>>51150

The Decline in action. This is why I know ITZ COMING. Idiocracy was more a prophecy than a comedy, although a happy upbeat censored version of the grim reality ahead. Expect a steady degeneration in both the individual and society as time goes on. Eventually the huge inertia push we've been coasting on will run out. Eventually it will get to the stage people will struggle to simply maintain what they inherited. Then the final collapse and mass deaths as babies become "the other white meat". That's assuming they don't simply wipe themselves out with a neat NBC solution before then.

I hope someone will blame it on mass immigration.

>>51153
Overcrowding in classrooms as a consequence of immigration and resources being spent on pupils who don't have English as a first language won't have helped, but not enough to have a significant impact.

Many people my age are unable to conjugate verbs. It's hardly surprising that a system that wants to bring everyone down to the lowest common denominator, where children are taught to pass tests that are continually dumbed down by competing exam boards instead of actually engaging their brains and thinking critically and the government solution has been to throw money at it instead of putting any real strategy in place has been a complete clusterfuck.

The real cause world wide is the dilution of the neo-hybridisation gene in modern homo sapiens. Soon the melonhead's project will come back under their control after spiralling wildly and wonderfully outwards and free for some time.

>>51154

>where children are taught to pass tests

That is the nub of the problem. It's not that the tests are dumbed down, etc., rather that the education system is geared to pass tests. Not to educated people. If they knew the exact questions to be used that year they wouldn't even teach you anything beyond memorising parrot-fashion the key answers. You'd learn those, get a bit of paper and think yourself clever, but forget it all within a couple of months after the exam and have done nothing to improve your mind or capabilities in the long term.

>>51155
>the education system is geared to pass tests. Not to educated people.

I'm guessing you participated in the study.. Thicko.

>>51155

>It's not that the tests are dumbed down, etc., rather that the education system is geared to pass tests.

That wouldn't be a problem if the tests were any good.

Nobody complains that driving instructors are only teaching people how to pass their driving test, because we broadly accept that the driving test is a good measure of driving ability. Teaching to the test is only a problem when you're testing for the wrong things.

The problem at present is that we have multiple exam boards, who compete with each other to sign up schools for their particular exams. The schools are highly motivated to improve their exam results, so in turn the exam boards are motivated to dumb-down their exams. Lots of people have a strong incentive to dole out good results to bad candidates, but few are strongly motivated to prevent the devaluation of exams. It's a classic tragedy of the commons. There are many ways of fixing this situation, some of which have already been implemented, some of which are simply politically untenable.

Things are generally getting better under Gove, but most people within and without the system don't see it that way. GCSE grades fell last year for the first time in two decades, because of stricter marking of exams. Great news for the integrity of the GCSE system, bad news for the teaching unions, who rely on being able to argue "Of course teachers are good at their jobs, exam results get better every year".

There are no greats today. The system is not geared to allow them.

>>51156

Dry your eyes, m8.

>>51159
I know you want to make her see how much this pain hurts.

>>51157
>That wouldn't be a problem if the tests were any good.
Except that isn't the case, and you well know it. The only consequence of a "better" test would be that schools would teach people to pass the "better" test.

>>51159

I'm not crying m9.

I enjoy how everyone believes they were successfully educated but everyone younger is clearly just a thicko trained to pass a test. Sometimes I'm amazed that so many people haven't realise this and decided to get off the roundabout, It's a cycle that has been happening probably before and during Mr Butler deciding to give us all a decent education.

Being 22nd is completely meaningless if the other countries are all first world countries and are improving as we are. A better bench mark would be a study based on historical improvement. But the rags know doom and gloom sells better then cheery so there we are.

>>51158
There are plenty. Mythologising and thorough examination of legacies doesn't tend to take place until after the fact. In 50 years the 2010s will be the good old days and senile cunts will insist that the world's gone to hell in a handcart whether it has or not.

>>51163
I passed my gcses 5 years ago and I was most definitely trained for the test.

>>51161

So what? If the test requires a deep and rounded understanding of the subject, then the only way to 'cheat' by teaching to the test is to impart a deep and rounded knowledge of the subject. The problem is that our current exams generally test whether you have memorised the 'right' answer rather than whether you have the skill to perform a specified task.

Take English Lit, for example. Currently, students are required to comment on a selection of texts, most of which they have previously studied in their Anthology. The inevitable result is that students are coached to memorise suitable talking points. What happens if the students are presented with a completely fresh selection of unfamiliar tests for each exam? The only way to teach to that test is to teach your students how to read and understand any text, which is the whole bloody goal of the English Lit syllabus.

In mathematics, students are presented with problems in a very fixed and predictable format, which allows them to memorise a formula and plug in the values without really understanding the mathematical principles that underly it ("plug and chug" to use the jargon). It's easy to knock that on the head completely, by presenting questions where the correct method isn't immediately obvious. Students who have memorised a method without understanding it are incapable of identifying applications for that method without prompting in all but the most trivial of cases.

None of this is hypothetical. The International Baccalaureate Diploma is taught widely and uses examination methods that make exam prep and memorisation ineffective. They test for skills, not knowledge. It's not a hard problem to solve, it's just that most people in the system don't want to solve it at all. The exam boards are paid by the schools, the schools want high grades, so the exam boards provide what they're paid for - soft exams that are easy to teach to. Pay a bit more and they'll tell teachers how to cheat.

https://www.youtube.com/v/cGOAEV-GBCo
https://www.youtube.com/v/8wttS-MMxnA

>>51163
>Being 22nd is completely meaningless if the other countries are all first world countries and are improving as we are. A better bench mark would be a study based on historical improvement.

Im guessing you didn't read the OP where it clearly says we're the only nation going backwards and also that young people are no more literate or numerate than 55-65 year olds.

