, but any machine capable of cutting car keys will also cut Ultion keys. Their website makes a lot of noise about using "genuine Ultion keys" because they know that third-party blanks are readily available from normal distributors.


With the possible exception of EVVA MCS keys, there isn't a key on the market that's genuinely difficult to duplicate. The real protection for keys comes from the legal system. If your key uses a patented technology, you can sue anyone who sells blanks or cut keys without your permission. That's no impediment to a black bag team or a serious criminal gang who have access to a bent locksmith, but it does stop casual abuse of key management such as an employee taking a bunch of shop keys down to Timpsons during their lunch break.

The industry really does respect key patents, because The problem is that a patent only lasts for 20 years, at which point you lose key control - either you replace all your locks, or you accept the risk of key duplication. Only a handful of manufacturers go to the effort of inventing new, patentable key technologies on a regular basis and only a small minority of customers care.

The really secure key control systems are hybrid electromechanical systems like Abloy CLIQ. These keys work like a car key, with both mechanical features and an embedded security chip. These keys can be remotely disabled - if you lose one of your keys, you can invalidate that particular key without having to re-key the tumblers and replace all the keys. You can program keys so that they only work at a particular time of day, or make a temporary key that disables itself automatically after a certain time period. Copying the mechanical aspect of the key is useless unless you can also break into the key management server and authorise the electronic part of the key into the system.

>> No. 7294 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 1:21 pm
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Yeah but its actually a discussion about which companies are doing well on the high street, who is next to be subsumed by Amazon, that is very relevant to our pension interests (particularly as some ladm8s will have worked in some of these places).
>> No. 7295 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 1:59 pm
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House of Fraser.

The clothes are overpriced unless there's a sale on. The range of what they offer is fairly poor. The stores are starting to look dated and the layout needs an overhaul; if I want a coat then I want to look in a specific place of the shop dedicated to coats, I don't want to have to go looking around the shop one brand at a time. The staff are very snooty and up themselves.

They've issued profit warnings and been trying to negotiate lower rents with their landlords; they used to own many of the buildings the stores were located in but sold them off for a quick profit that's biting them in the arse over the long-term. It's only a matter of time before they're gone.
>> No. 7296 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 2:21 pm
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Couldn't agree more - I last went into one about three years ago - in Slough - could not figure out for the life of me what the store was about or who its customers were. Shitty brands, badly organised as you say and a weird mix of products.
>> No. 7297 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 3:57 pm
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I think you all just need to invest in my brilliant ideas. One day I'll come up with one that isn't already an established business and we'll all be minted.
>> No. 7298 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 4:43 pm
7298 spacer
I've been working on this thing where you post pictures and all your friends can comment on them and say they like them. Get on board and there's tens, even hundreds of thousands to be made.
>> No. 7299 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 5:16 pm
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>They've issued profit warnings and been trying to negotiate lower rents with their landlords
1849-2018 RIP
>> No. 7300 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 7:52 pm
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I think we'd have more chance with a .gs lottery pool lad, sorry.
>> No. 7301 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 8:22 pm
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Forget him, I've got a better plan, but it needs numbers to take on the big guys. Refer two friends and I'll double your money.
>> No. 7302 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 8:44 pm
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That was one of my other ideas. I'm a bleeding edge thinker.

Next up, Avon and team Spot the Ball.
>> No. 7303 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 11:04 pm
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>Spot the Ball

I don't know why I think this, but thats the sort of thing you think we would be brilliant at.

Do people still do the football pools? As a kid I remember the man knocking the door every Friday evening. Years later my grandfather sold his house to a man who had "won the pools".
>> No. 7304 Anonymous
4th March 2018
Sunday 11:51 pm
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> Avon

For a brief millisecond, I once considered paying for the site through affiliate tags on links posted, which is much the same model as Avon, but thought it underhand.

This is why I will never, ever be a millionaire.
>> No. 7305 Anonymous
5th March 2018
Monday 5:02 am
7305 spacer

I remember my grandad used to do the pools, and the big, important one was Littlewoods Pools so god knows what happened to that.