I have a son (6) and it doesn't fill me with confidence when I see work on display in the corridors at his school with errors from the teaching staff on them (such as 'ankel' on a diagram of the body) or when his teacher writes 'your doing really well!' in his reading log. I'd say at least half of the people I know who have gone into teaching are complete thickos who shouldn't be anywhere near a classroom.

>>51167

Everyone I know who is doing a PGCE this year was hardly a stellar intelligence. Is better teachers the answer, lads?

>>51167

I've been through training with these people for a good while and in the process got to know many teachers or future teachers. So many of them were thick as fuck and the rest low to average at best (and quite a few only capable of functioning in their narrow area of focus or rote memory and hopelessly out of depth beyond it). I have no idea what has happened to the standards in this area, but obviously they don't have much to choose from nowadays. It can't possibly be the pay and benefits as they are exeptional for the low requirements and they have plenty candidates trying to get in, more than positions available. The only reasonable conclusion is that these idiots really are the cream of the crop and those destined to try and raise the next crop. Depressing.

>>51172
>the only reasonable conclusion is that these idiots really are the cream of the crop
Or that they are being selected with other priorities, such as their ability to engage with and control children.

https://www.youtube.com/v/w84BDXVL7UI

>>51173

More likely because they blend in with the children. They can barely control their bowel movements. Don't be such a twat.

I blame immigration tbh.

Congratulations >>51153.

>>51175
>More likely because they blend in with the children

It boiled my piss when the teachers tried to be down with the kids, mainly because that meant being lenient with the loveable rogues to the detriment of those who actually wanted to learn. Then again, I was a swot.

>>51179
I had a teacher, a 21st Century teacher, who once barked at a classmate to sit up straight. I still can't quite believe it today.

>>51181
Run! Run in the corridors!

Teachers can be engaging and informative. Honestly all it takes is a personality hovering slightly above the low end of the autistic spectrum and the most basic interest in your subject. Not being a permanently miserable prick is bonus.

The science department was primo in my school. Full of charismatic and interesting teachers. And one 50 something woman that constantly looked like she was a bit pissed. Not at all surprisingly I got straight B's in my three sciences. Hey! That's not bad coming from a school with a 17% pass rate.

>>51182

Ha! Love that film.

>>51181
They should have probably asked nicely, but pupils should definitely be reminded to sit straight.

>>51183

I think you're the first person I've spoken to who knows of it.

>>51187

It's a great film. I first saw just the final scene or two when I was about 11 after sneaking into my dads room to watch TV. Probably had a worryingly significant impact on my future opinions and actions with regards to authority.

And for that one person who might be thinking "what the hell are they talking about?!", the film is if...., from 1968. Malcolm McDowell's first feature.

>>51183
My science teachers at school were completely uninspiring and turned me off the subject. Thinking about it, apart from one maths teacher they were all average at best.

One day we had a substitute teacher and he was absolutely brilliant. He was taking us for history and decided to teach us about the Charge of the Light Brigade, although we didn't know this until after he had pushed over his desk, stormed out of the room and then charged back in, shouting and pretending to be on horseback.

>>51184
Alright there Captain Hardcastle. Who gives a toss what position they sit in, as long as they're listening?

>>51192
It will eventually fuck up your spine. It's that simple.

>>51193
Right, well thank fuck for Mr Walcott telling us not to slouch for a single period each week, because the rest of our lives don't count, eh?

>>51194
Well, that's how schools work. You learn stuff there and try to use it in your everyday life. In that case the lesson was don't slouch or your spine is fucked. You should have taken this seriously.

>>51188

The ending is probably the most glorious things someone of our(?) generation could have watched as a child. The semi-imaginary sex sequence wasn't bad to see either.

>>51195
No, if it were knowledge designed to be imparted it would have been on the curriculum and the lesson plan. I don't know what kind of military school you went to where they taught you by screaming orders at you.

And my spine is just fine, old man.

>>51197
>And my spine is just fine, old man.
That's what you think.

>>51197
It might be now. The test will be when you're 60-90.

http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance/the_thirdworld_squat

Skip to 'where you come from matters'. A lot of people in the West are set up for serious strength problems in later life due to our sedentary, slouched lifestyle.

>>51199
*Strength and spinal problems

So when is the penny going to drop that we should be doing a lot more to help the chances of our younger generation?

Who am I kidding, it never is, we're just going to sit around blaming "kids these days" for being such lazy bastards until we're a bankrupt, third world shithole like Greece.

>>51202
What's the point in going to the effort of improving education standards over the long-term when you can import better skilled workers from overseas right now?

There'll need to be a docile underclass to work as cleaners and in care homes to wipe the arses of all the Polish doctors and businessmen when they retire. The well off will still be alright, mind.

>>51199

Not the guy you are replying to but just wanted to say thanks for the link. Really interesting.

I remember watching some Youtube video about how squatting prevents many rectal problems as well.

>>51202
help doesn't mean chucking money at them

public funds are so top heavy... How much government spending is dedicated to oldies do you think? Half?

>>51165
I passed my GCSE's a decade ago and I was definitely taught to pass a test in some, if not all, of my subjects. It was more of a memory test then actually trying to make you think critically.

Then again, my degree wasn't much different. Weeks of lecturers repeating slides verbatim followed by a final session where they'd cover their arses and tell you what questions would be in the exam.

>>51206
>GCSE's
It's a wonder you passed any GCSEs with such atrocious grammar.

>>51207
More like it proves the point of how easy they are to pass.

>>51205

Fucking baby boomer generation.

I remember all my mates bitching about some A-level exam and how it was "unfair" and how the stuff they learned wasn't even on the test and how everyone got to do a nice easy one after that.

And then I looked and the test would have been easy for anyone who actually understood the concept instead of just fact bytes.

>>51426
Was it one of the sciences? When I was at college, 7 years ago, I remember a few people moaning that the biology/chemistry exams were too hard and they'd got Ds and Es when they'd got As and A*s at GCSE.

>>51150

The reason this is happening is the shift from English centric education to making sure the immigrants get more funding to understand our language. It has fuck all to do with people being smarter or less educated than previous generations but more to do with the fact that every foreign speaking student is given extra funding which is from the same pool as the British funding.

That means if you have 10 kids all in a class with a budget of £100 for the class but 3 of those students require £30 a head for translators and extra tutors from the state, the other 7 are left sharing 1/10th the budget. That is why African and Asian students from immigrant families are now doing better than ever but natives are progressively getting worse. It has fuck all to do with the nationality of the student and instead has everything to do with foreigners getting 3-4 times the funding that their British counterparts would get.

The only way to end this system would be to simply force schools to have zero tolerance policies on non english speaking people. The Independant and the Guardian had a similar article on the same subject with white boys being lower scoring than their African and Asian counterparts at a GCSE level.

>>51466

So, how are those Adult Learning courses going, lad?

>>51466
The Pupil Premium (which is what I think you're referring to) goes to any kid who has been registered for free school meals now or in the past 6 years; 'Looked After Children'; and - notably - children of ARE BRAVE BOIYS in the armed services. So nothing to do with speekin forrin.

>>51473
I don't think he's on about funding. I think he's saying that extra resources need to be spent on non-native pupils with poor English and they're benefiting from this one-to-one tuition, to the detriment of the rest of the class.

>>51475

I know you are not him, but I would dearly love to see: A) actual examples of this happening on a mass scale, including where whites are excluded from basic language catch up, and B) budget numbers. Because he really comes across as a dribling bellend. But hey, what do I know. I only know 4 teachers, I am sure he knows many more.

>>51476
>including where whites are excluded from basic language catch up

Oh, I know that's not happening. At my son's primary school (he's in Year 2) they have dedicated sessions for the shy kids and ones in speech therapy in order to help them develop.

>>51475
OK, so considering the extra resources issue - I know of various 'catch up' and 'acceleration' schemes, and they are targeted at ALL kids whose language skills are below national expectations. So that means any kid who isn't exposed to speaking, reading and writing correct English at home, which means quite a lot of white English kids from deprived areas, as well as the more obvious ones who don't speak English at home.

I've been a teacher for just over a year now, so my experience is still limited; but living and working in areas with high non-English ethnicities I've yet to see any kid - white, black or brown - given special treatment on account of their ethnicity. It is only on their specific individual needs.

This is all the result of the promotion of materialism and the feminization of the education system so as relational subjects are more emphasized than the hard sciences and mathematics.

>>51948
I agree. We should start goose stepping.

>>51949
Godwin's Law. Looks as if you lost your chance to provide a counter-argument before you could even mount one.

Good going.

(A good day to you Sir!)

>>51950
I couldn't be bothered any more. I mean you drop in all the /pol/ buzzwords—materialism, feminisation (with a Z), comparing STEM to liberal arts, etc. I give you a 4/10. It needs more subtly.

>>51951
Also, don't forget the reaction images. I might just report you.

>>51952

Nobody likes a grass.

>>51952
Well maybe I'll report you for faggotry.

>>51953
I like grass.

>>51954
You are silly. Did you learn how to goose step yet?

>>51955
I love grass.

The UK is falling behind global rivals in international tests taken by 15-year-olds, failing to make the top 20 in maths, reading and science.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-25187997

I read a decent article the other day saying that maybe, just maybe, we should stop undermining teachers by saying what a shit job they're doing and telling kids that they're thick as pig shit.

>>52186

The teachers ARE terrible though. Massively overpaid for the little work and poor efforts they put in. It is more insular and self-serving than MPs or the police. When a teacher screws up big time it's a luxury fast track gravy train to early retirement for "health" reasons.

>>52187
Must resist ... urge ... to mark ...

>>52188

Don't give us it, m8. You lot don't do anything when there's a sniff of a holiday or you aren't getting extra money. You go on strike more often than the fucking French.

>>52189
Since you asked so nicely, 2/10 SEE ME

>>52187

I went to a comprehensive in South Wales and they were without question my worst years. It was chaos. The experiences you had came down to numbers, how many you had in your class, how willing teachers were to push you over a C grade level. Some were genuinely unpleasant people, others were doing the best with what they had.

If I had to approach the problem, it would be a total overhaul. Nothing about our current system of standardised testing makes much sense. Groups of people are arbitrarily stuck together. In all of my time there I don't remember a single passionate word uttered about a subject, a wise word said about the future, or a caring word offered to a student. The exception was maybe one assembly to commemorate a girl who had taken her own life.

The entire thing made me ambivalent about teachers, but certainly shattered any faith I may have had in our institutions.

>>52191
>The experiences you had came down to numbers
I've heard they don't teach eight in Welsh schools and just use nine instead.

>>52191
>Nothing about our current system of standardised testing makes much sense.
It's high time this was acknowledged - it leads to shit teaching, shit teachers, and poor international results. Nothing short of a complete overhaul is going to fix it.

I've heard very sensible proposals for changing the system to levels of ability and education based, rather than simply age based. There was a TED talk on this that was worth watching, it should come up if you look on youtube. Teachers would probably welcome a serious overhaul aimed at educating people properly rather than passing tests and hitting marks for statistics and political reasons.

The function of schools is to inculcate obedience and discourage independent thought. It conditions children to hate books and learning. Children are learning machines, and in an information age, have to be strongly discouraged from this, otherwise they'd be a threat to the talentless hacks that run the country.

From this perspective, schools are doing a spectacular job. It's not enough to say there needs to be change- the hierarchical nature of society needs to be overthrown.