I saw my dad had entered a spot the ball on twitter about a week ago, to win a new phone or something. Wasn't expecting that, he normally just tweets about the IRA.


I remember being very impressed back in the early days when you made it clear you never wanted to run ads here. It's probably the main reason I settled in here as I did.

Saying that I think that's the one way you could have done it without annoying anybody. It's essentially unintrusive, and only really underhand if you're not upfront about it.

I have a schoolfriend who made a fuck tonne on SEO and affiliate farming back in the mid 2000's when the algorithms were much easier to game. I never knew how much he truly made because he was also selling a PDF about how to make megabux fast, so I have to assume he was inflating his earnings a fair amount for that. Nonetheless he bought his own house at 20 so he didn't do terribly.

I was very jealous at the time but now I'm older and grumpier, I can't imagine a more soul sucking way to make a living, even if he was able to 'work from home or anywhere in the world!' as his blog would say.
>> No. 7337 Anonymous
28th May 2018
Monday 10:09 am
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>They're maintaining the same level of profit off declining sales, through ripping people off, particularly from their monopoly at places like train stations.

WH Smith has been voted the worst retailer on the UK High Street in a survey of more than 10,000 consumers.

Customers complained the shops were out-of-date, products were expensive and staff were rude in the survey by consumer group Which?

>> No. 7375 Anonymous
14th August 2018
Tuesday 7:09 am
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>A TV advertising campaign to warn the public about pension scams is being launched by UK regulators as new figures show that victims are losing an average of £91,000 each.

>The Financial Conduct Authority (FCA) and the Pensions Regulator have joined forces on the campaign to raise awareness of the most common tactics used by fraudsters. They said victims of such scams – which typically begin with an unsolicited phone call or email – can end up losing their life savings and people are being urged to be on their guard.

>Pension scams often involve people being persuaded to transfer or cash in their pension pots and put the money into often exotic-sounding investments. They have been around for many years but there has been a surge in activity since April 2015 when the government introduced reforms giving over-55s more freedom in terms of what they can do with their retirement cash.


I might be missing something here, but why doesn't the FCA simply ban you from being able to hold unregulated investments in a pension? If the majority of scams are people being convinced to invest in unregulated investments like storage units or car parking spaces then the blindly obvious answers seems to stop them from being permitted investments.
>> No. 7376 Anonymous
14th August 2018
Tuesday 6:34 pm
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It's almost as if the "pension freedom" was an obviously risky idea from the start.
>> No. 7377 Anonymous
14th August 2018
Tuesday 6:57 pm
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WH Smith's most profitable arm is the expensive one that fucks around in trains stations and airports. They'll leave the high street altogether soon enough.
>> No. 7378 Anonymous
14th August 2018
Tuesday 7:19 pm
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Pension scams were already an issue before the freedoms happened. The FCA's investigation into the freedoms has found that people are actually more likely to be overly cautious and do things such as taking their tax-free cash account for no real reason and stick it in their bank account because they feel compelled that they should be doing something.

>> No. 7387 Anonymous
2nd October 2018
Tuesday 6:46 pm
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Life savings shot down in pensions ‘Wild West’

Savers are losing hundreds of thousands of pounds after being abandoned to a “Wild West” of pension rules that exposes them to unscrupulous financial advisers. An investigation by Money today reveals how advisers exploit a toxic combination of outdated laws and loopholes to lure investors into high-risk products that leave them unprotected when the bets turn bad.

The investors find they cannot claim full compensation if the products were mis-sold — while advisers who have complaints against them upheld can set up new businesses and operate as before.

The findings come as record sums are transferred out of pension schemes using freedoms introduced in 2015. Latest figures show that almost £19bn was moved out of pension schemes in the first six months of this year, after a record £34.2bn was transferred last year. In 2014, just £5.4bn was moved out. Concerns are growing that many savers may be shifting their money into high-risk or even unauthorised investments.

Money’s investigation into pension transfers reveals:

● About 4,300 pension savers, equivalent to 18 people a day, are being forced to seek help from the Financial Services Compensation Scheme (FSCS)

● More than three savers a day are receiving the maximum £50,000 payout from the FSCS

● About 1,500 investors had complaints about mis-sold pensions kicked out by the ombudsman because they did not report the problem early enough

● Claims for pension mis-selling hit a record £150m last year and were already at £108m by the end of last month.