>>52226
I can't believe for all those years of school education we still experience steady progress in almost every area. It's almost as if you were absolutely wrong, anarchylad.

>>52230

Not him, but are you being fucking serious? I'm off to bed, but have sources a-go-go on this one.

40% of new teachers leave the profession within 5 years. Looks like it's a mix of kids being unruly shits who demand 'respect', poor training and too much dross only deciding to become teachers because they think it will be an easy ride/they're not fit to do anything else.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-25749480

>>52761
Right. Poor pay for the time they work and generally low morale when contrasted with other avenues of employment couldn't possibly be a factor though. Let's blame those shithead kids and those lazy cunt teachers.

Are you a Tory voter, by any chance?

>>52762
>Poor pay for the time they work

That's a myth. True the average working week during term time for a teacher is 50 hours, but they only work 39 weeks a year so it averages out at 37.5 hours a week.

>>527637
Funny how your figure is actually over the limit set by the 1998 Working Time Regulations act.

http://www.atl.org.uk/help-and-advice/workload-and-hours/working-hours.asp

Do you honestly think that teachers just go on holiday as soon as the kids break up, put their feet up and the marking, lesson planning and training plus other administrative work does itself? Oh, you.

>>52764
>Do you honestly think that teachers just go on holiday as soon as the kids break up, put their feet up and the marking, lesson planning and training plus other administrative work does itself? Oh, you.

No, I look at the facts instead, which is what my previous post was based upon:-

The Teacher's Workload Diary survey, which was last carried out by the Department of Education in 2010, showed that the average secondary school teacher worked about fifty hours a week during term time.

http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2013/apr/23/who-works-most-teachers-or-mps

You also seem to be overlooking PPA time - all of the teachers I know get at least one afternoon a week during timetabled teaching hours set aside for marking and preparation. They complain that they work long hours during term time, but they also acknowledge that the time off makes up for it.

>>52765
>all of the teachers I know get at least one afternoon a week during timetabled teaching hours set aside for marking and preparation
I can see that working at secondary level, but how would you do that in primary, where pupils have the same teacher all week?

>>52766
It's a statutory requirement that 10% of a teacher's timetabled teaching time is set aside for PPA. This is purely anecdotal, but there's seems to be a lot more emphasis on teaching assistants in primary schools nowadays.

>£15.44 for primary school teachers
That's £31k a year, not a bad wage.

>>52767
TAs are not normally allowed to teach unsupervised, even during their teacher's PPA time. Source: a frustrated registered teacher working as a TA.

>>52768
No, it's £22k a year.

>>52770
Are they not paid for holidays?

>>52770>>52772
The starting salary for a teacher is just under £22k (or up to just over £27k in London). That Graun link has the average salary as £31k for a primary school teacher and just under £37k for a secondary school teacher.

>>52772
Depends on what you mean by "paid". Permanent teachers are paid a monthly salary based on a 39-week year, which is used to work out the hourly rate.

>>52774

39 hours? The way most teachers I've spoken to tell it they work 7-7 every day, thanks to the ceaseless workload of "marking". In my opinion it serves them right for giving kids so much work, it only comes back to bite them in the arse it seems.

>>52911
Scroll up a little:-

>True the average working week during term time for a teacher is 50 hours, but they only work 39 weeks a year so it averages out at 37.5 hours a week.

Also >>52774 said "39-week year", nothing about hours.

I don't know anyone could raise kids in the UK unless they can afford private school. It seems immoral.

>>52943

I went to a Grammar school. It was nice.

>>52965
Grammar schools seem alright, too bad they no longer exist in most places.

After what happened in Leeds last week there's been a couple of primary school kids putting bleach in their teacher's drink, some lasses in Wales excluded for plotting to kill their teacher and a couple of lasses arrested in Manchester for bringing a knife in to school.

Is killing your teacher going to be the new in 'thing' or is it just they're being reported more often in light of recent events?

>>54877

Because the sheeple reacted so emotionally strongly to the Leeds woman and all bought the Sun or whatever, they're now focusing on such stories and sensationalising them as much as possible. The bleach story was ridiculous, the Mirror was making the kids out to be like a Mexican cartel gang.

DANGER TO ARE KIDS REVEALED IN HERE BUT ONLY IF YOU BUY THIS NEWSPAPER FOR 50P WE PROMISE WE ARE NOT ONLY INTERESTED IN MONEY

>>54878
Being shocked by a teacher being murdered in her classroom makes you a sheeple?

>>54879

While unironically using the word "sheeple" does immediately make that poster a dullard of the highest order, I think it's safe to assume that this is just the media reporting on what they feel is in vogue right now.

>>54877
Heavily reporting it, 24-hour rolling news, sensationalising it, etc, all mean that someone out there will try to kill their teacher, either for fame, or just a copycat crime.

>>54881

https://www.youtube.com/v/PezlFNTGWv4

>>54882

Not to get too off topic but is anyone else getting annoyed the by media's insistence of referring to that escaped prisoner as the "Skullcracker"?

>>54883
Yeah, it makes him sound like a fucking Spider-man villain.

>>54877
Well whether the media reports are true or not I'd now be terrified if I was a teacher, poor bastards. Coming into work worried that your charges are planning to kill you the first chance they get to look cool to their mates.

>>54885
>Coming into work worried that your charges are planning to kill you the first chance they get to look cool to their mate
Nothing new there. You know that NQT stands for Newly Qualified Target, right?

>>54877

That's actually an interesting thing to bring up. As a Leeds resident, I'm familiar with the school it happened at (our lass went there as a yoof), and putting all the sensationalism aside, it's really no susprise that it happened. I won't go as far as to say "it was the teacher's fault" or that they "had it coming to them";but this kid was clearly in desperate emotional need, and was ignored, by a staff who were and are wholly unprepared and unable to deal with or provide help.