The rules for complaints and compensation for mis-sold pensions were not changed in 2015 — posing problems for people who transfer pensions using a financial adviser. Savers can make a claim against an adviser through the Financial Ombudsman Service (FOS), which can award up to £150,000 plus interest — but only if the firm has not shut down. If the firm has closed or gone bust, any compensation claim for mis-selling gets passed to the FSCS. In 2015, the scheme had 2,840 claims. It has already had 4,300 this year, of which 865 were for the maximum sum.

Meanwhile, the financial adviser against whom the claim was awarded can just set up a new firm under a different name — a process known as phoenixing.

In one case, reported in March, two friends lost a total of more than £650,000 of their retirement pots but got just £50,000 each from the FSCS. In another case, reported the month before, a couple lost £400,000 and were again left with £50,000 each. In both cases, the advisers closed their businesses, only to reopen new ones.

>> No. 7390 Anonymous
23rd October 2018
Tuesday 6:00 pm
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Women under the age of 35 on average have more saved in a pension than men.


Watch out, lads. We're sleepwalking in to women taking over.
>> No. 7391 Anonymous
23rd October 2018
Tuesday 6:01 pm
7391 spacer

Men die younger, so it probably evens out in the end.
>> No. 7394 Anonymous
23rd October 2018
Tuesday 8:09 pm
7394 spacer
Women have traditionally had much lower pension savings than men, which historically has been because they've been planning to rely on their husbands in retirement, they've taken career breaks to care for kids or they simply have been less interested in pensions than men.

We're now seeing evidence that young women are saving more in pensions than young men. The trend is reversing. There's also evidence that female graduates are less likely to be unemployed than male graduates and that young women generally earn more than young men, about up to the point they start having kids. Give it twenty or thirty years and we'll be living in the matriarchy. Gemma from HR is silently and slowly bringing about the revolution.
>> No. 7398 Anonymous
24th October 2018
Wednesday 3:16 pm
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Oh the times, they are a-changing.
>> No. 7399 Anonymous
24th October 2018
Wednesday 7:49 pm
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>what women think a transistor looks like
>> No. 7400 Anonymous
24th October 2018
Wednesday 9:37 pm
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I can only imagine you're talking about the content of this song.
>> No. 7421 Anonymous
6th November 2018
Tuesday 5:45 pm
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Happy State Pension Equality Day, lads.
>> No. 7453 Anonymous
17th February 2019
Sunday 8:09 am
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Pension contribution hike to hit pay packets

Millions of workers could see their take-home pay fall in six weeks' time when the amount they have to pay into their pension pot increases.


I don't get why the media are constantly framing things like auto-enrolment as a negative thing. It's as if they want to put people off saving for a pension .
>> No. 7455 Anonymous
17th February 2019
Sunday 8:34 am
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Because the auto-enrolment rules are incredibly restrictive thanks to the all or nothing approach. Can't afford 5%, tough, you've got to keep paying it or opt out entirely.

It will also have the unintended consequence of killing off a lot of the choice and competition in the pensions sector; employees will no longer be looking for their own pensions because they'll miss out on the employer contribution. And employers themselves will shy away from a lot of the schemes and just opt for some off-the-shelf scheme from a big fund that will promise to deal with all the employers legal obligations.
>> No. 7456 Anonymous
17th February 2019
Sunday 8:52 am
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>employees will no longer be looking for their own pensions because they'll miss out on the employer contribution

Anyone savvy enough to set up their own pension will go for a DIY SIPP which will have very low charges anyway; the large insurance companies have always offered terrible charges for individual plans and offered discounts to employers who will send a fair bit of money their way and that would have been the case regardless.

>employers themselves will shy away from a lot of the schemes and just opt for some off-the-shelf scheme from a big fund that will promise to deal with all the employers legal obligations

The only employers not shopping around and instead opting for a master trust like NEST or the People's Pension are the employers who wouldn't have offered their staff a pension scheme until they were forced to by auto-enrolment anyway.
>> No. 7457 Anonymous
17th February 2019
Sunday 9:03 am
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I'm leaving my job soon and have a pension scheme with them. When I join my new job, can the new employers just garnish my salary and pay into my old scheme? Or do I have to transfer the funds from my old scheme to my new scheme?
>> No. 7458 Anonymous
17th February 2019
Sunday 9:11 am
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You don't have to do anything with your old pension. You can keep it where it is, transfer it into your new employer's scheme or transfer it to a completely different provider elsewhere.

You could ask your new employer if they'd pay into your existing plan but very few will. If you want to consider transferring your pension then it's an idea to look at the charges for each scheme, look at the performance between the fund you're invested in now against the performance of the fund you'd be invested in for the new scheme and to also ask the new provider if they offer discounted charges for transfers in as some do.
>> No. 7459 Anonymous
17th February 2019
Sunday 9:48 am
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Are these the schemes that have been rinsing people by diverting "investments" and leaving the holders with zero return?
>> No. 7460 Anonymous
17th February 2019
Sunday 9:54 am
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Yes and no. They are Self Invested Personal Pensions, with the clue in the name.

They can be used by scammers to advise people invest in unregulated investments - the likes of storage pods, car parking spaces, hotels in Cape Verde and nonexistent forests with the promise of sky high returns - so you now hear adverts on the radio about seeking compensation if you've ever held one nowPPI is drying up for ambulance chasers.

However, the overwhelming majority of people with a SIPP use them to invest in regulated collective investment funds, direct commercial property or direct shares.
>> No. 7461 Anonymous
17th February 2019
Sunday 10:44 am
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I'm not sure why this is being painted as a bad thing as the other anon said.

Some people may lose out slightly on the maximisation of benefits of their choice and be slightly worse off but as a whole it means that people who would otherwise never save for a pension won't even notice it.

The amount of people I know not paying into a pension or anything because 'they will worry about it later' or think 'something will work out' is staggering.

I am generally shocked at the attitude to saving by most people I meet though, they just don't get why you'd do it.
>> No. 7462 Anonymous
17th February 2019
Sunday 3:00 pm
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What he said - a SIPP just means that you can choose what investment funds your money is going into. People getting scammed out of their entire pensions is a completely different thing.

>I am generally shocked at the attitude to saving by most people I meet though, they just don't get why you'd do it.

I'm generally shit with money, but have paid into my pensions since my mid-twenties and will probably be able to retire in my mid-fifties. Everyone should try and get their heads around it, its free money, mostly, and very good for you.
>> No. 7463 Anonymous
17th February 2019
Sunday 3:37 pm
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People in this country in general have shockingly low levels of financial literacy. They're never really taught it, pensions are quite boring and most headlines around it are negative so they aren't inclined to pay much attention to it.
>> No. 7483 Anonymous
11th March 2019
Monday 10:23 am
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>You could ask your new employer if they'd pay into your existing plan but very few will
Is that because they have bespoke deals with pension providers?

Cuurently my plan has a net transfer value of ~£3K. Ignoring charges what would you do?
>> No. 7484 Anonymous
11th March 2019
Monday 10:42 am
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Employers just prefer for everyone to pay into the same scheme because it's less hassle for them.

The average workplace pension is typically cheaper than the average individual plan because insurers will offer employers discounts if it means a lot of money will be coming their way, assuming the employer is savvy enough to be aware of this and to shop around. If an individual wants a cheap pension outside of the workplace then they're better off using a platform, also known as a fund supermarket, rather than your traditional insurer unless they've got a fair bit of money to play with.
>> No. 7486 Anonymous
11th March 2019
Monday 9:11 pm
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Vanguard keep promising to release a very cheap pension where you can invest into their funds. It has been a long time coming, though.
>> No. 7487 Anonymous
11th March 2019
Monday 10:19 pm
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Vanguard seem overhyped to me. Fair enough if you're nearing retirement so you're better off with an equity & bond fund, but if you're younger then their pure equity funds aren't anything special so you might as well take more risk. It's letting the tail wag the dog.
>> No. 7491 Anonymous
18th March 2019
Monday 12:20 pm
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Click Anonymous.

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