Of course, the kids are little shits too and this should be taken into account. They have no respect for authority, because there is no authority for them to respect; and even if there was, you cannot blame them for rebelling against it when we live in times of such blatant, superficial social manipulation and power playing. If I recall correctly this was at one of the east end schools, and east Leeds really is a shithole- It made the news because it was a teacher, but around that end of town stabbings are hardly uncommon.

>>54887
>we live in times of such blatant, superficial social manipulation and power playing
Elaborate please.

>>54887
>I'm familiar with the school it happened at (our lass went there as a yoof)
>If I recall correctly this was at one of the east end schools

Well are you familiar with the school or not?

>>54890

As in I've heard about the place and what it was like, but I've never been there, so I don't know its precise whereabouts.

>>54889

>Elaborate please.

Do I have to? Go watch the telly for a bit. Turn AdBlock off on your browser, then go see what Facebook is like. A generation is growing up with this shite constantly, relentlessly bombarded into their eyes and ears.

>>54891
You never went to your daughter's school?

>>54893

"Our lass" means girlfriend, you fucking southern poof.

>>54893

If she's ours then have her make the rounds.

>Teachers in England work longer hours than the rest of the world but spend less time in the classroom than in other countries, says a major international study.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/education/education-news/teachers-in-england-work-longer-hours-than-the-rest-of-the-world--but-not-in-the-classroom-9562812.html

Glorious bureaucracy.

deport all the poofaces... also make the chavs learn stuff. Keep them in forced education camps if necessary

They've named the lad who killed his teacher in Leeds.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/03/ann-maguire-killer-named-will-cornick-judge-lifts-reporting-restrictions

He looks uncannily like Maxine Carr, I wonder if Ian Huntley knocked her up in between killing children.

>>58577
Given that a psychiatric evaluation judged him as in 'sound mind', there must be a motive that they're not making public. Of course it's extremely unlikely that whatever Maguire did deserved what happened but we can't exactly learn anything without confronting it. Maybe it has something to do with his diabetes diagnosis?

>>58580
I don't think you fully understand what "sound mind" means. They apparently found him to have an adjustment disorder and psychopathic tendencies. Sound mind just means he is rational enough to be responsible for his actions, it doesn't mean he is completely stable.

>>58580

More likely that they wanted to make an example of him in an attempt to stop any other violent little chav brats getting ideas.

From what I've heard the schools in Leeds itself, not the relatively nice suburban schools people like us went to, are proper battlefields. You have to imagine, these are the schools responsible for raising the younglings of those overweight bald blokes who throw bricks at away fans on the motorway from Cottingley bridge. I've heard stories about supply teachers jumping out of third floor windows to avoid getting stabbed, and whilst I'm sure the claim is exaggerated, it wouldn't surprise me if it were true for a school in east end park.

What strikes me is the pointlessness of his sentence from a rational point of view. If he's getting a life sentence at the age of 16, why the fuck not just kill him? His life has scarcely begun anyway. If and when he gets out, he's going to be completely and utterly useless to society at large. Hence why I can only conceive that he is being made an example of.

>>58600
The accounts I've heard have said he was a quiet swot rather than a chav.

I don't think 20 years is unduly harsh. This was a premeditated attack in front of his classmates, he's shown no remorse (he winked before he did it and has subsequently said he's proud of killing her) and if he wasn't stopped he was planning on also murdering other teachers, including one who was pregnant. From what I've read he'd been planning this for 3 years, most of which time was spent trying to sow enough seeds to convince people he was insane so that he could get away with it.

>>58601

That for me is the worrying aspect of his sentence. The combination of his high intelligence, premeditation, his calmness during and after the attack and his lack of remorse is strongly suggestive of antipersonal or narcissistic personality disorder.

I have a sneaking suspicion that his defence played for a criminal sentence rather than an incapacity plea, on the basis that he'll probably get out of prison but he might never be released from a psychiatric hospital.

>>58601

>The accounts I've heard have said he was a quiet swot rather than a chav.

Yeah, but it's not other kids like him they are worried about, and in any case I doubt the authorities really see much of a distinction. It's those spud-headed types hanging around behind the bike sheds going "ERE MAN IF THAT FUCKIN POOF GOT AWAY WIV IT IM GUNER FUCKIN SHANK MR. JENKINS ON DOUBLE GEOGRAPHY, FUCKIN SWEAR DOWN MUSH"

>>54887

Thank you for opening up this line of inquiry. I want to know why the kid actually did it, not to validate his actions but rather to understand what was going on in his head, maybe to better address the underlying issues that would make murder an option in someones mind at all.

It's clear he's been sent away and publically named as a matter of deterrence, but I can't help but think this will mean the facts of the individual case will be glossed over. Any useful observations that could be made from this will be swept up in hysteria directed at some generalised, scary youth.

Last time I checked, violent crime and homicides were steadily falling around England and Wales, meaning it should draw all the more attention to what's going on in schools when something like this happens.

>>58604
>I want to know why the kid actually did it

For one reason or another he had a pathological dislike of her. He seems to have flipped once he was diagnosed with diabetes; the army wouldn't accept him and he felt that he'd fail when he went to college. He either made her the focal point of all his anger or he just didn't care about the consequences of it.

>>58605
I saw somewhere also something about him wanting to be sent to jail for the rest of his life, because it meant he would never have to work or have any responsibilities.

Some interesting commentary here:

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014/nov/07/psychopath-test-will-cornick-rurik-jutting

>>58608

I don't mean to sound glib, but that confirms some of what I would instinctively believe. Terms like sociopath and psychopath are being bandied about without considering what preceded the event. It seems likely to me that he planned not just the killing, but also the attitude he would take toward it to suit his purpose. I think it's possible for anyone to do something terrible calmly, maybe even with something approaching a clear conscience, if they feel that they have no other bearable choice. I'd be inclined to say he can show no remorse about his actions because maybe the prospect of living a responsible life was scarier to him than the few seconds it would take to attack someone he hated.

It's silly to assume any pathology based on the act of someone who was clearly hopeless to the point of giving away his future. Normal people can lose their capacity for empathy, or deliberately do away with it so that they can take an easier (if stupider/selfish/more reckless) option, it doesn't necessarily make them psychopaths.

I wish newspapers and media would lay off easy associations when reporting real life events, the event is disturbing enough without bringing external dramatic imagery into play (the 'psycho murderer').

Anyone who saw my last version of this post, I deleted the unrelated stuff. I got some of the details of that linked story wrong myself, and didn't want to hash up the other bits of my post/the thread. Apologies for anyone I might have misled.

>A much-improved Middle Rasen school has missed out on top grades because government school inspectors says its pupils are not multi-cultural enough.

>Ofsted denied the school a 1 or ‘outstanding’ rating saying: “Pupil’s cultural development is limited by lack of first-hand experience of the diverse make-up of modern British society.”

http://www.marketrasenmail.co.uk/news/education/education-news/school-penalised-by-ofsted-for-being-too-british-1-6425433

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/11240700/School-marked-down-by-Ofsted-for-being-too-white.html

All hail the glorious enrichment process.

>>58723
Except this seems to be yet another case of the red-tops misquoting a report and spinning it to fit the "PC Gone Mad" narrative. I can't see anything from Ofsted that actually said or implied that in the article.

>>58723
I don't see how this is a problem. Insular communities breed intolerance. Polling shows concern about immigration in an area is on a broadly consistent basis inversely proportional to how much immigration it has actually experienced.

>>58724
>“Pupil’s cultural development is limited by lack of first-hand experience of the diverse make-up of modern British society.”

>“The large majority of pupils are White British. Very few are from other ethnic groups, and currently no pupils speak English as an additional language” said Ofsted. To improve further Ofsted said the school needed to: “Extend pupils’ understanding of the cultural diversity of modern British Society by creating opportunities for them to have first-hand interaction with their counterparts from different backgrounds beyond the immediate vicinity.”

Seems like cultural marxism to me.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/12/london-gcse-success-ethnic-diversity-schools

>>58728
> understanding of the cultural diversity of modern British Society by creating opportunities for them to have first-hand interaction with their counterparts from different backgrounds beyond the immediate vicinity.”
Looks like the people in charge of Rochdale have been given new jobs...

>>58731
>The London Challenge, a policy launched by the Labour government in 2003 which brought a massive injection of cash...

I'd expect this to play a part, especially as the funding per pupil is far greater in London than the rest of the country.

I just find it utterly ridiculous that a school in an area that is ~97% white has been marked down for lacking diversity, regardless of whether enriched schools perform better. There's not a great deal they can do about it.

>>58736
>I just find it utterly ridiculous that a school in an area that is ~97% white has been marked down for lacking diversity
As do I, which makes me sceptical that it even happened that way.

>>58736
They're right to flag it up though, I grew up in Lincolnshire and it's full of racist tossers. Even tokenistis efforts at reminding people browns exist will go a long way. >>58727 is right.

>>58739

> which makes me sceptical it even happened that way.

A very similar thing happened in my kids school. On the face of it our rural village primary school, which is 99% white, was given a "Grade 3" - needs improvement - on Diversity. Most other criteria were "Grade 1" - outstanding.

An large element of the parents thought this was unfair and thought the school was marked down for being "too white" and the OFSTED report even said this in black and white. I too became sceptical at this point, so I read the assessment for myself.

What it actually said was that, simply because the school was predominantly white, it should still make teaching around diversity and different cultures a priority. Which I tended to agree with. Whatever your view on the right or wrong of teaching around diversity - if it's on the curriculum it should be taught. If it's not being taught, or given a very low weight then the school should rightly be marked down on this.

Not quite the same thing as being "marked down for being white", I'm sure you'll agree.

>>58727
The definition of indoctrination and the will for re-education.

>>58740
>I grew up in Lincolnshire

Please tell me you're not that lad from around Boston who thinks the majority of our economy is made up of vegetable pickers and also has a penchant for being racist against the indigenous population.

>>58742
>Not quite the same thing as being "marked down for being white", I'm sure you'll agree.

I'd say it is; their school has been penalised for not having a diverse ethnic mix of pupils. Would it be fair for an enriched school to get a better rating solely because they have kids from different races/countries regardless of what they actually teach about other cultures?

>>58744
Er, no. You're a bit of a mong. That's like arguing against the teaching of science because it effects the number of reported miracles, or something.

>>58745

I would agree it's more difficult for predominantly white schools to get first hand access to other cultures and therefore more difficult to teach it. But it just means they would have to make more effort to do so. Not that they are being penalised for being white.

The school has other advantages due to it's demographic make-up. This is one of those things where it balances out the other way (swings/roundabouts/rough/smooth).

It's at this point in my argument my liberal guilt gets the better of me. The idea of organising a field trip so the kids can "go have a look at some muslims" - like some sort of zoo trip - fills me with abject horror.

>>58748
>The school has other advantages due to it's demographic make-up.

Name them. Also, wrong itz.

>The idea of organising a field trip so the kids can "go have a look at some muslims" - like some sort of zoo trip - fills me with abject horror.

There's usually a couple of stories each year in local papers about primary schools organising trips to mosques and the like and their parents kicking up a stink and not letting them go.

>>58748
Oh no it's not like that. At my middle class Tory Christian North London primary school, we used to have priests coming in to talk to us about religion and how groovy Jesus was during assemblies all the time. Why not rabbis, imams, Hare Krishnas? The more the merrier (i.e. less racist).

We did Diwali too which was great, being a festival around light and colour you can imagine the possibilities for primary school activities.

>>58745
>their school has been penalised for not having a diverse ethnic mix of pupils.
See me after class, lad.

>>58750
Is Diwali the one where we got to put cocktail sticks in an orange and then skewer sweets onto it?

Hang on, that might actually be Christmas.

>>58747
No, not at all. You've taken something you believe to be 'the right way', or 'what people should think' and decided it should be transplanted on to everybody else.

>>58755
I'm sorry, Nige, but some things aren't debatable. If you grow up only knowing white faces, you will be suspicious of ones of different colours, especially in such a jingoistic country as ours. I don't care how much you call me the lefty PC brigade or claim this is 'indoctrination' in the multikult.

Whatever happened to people going on about the multikult on /pol/, by the way? Was it just Simon and he's now finally fucked off?

>>58756
>>If you grow up only knowing white faces, you will be suspicious of ones of different colours,
so?

>>58753
https://www.youtube.com/v/asB9Lj5wJ6M

>>58749

OK - so from the top of my head there are two main advantages of being all white/middle class:

(1) English as a first language for the vast majority of pupils makes teaching easier (given the teacher is an English speaker).

(2) Generally it's a reasonably well off area - so there are good support networks and facilities out of the school to encourage learning.

..as I said, i believe there are also disadvantages. Lack of cultural diversity would be one of them.

>>58756
>I'm sorry, Nige, but some things aren't debatable
And that's the major problem with your attitude.

>>58762
This. The left don't realise that their attitude has done more to further UKIP's cause than any UKIP promotional campaign could ever dream of.

>>58772
N1 Nige.

>>58780
N1 Russell.

Old post but it backs up >>58762

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/has-ukips-success-in-the-european-elections-proved-that-democracy-is-a-flawed-way-to-choose-a-government-9449582.html

>>58804
The good old "wrong sort of democracy" that the left love to bleat on about when people don't do what they want, probably best evidenced recently when the BNP won two EU seats in 2009.

"You're free to do what you want, as long as it's something I agree with."

>>58804

It is the kind of article that makes you rest your head in your hands. But I have to admit I kind of think there's a shred of truth in it.

Is democracy not the tyranny of the majority? The majority are quite thick after all. That's how we ended up with all the nanny-state bullshit we have in this country, like needing ID to buy kitchenware. Think of the children etc.

>>58807
>Is democracy not the tyranny of the majority?
Only if you use outdated electoral methods like FPTP rather than preferential or proportional methods.

The wrong sort of democracy is the best kind, if it pisses off a good chunk of people it must be the right thing to do.

>>58809

I agree, people a fools. We should just elect the polar opposite of whoever "wins" the election.

Anarchists if the Tories win or I dunno', someone halfway competent if Labour get in.

>>58807
>The majority are quite thick after all

Do you mean 'quite thick' or 'do things that I disagree with'?

>>58815
Not him, but empirical evidence suggests that the general public is pretty thick. See e.g. the AV referendum, people voting UKIP unironically, the Ched Evans petition, etc.

>>58818
Are you saying AV was a good idea?

>>58831
Are you saying FPTP was a good idea?

>>58831

There is an enormous body of mathematical theory regarding voting systems. AV is provably more representative than FPTP. There are better options than AV, but AV is an improvement over FPTP in several important criteria. The only developed countries still using FPTP are the UK, the US and Canada; The rest of the developed world uses a more representative voting system.

Shout out to the Schultze method massive, represent(ative democracy).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voting_system#Evaluating_voting_systems_using_criteria
http://www.idea.int/publications/esd/index.cfm

>>58834
Better is somewhat relative, though I assume you mean in terms of democratic function.

>>58835
Subjective rather than relative, I mean.

>>58836
Sort of. There are objective measures, though it will depend on which ones you use and how you use them. If we work on the basis that more representative is better, then preferential voting is better than non-preferential, and non-plural is better than plural. If you're the Conservatives or the UUP, then it would be the other way round.

>>58815

The majority obviously aren't 'quite thick', as by definition they are merely average. It would be factually accurate to say that most people overestimate their own intelligence, which is a very real problem. We all need to be more willing to defer to expertise, and to be prepared to say "I don't know, go and ask someone who has done some research on the subject". We're generally very bad at recognising when political problems are purely a matter of opinion, and when they are a matter of fact; Some issues have no 'best' solution and require us to balance the preferences of many diverse groups, but some really can be solved with a solution that is optimal for everyone involved.

In particular, I think we have a major problem regarding mathematical and statistical illiteracy that goes right to the top. A modern economy presents us with many problems of such complexity that intuition and 'common sense' are worse than useless. We expect far too much from our politicians, and would pillory any minister who said something like "to be frank, I don't understand this at all, but I have spoken to many leading academics in the field and they all suggest this solution". We have a deep and self-defeating distrust of expertise and specialism; We unquestioningly accept the idea that someone with no training in medicine or epidemiology can run the Ministry of Health, yet we still expect them to have all the answers and to act decisively and unerringly. We see doubt as a sign of weakness, rather than as a sign of due caution and rationality.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illusory_superiority

>>58832
No, they're both shit. If ZaNu Liebour get into power is voting reform on the agenda?

>>58837
You don't have to advocate a major party to advocate FPTP.

>>58838
Be fair lad, the behaviours you've described, whilst accurate, could all also be described as 'quite thick'. People may not be quite as clever as they think they are, and I've no way of knowing how bright the lad that first said it is, but a genuinely clever person would probably be justified in describing most people as quite thick.

How geniuses restrain themselves from going on frustration-induced killing sprees is beyond me, frankly...

>>58840
... but it helps. Mostly because nobody else stands to benefit.

>>58844

>How geniuses restrain themselves from going on frustration-induced killing sprees is beyond me, frankly...

Social isolation and strong drink, mainly.

>>58848
Amen!

>>58838

It's possible for the majority to have below average intelligence, if you believe that intelligence is some sort of homogenised, measurable statistic, if, for example, the majority has the same intelligence and a minority has significantly higher.

IT'S LEAGUE TABLE MADNESS.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-31023685

Schools are increasingly struggling to recruit senior teachers, while at the same time finding that newly qualified teachers are ill prepared to start working in the classroom, a leading teaching union has warned.

Almost 62% of school leaders are struggling to recruit teachers on the upper pay scale, according to a survey of headteachers, with 14% reporting they have been unable to recruit deputy heads and 20% unable to fill posts for assistant heads.

The survey, carried out for the National Association of Head Teachers and published to coincide with its annual conference in Liverpool, came as schools are seeing an exodus from the profession due to concerns about workload, pay and conditions.

http://www.theguardian.com/education/2015/may/03/schools-unable-to-recruit-senior-teachers-says-union

ITZ?

>>61179
Only an idiot would want to work as a teacher or anywhere near a school.

>>61191

As someone considering doing just that, I would be interested in hearing your reasoning.

>>61191
An idiot or a nonce.

>>61192
Kids are cunts, their parents are cunts, the media are constantly making out that you're a cunt, politicians are cunts, your headmaster will probably be a cunt, you'll be drowning in paperwork and you'll have no life during term time.

There is literally no reason to be a teacher unless it is your last resort.

>>61197
Not to mention shit pay for all those hours. A teaching job should be a last, last, very last resort. I would much rather join the army than be a teacher.

Something like 40% of new teachers quit the profession within the first five years. That's saying something.

I feel sorry for people in this country with kids who are not rich enough to send them to private school.

>>63402
I know. I too was annoyed at not being rich enough to send my parents to private school.

>>63402
Move to Singapore. Abandon ship while you still can.

>>52943
>>63402
Any reason you've decided to repeat yourself? I know it's about 17 months inbetween posts, but come on.

>>63415
Morning, Postmaster.

All failing schools to be academies under new bill

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-32978355

Academies suck up the LEA budget, leading to other schools failing and being forced to turn into academies. Before we know it the whole school system will be in private hands.

>>63576
WHAT IS WRONG WITH HER FACE. JESUS CHRIST.

>>63576
Well done lads. You voted Tory, reap what you sew.

>>63580
That's Brooker in a wig, surely.

>>63581
> sew
Lad!

>>63576
That is the smartest way yet to semi-privatise shite. I'm impressed.

>>63580
She is very ugly.

>>63586
You pedantric sew-and-sew.

>>63581
About time too.

>>63580

Is cheating rife in are schools?

http://www.theguardian.com/teacher-network/2015/jun/27/secret-teacher-we-help-pupils-to-but-how-long-before-its-exposed

I can't remember any from school. Apart from maybe German oral, where you was allowed to write out the answers to every question you'd be asked in shorthand and take it in with you.

Every school in the country should become an academy, David Cameron says in a move that would represent the most significant reform of the education system since the introduction of the national curriculum.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/david-cameron/11804365/david-cameron-british-schools-academy.html

I wonder what proportion of schools in this country will be in private hands by the end of this government.

>>64809
Woe should society ever get a say in how things are run.

>>64815
Society has a say in how things are run, except in academies, where the company running it has the say in how they're run.

>>64819
Society has no say, stop pretending some bod in the DoE is society. My son goes to an academy and it's excellent. They're a firmly liberal idea. People don't like them because they're associated with the Tories, which leads to the death of debate. The guy who heads it is huge in education in my local area and a great guy to boot.

>>64820
>Society has no say, stop pretending some bod in the DoE is society
No. You stop pretending that the local electorate is not society.

>My son goes to an academy and it's excellent.
Your rationalisation is showing.

>>64820
>My son goes to an academy and it's excellent.
?

>>64820
I think you might be getting confused. Academies are the ones run by the "DoE" (by which I assume you mean DfE), whereas other state schools are run by LEAs, which are accountable to local people rather than distant ministers. Academies were originally a Labour thing - the one everyone associates with the Tories would be free schools, which are independent from both local and central control, but for the most part have tended to be awful.

In short, 2/10 SEE ME.

>>64823
A couple of those Labour academies opened in my city. A few years down the line there was some surprise that taking kids in a failing school and putting them in a shiny new building, in the same sink estates, ended up with similar results. In other words, you cannot polish a turd.

Then again, that's Labour all over. They demolished loads of houses in the city and started a big programme of replacing them with new housing, when the originals weren't that bad and just needed renovation which would have been a fraction of the cost, only for the money to run out so even now there's still large swathes of wasteland.

I'm glad we now live in a society where free enterprise is put back in the hands of the people.

>The first British grammar school in 50 years is expected to be approved on Thursday. The long-awaited school in Sevenoaks in Kent is due to be given the go-ahead by education secretary Nicky Morgan.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/11932527/First-grammar-school-in-50-years-to-be-approved.html

>>65991
>The first British grammar school in 50 years
Incorrect.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lumen_Christi_College,_Derry

>>65993
It would still be the first in Britain. Not that a Catholic school in Derry would want to be regarded as British anyway.

>>65997
The first in Great Britain, not Britain.

There's a prod school in Antrim built a scant 41 years ago anyway.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antrim_Grammar_School

If you want to tell these lads they're not British, you'll be lookin a dig in the bake.

>>65999
>The first in Great Britain, not Britain
Lad. Don't make me post that video. Not here, of all places.

>>66005
Great Britain refers to the largest island in the British isles. "British" refers to "of the United Kingdom".

>>66025
>"British" refers to "of the United Kingdom".
It may alternatively refer to "of Great Britain".